[✗] Clerical Wards [Re-written]

[E__V__O 1984]

I like these wards.

[Bvie 1754]

2 hours ago, Lhindir_ said:

> Sutica

 

Dunno what you're trying to imply. We haven't used wards for months, nor did we ever simply negate magic. 

[DrakeHaze. 2479]

Wait there was a clerical ward feedback thread? Sounds familiar.

[kender123 11]

I support this movement. +1

 

Great job Farryn at bringing something more interesting for the clerics. :D

[Gone 868]

11 hours ago, Farryn said:

• The Revelation ward affects dark beings hidden by dark ways, such as wraiths through Wraith Husking, Izkuthii, Frost Witches etc through disabling their disguises or forcing their true form out.  The dark beings will have at least three to four emotes to get back into their disguises to give time to others around them to react.
  • Izkuthii -  Their disguise will simply melt away, revealing their true appearance.

 

Uh, Izkuthii powers are not Undead, not tainted, not corrupted or anything that clerical magic would bother. Heck the current "final form" is a spectral appearance that's literally described as a blob of deific energy (the Izkuthii patron being a Daemon). So I don't see why a cleric ward would suddenly have any effect upon Izkuthii when clerical magic on its own does nothing to the creatures.

 

On top of that the Izkuthii "disguise" is merely an illusion no matter what form they are in. So would the cleric ward affect other types of illusions such as a sensory illusion charm? If not then why is the Izkuthii illusion being treated differently? How would a ward tell the difference when it has no taint, corruption, etc to pick up upon?

[Farryn 812]

18 hours ago, AngelsCrossHalcyon said:

Mm, yes. I can choose to walk through the ward and be completely revealed as a Dark Artist, or I can choose to blatantly attack something stationed right at a city gate that would only be the target of a Dark Artist. The only counter also gives cause for me to be utterly obliterated by Omnipresent Guard Squad.

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There is the option of being sly - have another person break the ward for you so they get in trouble and you can easily walk in, maybe  lie and tell them the ward is of evil holy magic and have them break the ward in their anger, etc. Or perhaps work with a group to get the ward removed, find another way into the city, or enter the city when there isn't a guard in the city and enter the city, then re-enter your disguise before anyone sees (will admit - you will need a good amount of luck there).  Although there is the option of wearing a simple hood or cloak and enter the city - the ward only changes your body, not your clothing so you can still conceal yourself and buy yourself time to enter a city and get your disguise back up. It only depends if the players in said city will stop you or not.

 

There is no shame in opening up to other methods to remove the ward, even if your character is not that fully sly or wanting to get others into trouble - I am sure there would be someone who would be willing to take down the ward so you can get in. You don't have to automatically be the one to attack the ward but you must be patient and perhaps work with others to get the ward down, merely being the informant who goes "There is a Cleric Ward in Linandria, can you perhaps take it down?" is an important role and helps to assist those who do want to destroy wards know where to go. Besides - it may not be the revelation ward on the gate. It could be the Disarm Ward that disables dark magic but still allows you to go in disguised. One way or another - this will still provide you will roleplay, and in no shape or form is this new ward system meant to reduce roleplay by outright blocking you from entry.

 

However I do understand your concern and I have been trying to think of alternative solutions to this but it came out as null, my sincere apologies.

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20 hours ago, Abyssus said:

what keeps me from repeatingly running through the revelation ward zone by continually re-husking until it's drained of power? also if that happens do I just need to PM the ward creator to let them know that?

 

additionally what's the word on the need for region owner permission if you choose to destroy a ward? because that was a particular problem many people faced

 

also could've sworn we had a lot more disguising dark creatures/magics then just the three you listed, unless those were just for example purposes

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First - the fact that someone is bound to notice you and will stop you as you will have to take 3-4 emotes getting back into the body then running through the ward. Additionally, it can depend on the type of crystal used - If it's a small crystal, I estimate that you would have to run in and out of the ward at least ten times to be able to drain a small crystal of its power. The other two crystals will take a longer amount of time. as they hold more power than the smaller crystal .So at some point , your wraith will likely be caught by someone if the area has a lot of player activity. It is a major risk but it can be done if you time it just right. If you do somehow manage it (if any of you do, I'm buying you a drink), just alert the ward creator on it. Plus, doing such will only cause more harm to your wraith - I mean running in and out of a ward and constantly entering and exiting your husk will be definitely annoying.

