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Ankalagon_

[✗] [In-game Ban] Ankalagon_ Appeal

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Posted (edited)

What kind of ban are you appealing?

In-game Ban

 

Minecraft Usernames

Ankalagon_

 

Reason for punishment

Meta Gaming

 

Players Involved

Ankalagon_

 

By your own understanding, why did you recieve a punishment?

Because I posted rally calls in our discord, for training, meetings, or meet ups with Imperial rallies, as nation leadership players do. I laid out two major points to my case for why the ban report shouldn't have gone through, the second of these two points was unfortunately ignored, or at least, not considered:
Point 1) Staff should not have the authority to ban players based on calls for players to just get online. This statement of mine was unfortunately quickly misinterpreted as "staff have no authority at all to ban evidence of meta gaming, such as calls to take a specific action OOCly without proper RP procedure." The reason I made this case at all (I didn't need to, I could have said very little in the ban report, and as ScreamingDingo said himself, there would have been no penalty because there is no evidence of meta gaming from the pings) was because more than anything I feared the precedent that the player XXX was trying to make through his ban report. As evidenced here:
"You’re lucky that the GMs don’t actively monitor your private conversations. Only occasionally, your private conversations in which you conspire to break the rules are screencapped and you are player reported." - XXX's comment in the ban report. This is a disturbing idea he continued to push having, while also making repeated and unecessary statements implying that a large playerbase like that of Curon actively 'conspire to break rules.' As if it were some sort of hobby.
"The precedent you encourage with Kosher and Ank’s rallies being horrible is a dangerous thing we cannot enforce." -ScreamingDingo's comment on XXX's statements.

2) I repeatedly made statements that there are logs of me, more than once, telling Snowgirl in game that "I cannot help unless she sends a legal bird." Then once she sent the bird, not only did I only rally IRP those around me, but I also msged her again, asking if she was sure that the bird was legal. We had IRP passed the bandits on the road only 15 minutes prior to this bird being sent, so of course we had an idea to go looking on the main roads. Players are banditted so often on the main roads, so much so that it stifles RP and new players in both the Empire and Curon have stated they don't want to log on anymore due to the sheer scale of it. This is the an equally important reason to why I should not have been banned and why I should be unbanned. It is completely out of my control, if a player MSG's me to hurry OOCly, or if they tell me falsely that their bird was legal. There is nothing illegal about being sent a bird. It is the responsibility of the player sending the bird to make sure it is a legal bird. Even so I asked OOCly if it was legal (multiple times), logs can easily be checked for this. And once again, we knew IRP where it was the last time we saw the bandits, because we passed them IRP along the road between Curon and the Empire, so of course rply that's where we decided to look. A GM, was present and went with us on his character, he himself advocated the point that we did indeed pass the bandits on the road IRP.

 

Edit: I include this section 2 here ^ because it was referenced as an example of my lack of understanding of what meta gaming is, in ScreamingDingo’s words, thus I am talking about it here. Referencing it both as part of the reason I was punished, and my defense for it.

 

Why should you be pardoned?

ScreamingDingo himself in the ban report states that the discord pings were legal, though he did warn that myself and the players of Curon should make sure that if a rally ping is posted from within RP reasons, they should follow the proper 3 emote procedure, which we of course agreed.

^ above, primarily in the #2 section, I outline again the events that took place, and how we had plenty of IRP knowledge to go looking for suspected trouble along the roads between Curon and the Empire. Despite asking OOCly, I was unfortunately misinformed about the legality of the birds I received. Had I known the birds were illegal, we wouldn't have gone in the first place. The only reason I went at all, was because I was assured that we wouldn't have some kind of meta gaming debacle in the first place.

I'm very familiar with what Meta Gaming is. As stated above, players from the Empire, including myself, experienced it basically every day on the roads between Cloud Temple, Curon, and the Empire. It is frustratingly obvious and blatant when a group of 6 soldiers are stopped by one bandit player, that player stalls conflict, and suddenly another 4 or 8 bandit players show up, encircling the group. This happens regularly, to the point where Imperial players (including myself) have sometimes stopped making Modreqs for it, as we would rather just fight it out than lose players due to the wait time and still potentially have an unfavorable ruling. Not that a I blame moderators for the obnoxious difficulty that it is to handle the dozens of bandit modreqs due to meta gaming and poor villainy on part of the bandit players. The process takes time, and it has now become a factor in how players consider dealing with bandit meta gaming.

Despite what ScreamingDingo stated, I do have a learned understanding of what Meta gaming is. The defenition that I stated in the ban report was "OOC information used to alter or inform the decisions of your IRP character, thus altering your characters behavior with information they may not otherwise have or do not yet posses." Something along those lines. The definition of meta gaming on the Wiki is, "metagaming (also known as meta) is using informations outside of your characters life to use them as guidance."

I have defended myself to the best of my ability, and I have been defending myself because I did not commit an act of meta gaming. If I accidentally committed minor meta gaming through pings on our discord, I am fully ready to receive a warning or other punishment for such a failure, but as ScreamingDingo said himself, the rally posts used as "evidence" against me and the playerbase of Curon certainly fell short of Meta.

 

What will you do to prevent similar circumstances that led to your punishment?

I will continue to make sure that myself and the playerbase under my command and the leadership I take charge of does not make rally calls that have IRP consequences (such as to fight bandits or defend the city), without proper IRP procedure taking place first. Other than that, I will continue to act on RP circumstances presented to me to the best of my ability. If I suspect there to be a root of meta, I will ask the player OOCly for confirmation, as I did above ^, because in the end that is all a player can do besides making sure not to encourage meta gaming.

 

Discuss why you believe that following the Community Guidelines is important to promote a healthy community.

