[✗] Ghost-Graven Rewrite: Haunts

[ski_king3 0]

Well, I'd been working on a long response that seemed to get deleted, but I have a few main issues that I at least want to bring up.

 

For one, the old ghost lore allowed ghosts to be played in a variety of ways. You could become a poltergeist, which is on the spookier side of things (not as spooky as this current iteration, but they were those who rejected their death, grew angry, and haunted others), and specters, who accepted their deaths and pursued their existence as a ghost in an entirely different manner. Unfortunately, there is no substitute for specters in this lore. This is my biggest issue. Most ghosts on LotC aren't played as poltergeists (or what this lore makes ghosts). That's not to say they're not interesting, but they're a niche, and make the scope of playing a ghost extremely narrow. Ghost characters aren't all that common, but I suspect you'd make a number of them unplayable without including something very similar to specters, a ghost that is what we conceptualize as a ghost (corporeal, can turn invisible, floats) which doesn't seek to haunt others.

 

My second issue is with episodic and eternal obsessions. This might just be an issue with semantics more than anything, but this change seems to greatly narrow the scope of what ghosts are able to pursue. Does it need to be a very explicit, specific single thing, like saying goodbye to their son or finishing their life's work, or can it be something more vague? My hope is that creativity and flexibility is allowable here, and if so, then my concerns aren't well-founded, but I want to understand better.

 

My third issue is really just something I think the current ghost lore does really well that this lore lacks, as I think the three stages of progression for ghosts is really cool and something lost here. To start out wandering, unsure of your death, only to then have it confirmed and progress a step further, and then choose to accept or reject it... it's super interesting, and I would argue offers a great deal more compelling RP for ghosts than what you'd find here.

 

 

If it's not clear, my chief concern here is keeping some of the better aspects of the current ghost lore, like the flexibility and interesting progression still a part of being a ghost. I admittedly know a lot less about gravens, and have less feedback to offer for those, but I hope you'll still take this feedback into account. Personally, I've had plans to play my ghost character for a long time, and while it's a bit of a temporary thing, it's something I've put a lot of time and thought into. However, with this rewrite as it is, I definitely cannot play that character as it stands, or would have to do so in a manner that eliminates all the motivation for making him a ghost in the first place. I understand that it's self-serving, but I do think it's the job of the Lore Team and those who submit rewrites for lore to take note of those who actually utilize it and ensure that the rewrites don't harm them without cause, and I firmly believe that this rewrite does just that.

 

 

Also, I am curious what exactly warranted this rewrite. The current ghost lore is good (I don't know about gravens, again), and there is no consolidation here since both ghosts and gravens exist. All this seems to do is shift them from ghastly creatures to dark, spooky ones, and I don't see a ton of benefit to that.

[drfate786 1639]

The whole eternal and episodic terms need to be defined. If a character were a serial killer and had an obsession with murder then he'd likely come back as a haunt to continue his spree of murders unchecked, anything can be classified as an eternal obsession and if a ghost cannot be permakilled then anyone can use them to take vengeance on their murderers. 

[drfate786 1639]

On 3/28/2017 at 6:40 AM, Jentos said:

I was preparing myself to turn one of my characters into a ghost, but honestly I don't agree with these changes, if ghosts are stuck to be played in the same area all the time, I doubt anyone will play them for long, same with the PK ritual.

 

It would be better if the ghost could haunt a specific object instead and possess whoever carries it. IE, a blade or doll. 

[Jentos 6848]

2 minutes ago, drfate786 said:

 

It would be better if the ghost could haunt a specific object instead and possess whoever carries it. IE, a blade or doll. 

Yeah, it was mostly just the pk of the ghosts via rituals that I dislike, I can very well imagine clerics moving from point a to point b, killing ghost after ghost. Maybe just banish them for a month or something?

[drfate786 1639]

Just now, Jentos said:

Yeah, it was mostly just the pk of the ghosts via rituals that I dislike, I can very well imagine clerics moving from point a to point b, killing ghost after ghost. Maybe just banish them for a month or something?

 

Well the Clerics have to know that a ghost is present, I think Zarsies should implement what the producers of Supernatural did.

 

Ghosts should be able to manifest wherever their remains can be found or at the site of death. So if they're exorcised from their death site then the ghost can manifest at their grave. Also, if the ghost let's say used his blood to make a painting, then the exorcist would have to know that said painting exists and perform the exorcism on that too. Basically, he should make it so multiple exorcisms would be required in order to destroy a ghost or at the very least would require the destruction of everything made from the person's remains. 

[Jentos 6848]

Just now, drfate786 said:

 

Well the Clerics have to know that a ghost is present, I think Zarsies should implement what the producers of Supernatural did.

 

Ghosts should be able to manifest wherever their remains can be found or at the site of death. So if they're exorcised from their death site then the ghost can manifest at their grave. Also, if the ghost let's say used his blood to make a painting, then the exorcist would have to know that said painting exists and perform the exorcism on that too. Basically, he should make it so multiple exorcisms would be required in order to destroy a ghost or at the very least would require the destruction of everything made from the person's remains. 

oh wait, nvm, expulsion was removed, seems better now!

[Zarsies 6025]

16 hours ago, ski_king3 said:

-snip snap-

 

I'm taking everything into consideration; this lore is meant to please players and if you aren't pleased then the lore isn't doing its job. I'm self-denying this lore because I need more time to work out the kinks brought up, something I went without before posting which I needed.

[GodEmperorFlam 3447]

This Lore has been self-denied per OP's request. Topic moved to Denied Lore forum.