 

Secondly - Seeing how there was issues regarding gaining a region owner's permission to remove the signs of a ward after clearly destroying its crystal, as well as many other issues involving region owners, I'd say with wards - you do not need the region owner's permission. Rather at least a heads up from the ward creator, screenshots to back up your ward breaking in the case someone does go against you on it, and a potential GM should you not have region perms. Personally, having to constantly get the region owner's permission to destroy something can be a hassle, especially when they are not online or if they are being bias. I do not want it to be such with wards, that are very simple and not very big in terms of impacting the whole city's build, so you can have the signs and crystal taken down as long as you have genuine RP that clearly shows you taking down the ward.

 

Lastly - The three shown were the three I was given when I asked many people what dark beings have disguises. However if there is more, please let me know so I can list them down - I don't want the revelation ward to be vague on who it can and cannot affect so it is important that all players who play dark beings know if their character will be affected or not. Those affected by the revelation ward will be listed in the red lines, so do keep an eye out.

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18 hours ago, SquirtGun said:

Quarantine is better off to just send a bird to an elder cleric and getting it cleaned up. The amount of reagents, time, and practice that a cleric would need to go through to set up such a ward to contain it is a bit asinine. By the time a cleric reaches tier 3 to be able to make a quarantine ward, they should be versed in purging such corruption as it's one of the easier and earlier things you teach, being down the healing path. If a cleric simply can't purge the land mass themselves, I doubt they could make a ward large enough to encompass it in the first place.

 

 

You are quite right that it is simpler to just send a bird to an elder cleric to fix the issue. However, if this is a form of taint that spreads faster than the average taint (ETs - never know when they'll throw in a rapid spread taint), chances are the taint will be at a size that not even a single elder cleric can fix. Furthermore, clerics can heal taint in a large area but if this taint is too big for that cleric to heal, they will at least have the option to prevent the taint from spreading into a further size that even an elder cleric cannot fix. I don't know how much taint a tier 5 cleric can destroy but I'm estimating it to be around 15-17 blocks worth of it. This ward would be used on taint that is larger than 17 blocks. Lastly, it will mean having to wait for that cleric in question to get online and from what I recall - skype / discord birds are now banned, therefore alerting them in skype is technically not allowed if this is say - an event. This is more or less a ward to help buy time for more clerics or allies to come in and assist.

 

However, considering it now - I am thinking of not restricting this ward to land taint but also allow this ward to block the spread plagues and illnesses as well, as the outbreak of plague can be dangerous and clerics should be given a way to halt such and safely neutralise it, one where they can safely surround the area and them themselves would not be placed at risk of catching it.

 

18 hours ago, SquirtGun said:

Revelation doesn't solve the issue that basically alerts the spooks that there's a spook nearby. It's basically the old ward where they'd get burned but instead of trying to hide it with a grunt, now they have no ability to prevent it. In this case, it'd just be better to be a wall before them that they couldn't cross.

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If that was the case of this ward being a wall - you will be restricting the dark users out of any city completely and not allowing them any form of roleplay aside from destroying the ward within the city because they cannot walk through. The wards here allow for the dark beings to still enter cities but at the risk of either being exposed. The Revelation Ward may seem like this restricting and blocking ward but it can be bypassed easily they can still get in by ensuring that they are covered (full armour is possible, as well as hooded, cloaked, or masked, etc) and that they easily slip away before someone notices them and half the time - the players around them may not even notice them. They are perfectly free to still go in but they have to take caution and use good timing to slip by. But to just have a ward that is an outright physical wall that stops them from entering completely is not fair on them if they are restricted to only destroying the ward because there's a wall of light preventing them from going into the city completely.

That is something I do not want to have these wards be based around - they were made to balance both communities, not just the clerical community.

 

The Revelation wards at least will be more noticeable and clear than the pain wards. Plus, if you notice that someone just sprinted into the gate and you know oocly alone that their character is a dark being who would be affected by the ward... but they aren't correctly emoting such, PM them and call them out. If they continue - get a GM involved or if really necessary, a ban report.

 

18 hours ago, SquirtGun said:

Disarm. It's the same damn thing as Devirad. The same damn thing with Fi' mages. It isn't fun to entirely counter or negate someone's magic. It's not fun or enjoyable for us when in Devirad, it's not fun or enjoyable for them. And if you can only create a single ward, your not going to limit it to a random jail cell, or take the time and energy to create such a ward while your prisoner is standing there twiddling thumbs waiting for you. 