Following the community guidelines is important to promote a healthy community because they help keep things civil. When players are calm and collected, which is rare on lotc, the server is more enjoyable. The server has many flaws in its system as do the players themselves, but being civil, laid back, detached, helps prevent saltiness and bitterness. Something that every player that is on LOTC is prone to doing. Civility is the foundation upon which a community builds. If that falls apart then there is nothing left. The guidelines are important because players, from the lowest to the highest levels on the server, seem to forget them. That includes myself, and all levels of staff. Nobody is immune to it, because we are all only human. We can only do so much. That said, keeping the guidelines in the back of our head can really help in serving as a reminder that; it's only a game.

Edited by Ankalagon_

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@ScreamingDingo Yes it is. To the best of my ability, I have detailed my position for review. I also demonstrate my understanding of meta gaming. This wasn’t a ban report where I blatantly broke rules or actively sought out to cause issues. Your reason for banning me in the ban report was that I had a lack of understanding of Meta gaming, and didn’t approach it with any seriousness. So I tried my very best to respond to those (reasonable) concerns that you laid out.

 

If you still believe that my understanding of Meta Gaming is lacking, or that any of the points I laid out above as reasons I should be unbanned are flawed, I would be more than happy to hear that and to receive further punishment. That said, I am coming from a place where I truly do not think that extending my ban helps. Thank you for your time.

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https://prntscr.com/n3ef52

 

DEMOCRACY PREVAILS

 

 

 

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  1.  ….

 

You were not banned for this, I have told you this time and time again.

 

 

 

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    ScreamingDingo himself in the ban report states that the discord pings were legal, though he did warn that myself and the players of Curon should make sure that if a rally ping is posted from within RP reasons, they should follow the proper 3 emote procedure, which we of course agreed.

Thank you for restating this point. This should be a warning to everyone to ensure that rally pings against raids are followed with the correct procedure.

 

    ^ above, primarily in the #2 section, I outline again the events that took place, and how we had plenty of IRP knowledge to go looking for suspected trouble along the roads between Curon and the Empire. Despite asking OOCly, I was unfortunately misinformed about the legality of the birds I received. Had I known the birds were illegal, we wouldn't have gone in the first place. The only reason I went at all, was because I was assured that we wouldn't have some kind of meta gaming debacle in the first place.

 

 

You say unfortunately misinformed, though having the word of mouth of multiple people from Curon talking about you talking to new players and telling them how to meta-game birds. If it was just a few bits of hearsay I would’ve dismissed it, but it was more than that. There was the incident that Fireheart_ passed onto me which I handled in conjunction to that ban report. Yes, your discord pings were legal, borderline but the pinging was not the issue at hand. You as a representative of the playerbase of Curon should not try to incite such behaviour, you are a rolemodel and that should be something you ensure that you are on your best behaviour. This was not as much of a target ban as people believe, and this appeal shows WHY you were banned in the first place.
 

Quote

 

    I'm very familiar with what Meta Gaming is. As stated above, players from the Empire, including myself, experienced it basically every day on the roads between Cloud Temple, Curon, and the Empire. It is frustratingly obvious and blatant when a group of 6 soldiers are stopped by one bandit player, that player stalls conflict, and suddenly another 4 or 8 bandit players show up, encircling the group. This happens regularly, to the point where Imperial players (including myself) have sometimes stopped making Modreqs for it, as we would rather just fight it out than lose players due to the wait time and still potentially have an unfavorable ruling. Not that a I blame moderators for the obnoxious difficulty that it is to handle the dozens of bandit modreqs due to meta gaming and poor villainy on part of the bandit players. The process takes time, and it has now become a factor in how players consider dealing with bandit meta gaming.

 

 

 

 

This shouldn’t even be in the appeal, this is a massive problem. You shouldn’t ever be just letting things slide if they’re bad for the server, I tell everyone to gather evidence and create ban reports on situations that are illegitimate. I’ve done bans on both sides of the conflict and punishment, there is no excuse for moderators to not follow through with this.
 

Quote

 

   Despite what ScreamingDingo stated, I do have a learned understanding of what Meta gaming is. The defenition that I stated in the ban report was "OOC information used to alter or inform the decisions of your IRP character, thus altering your characters behavior with information they may not otherwise have or do not yet posses." Something along those lines. The definition of meta gaming on the Wiki is, "metagaming (also known as meta) is using informations outside of your characters life to use them as guidance."

 

    I have defended myself to the best of my ability, and I have been defending myself because I did not commit an act of meta gaming. If I accidentally committed minor meta gaming through pings on our discord, I am fully ready to receive a warning or other punishment for such a failure, but as ScreamingDingo said himself, the rally posts used as "evidence" against me and the playerbase of Curon certainly fell short of Meta.

 

 

 

Your entire defense on the last player report was saying that curon was a non-lotc medium. If you had legitimately meta-gamed in that server, it wouldn’t have protected you. Your first point of argument should’ve been, “we did everything correctly” instead of pulling out the defense of rule loopholes to justify behaviour, you don’t need to try to break and appeal to the system if you’ve done nothing wrong. Yes, your discord pings were fine and the claims were dangerous to place precedent upon. But as I said, the evidence presented to me outside that ban report is what sealed that fate.

 

 

I don’t understand you Ank, I’m aware you believe you’re innocent of everything but can you not see what the problem is with your behaviour? This isn’t the first time you’ve done things like this during your tenure of the server and you refuse to see why or how this is bad. Usually, I would punish hard for an appeal like this because of a complete lack of judgement and the ability to reflect. Though, you are genuine (even if it is flawed).

 

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I would be more than happy to hear that and to receive further punishment.

Okay then you’ll be unbanned on the 3rd of April, without needing an appeal. Take an extra week and don’t **** up again, if you do then I expect very severe punishments to follow.      

 

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