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There are many differences between the Disarm Ward and Devirad's Ward - The Disarm Ward only covers a radius of seven blocks in front of it. Devirad's ability to dispel holy magic covers the whole entire city. If the dark being is out of this radius, they are completely free to cast magic - while we cannot cast anything within Devirad. The Disarm Ward can be destroyed by both magical and physical means and has a visable battery, Devirad's Ward cannot be destroyed by magical/physical means as I've seen no sign of what is powering their ward and I doubt holy users can take down this ward. Long story short - Devirad has the OP ward, Disarm isn't that OP. (Although from what I heard, the situation regarding Devirad's ward is changing)

 

Although I am going to up the number of wards a cleric can place up to three. However, you can create the ward in the prison temporarily while the guards are about to bring him in but the choice is the cleric's on if the ward will be needed or not. The wards require consideration so it is up to the cleric to judge if it's really worth putting up a Disarm Ward to stop the imprisoned dark mage from using his magic and escaping or not. I personally see this ward being used when a powerful dark mage is captured in a prison and the cleric needs to keep the ward up to ensure they do not break loose and wreck havoc.

 

18 hours ago, SquirtGun said:

Crystals are obnoxious and pointless if you have it that close to the ward. What's the point of setting up a powerful ward when anyone can dismantle it by destroying the crystal thats right in front of you. 

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I will be making the crystals much stronger so that the small crystals cannot be taken down in two hits. The crystals are purposefully made to stay in close radius to the ward so that there are no placing the crystal in a separate room where it is locked behind five iron doors and the dark users cannot get in. And what is the point of a powerful ward that anyone can destroy through destroying the crystal? Balance and fairness, that's what.

 

18 hours ago, SquirtGun said:

Wards were meant to be true barriers against the corrupted; shields to hold off attacks and protect towns while reinforcements gathered. They're not that anymore, and it may be good that they never become like that again. But this, this is complicated and (like Divine Wardenism) while it looks good on paper, has little to no practical use in RP outside of Revelation. Which causes the same issues we previously had. 

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The Revelation Wards provide a mean to uncover the darkness that can now hide against us, allowing us to allow uncover them and be able to tackle them instead of playing 'guess the dark being' and go off on rumours alone, as well as to be able to make a record of their true appearance and the disguises they can take on.

 

The Disarm wards now disable their magic within the seven square radius, allowing even towns to be able to defend themselves when there are no holy users around, as they can fight the mage with physical means without being in fear of being drained and so forth. Outside the radius, those who do not fight can run into the radius and they are protected by the ward's radius as the dark magic dissolves upon contact with the ward.

 

The current wards only cause burning pain but allows the dark being to walk clean into the city, enduring the pain and rarely giving a full indication of such. They do not fully reveal, they certainly do not protect against dark magic as dark mages can go through with pure ease, they do not hold off attacks, and protect towns.

 

If that is not the barriers against the corrupted, shields to hold off attacks, and protect towns while reinforcements gather, and you consider the current wards to demonstrate such - then I am genuinely surprised you fail to see the advantages.

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18 hours ago, Gladuos said:

I can see the real parallels in view here. Some people are so offended by wards that they don't wish for them to be effective at all, whereas some don't wish for change.

 

I think this is a fine enough rewrite for wards; gives different interesting ways to deal with dark magic or entities without outright removing their potential interaction. Mind you, current wards should be like walking through a wall of fire if you're a spook as far as I've read. That's going to reveal you, revelations remove the damaging part of that aspect. Seems like a real nerf than anything.

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That is the case with the current wards - they were just like walking through a wall of fire and would cause a clear amount of pain. However - the dark beings and entities who walked through these wards merely emoted twitching, faint groaning, or just didn't care about the pain at all, meaning it was hard for anyone within radius to tell if they are a dark being because of how low they emoted the pain. So why bother put in the pain aspect if half of the dark community do not roleplay out passing through the ward correctly? Plus many people disagreed that the pain should be that extreme - so the Revelation Ward was the alternative option to this issue. However if needed / requested by people, I can re-include the pain sensation for all the wards but also add a small guide part that explains options of what to emote when going through the wards and what to avoid emoting.

 

I tried considering an alternative to wards but the ones I considered resembled very closely to those of Ascended braziers and voidal wards - both of which I wanted to avoid doing. Therefore I settled on taking the old clerical wards and remodelling the system into something more workable for both light, grey, and dark communities.

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15 hours ago, DrakeHaze. said:

Wait there was a clerical ward feedback thread? Sounds familiar.

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Yep, it was a feedback thread I posted a while back that covered the clerical wards and that I was requesting feedback from the community. Thanks to everyone who posted, I got to understand the issues behind the current clerical wards and reworked the system based one their ideas and feedback. If you want to see the official post, it's right here. I'm a little sad I couldn't use some of the ideas people suggested but regardless, I appreciate that they did help give feedback, even if it was a little.

https://www.lordofthecraft.net/forums/topic/157594-clerical-wards-feedback-required/?page=3&tab=comments#comment-1491331

 

[Farryn 812]

13 hours ago, Aelsioln said:

 

Uh, Izkuthii powers are not Undead, not tainted, not corrupted or anything that clerical magic would bother. Heck the current "final form" is a spectral appearance that's literally described as a blob of deific energy (the Izkuthii patron being a Daemon). So I don't see why a cleric ward would suddenly have any effect upon Izkuthii when clerical magic on its own does nothing to the creatures.

 

On top of that the Izkuthii "disguise" is merely an illusion no matter what form they are in. So would the cleric ward affect other types of illusions such as a sensory illusion charm? If not then why is the Izkuthii illusion being treated differently? How would a ward tell the difference when it has no taint, corruption, etc to pick up upon?

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I nearly forgot about this.

I was informed that the Izkuthii were considered dark beings, hence why they were added here. However, thank you for clearing that up, Aelsioln, and I will remove the Izkuthii from the list. However if you know any dark beings that can take up dark disguises, can you please let me know? It's for the list and I would prefer to have all necessary dark beings down so the players know who and who isn't affected by the Revelation Ward.

[Sporadic 2799]

Okay so I read this in full but not the original. I'd be really grateful if you could save me some time and let me know which mechanics of the original warding were "clearly restricting roleplay". Also, could you let me know if the following inferences of mine are correct about the major changes of the rewrite:

 

I am guessing the recharge times of wards were increased to the current 1 hour - 4 weeks based on ward tier and crystal size, which refers to clerics not having to continuously put up wards. Furthermore you mention

 

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and allowing the dark some solutions to taking the wards down

 

I assume this means the possibility of physically attacking the ward structure (through X emotes), although this seems very straightforward to the point that I'd expect antagonists to have been doing this anyway, so maybe I'm wrong.

Also, could a ward theoretically be fully behind the gate which it powers?

[Farryn 812]

7 hours ago, Sporadic said:

Okay so I read this in full but not the original. I'd be really grateful if you could save me some time and let me know which mechanics of the original warding were "clearly restricting roleplay". Also, could you let me know if the following inferences of mine are correct about the major changes of the rewrite:

 

I am guessing the recharge times of wards were increased to the current 1 hour - 4 weeks based on ward tier and crystal size, which refers to clerics not having to continuously put up wards. Furthermore you mention

 

 

I assume this means the possibility of physically attacking the ward structure (through X emotes), although this seems very straightforward to the point that I'd expect antagonists to have been doing this anyway, so maybe I'm wrong.

Also, could a ward theoretically be fully behind the gate which it powers?

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From what I have been told and seen, the current wards prevented dark beings from entering cities and having roleplay within such city. I'm not fully sure what mechanics but I predict it may have been the pain sensation they felt when they passed through the wards, or it may have been that taking down a ward previously required region owner permission and having to wait on the ward creator to potentially emote the ward from time to time. Additionally, there was no direct battery for the dark users to aim for to be able to destroy the ward - they would have to destroy the ward through using Fi magic or dark magic alone to do so.  Lastly - there was the fact of when a ward breaks, the dark expects to have a time period when the ward is down and they have a long enough time to go into the city, but why bother take down a ward when all it takes is a bird to the ward maker and boom - the ward is back up an hour after being destroyed. That gives the dark beings no time to savour their victory on destroying the ward and to be able to carry out the effects of the ward being down. It also makes the clerics appear bad oocly and it is unfair on the dark groups. The dark community clearly may have felt a bias there and thus did not bother taking down the wards because of the hassle of getting permission oocly, as well as that they needed the ward creator to get on, and the fact their efforts would be futile as a new ward would be right back where it was an hour after destroying the previous ward.

 

There's also the clerics who felt restricted by these wards as well - as they held no exact purpose aside from burning dark beings who walked in. It could not reveal disguised dark beings, could not help block land and air taint, and could not stop dark magic as that's what weakened the ward. The only roleplay a cleric gained from this was creating the ward over and over and it got exhausting, especially when knowing that the ward is not helping at all with the cleric's mission. Therefore Revelation, Quarantine, and Disarm Wards were made to give the wards more purpose, assist the clerics and cities in finding out dark beings, preventing the spread of taint, and being able to serve as a shield against dark magic (clerical magic cannot fully affect a dark mage because their body is that as a descendant but the magic itself can still be harmed by holy magic.) Furthermore, setting up a ward before wasn't really that exciting or unique, and with having to replace a destroyed ward with a new ward, it would feel much like a chore. Therefore I added a new way to form the wards that should be a little more interesting for the clerics.

 

Crystal sizes and recharge times do not really depend on tiers completely, as a tier 1 cleric can still place some small amount of light into a large crystal but it would nearly drain them of energy completely. As time goes on, the cleric becomes able to place more light into a crystal. Therefore when a new cleric is starting out on warding - a small crystal is the best choice to begin with before slowly moving onto the bigger crystals. A tier 5 cleric can fill a large crystal with relative ease but will still be quite exhausted, while they can fill a small and medium crystal with ease. I changed the one OOC week recharge time to that of depending on the crystal sizes because it was a pain to continuously go back and forth to recharge a crystal, especially when you are either on hiatus for a week or that you have to deal with a real life issue that is more important than real life. Of course, the more power crystal holds, the more time it can stay up for without charging. However - to balance the crystals, the more power a crystal holds, the weaker it is physical wise. Meaning that a cleric will have to be considerate on what crystal they use for what ward - whereas before, it was the bigger the ward, the more power needed to go into making it.

 

Yes, dark beings now have another solution to take down a ward but this also applies for also ordinary users who may not have a magic on them but clearly have an intention of taking down the ward. Beforehand - this was impossible for these users to attack the ward physically, the same for dark beings who had to rely on dark magic alone to do so. There have been instants of dark users attacking the wards once clerics began placing up these wards but since then, it has lessened because of the negative sides of the wards (see first paragraph).

 

A ward can be placed anywhere, including behind the gate of the city. Of course, this will make it hard for dark beings outside of the city to get to the ward, but that does not stop ordinary mortals from taking down the ward in the city. It'll be risky but once the ward is down, the 12 OOC hour cooldown is activated so the dark beings have time to enter the city and roleplay before a new ward is placed up.

 

 

[zaezae 1097]

The main problem with old wards was "attack them with dark power" or however it was worded. It just didn't make sense. Like I shoot some spook at the ward and it...stops? 

[Farryn 812]

2 hours ago, zaezae said:

The main problem with old wards was "attack them with dark power" or however it was worded. It just didn't make sense. Like I shoot some spook at the ward and it...stops? 

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That was the exact issue with the old wards - there was no full explanation of what happens exactly when dark magic meets the ward. Does it still stand? If so, how many hits can it endure? So on, so forth. In the end, it was left to the ward creator on how much damage the ward can take before smashing and sometimes there was some bias behind it. Ventusyr's lore didn't exactly explain wards in depth, despite the fact they should have.

 

With the new wards, there's now a limit as to how much attacks a ward's crystal can take, depending on the size of the crystal, and it does not require full dark magic to be able to take down a ward. However, if you would like a visual of what happens when attempting to take down one of these wards- the crystal would slowly begin to crack with each attack until it smashes with the correct amount of hits, then the ward itself will fizzle away and the ward is gone.

[GDPR 014 23]

can you shoot the crystal with a crossbow bolt and have the ward go bye bye 

[Farryn 812]

2 hours ago, The Fire Mind said:

can you shoot the crystal with a crossbow bolt and have the ward go bye bye 

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No. Crystals can not be one-shotted by crossbow, the bolt will likely cause a crack or two but it will require the required amount of hits as stated within the Crystal Sizes on the lore.

[FreeHongKong 934]

Thank you for submitting your piece! This is now under review and you can expect a verdict in roughly a week.

[FreeHongKong 934]

This Lore has been denied. Topic moved to Denied Lore forum.