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UnBaed
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What! I'm not allowed to think I'm the main character in everyone's story!! Wow. I am angry!! 

 

Jk Good ramble. Very interesting. I love conflict when it's a two way street of I may lose or they may lose. Too many people have attempted to power game my persona when my persona is either a orc and they're a human or I'm playing a Golem and they're a random dude with a sword.

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Yes, this.

Overall it’s been a mix of newer raid rules and the community shift, where now 3+ people is considered a ‘raid’, even when you’re just doing general villainy rp. Compared to older rules, such as Athera, where you had droves of dark mages and general raider camps roam freely, allowing for more organic systems of conflict without need of a /modreq hey me and my friends need a babysitter for our whitelisted role play experience. Of course the ROs can consider some interactions to not be raids and whatnot, overall since Vailor the server hasn’t been too accustomed to player villainy and interaction in most cases. Most conflicts are inflated to world ET levels or world wars, with players often being metagamed or OOCly ousted and ostracized for causing conflict. I think it’s slowly gotten better in the recent year, though there’s still more of a push to be done.

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1 hour ago, UnBaed said:

 

 

Too many players view themselves as the protagonist

 

 

Really good post, I think this particular line really should be read by players at least once during this time on LotC as a good way to reflect on how we interact with each other.

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Clearly, I am the protagonist. All the other players are quite wrong.

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I don't see anything wrong with conflict, it's usually what drives a story, and as you said it isn't something that has to be combat or bandits, it can be something as simple as a disagreement(which I personally think drives a story better than a good bit of combat). Getting into some non-combat conflicts is important to RP,  because if you avoid every situation where a conflict may occur, then you are avoiding like 90% of RP.

When it comes to avoiding combat based conflict or certain players is where I think our views differ. As someone who doesn't really enjoy CRP a great amount, I do my best to avoid any stressful combat situations by not traveling on the roads, avoiding areas where my characters may get attacked, etc. I also just don't usually have time to deal with a drawn out conflict. I tend to hop on and look around for RP for a few minutes, then both RP and do OOC stuff at the same time, which you can't exactly do in most combat/conflict situations. In the case that I do get drawn into combat I do my best to be polite because having to call in a mod only causes me to lose more time that could be spent on Homework or non-RP related things(like stewardry work and helping new players with questions). I've been in a couple conflict incidents where I've just flat out said "I can only be on for like 45 more minutes before I need to go do X thing, can we take this at a fast pace?" and if it's a good RPer, generally the response is "Yes" or something helpful and positive because we both want a good experience, but there are also incidents where you get a person who will just flat out say "Too bad, you're here till this conflict is finished, deal with it" which can be extremely annoying, and these also tend to be the situations where RP is sub-par.

I don't really avoid certain players that often, but there are a few people who I will just flat out not RP with or do my best to stay away from. Generally these are the people who RP for the sole purpose of causing drama, which is driven by OOC issues or as a way to annoy people. You can tell who these people are after a short period of time, from my experience they tend to be the same people who incorrectly RP mental illnesses or physical injuries, become upset of you call them out on anything, or just provide sub-par emotes. If the person is causing issues purely ICly for the purpose of group IC growth then I'm all down for it, it's usually fun, but when it's driven by OOC issues it's a no from me.

An additional note that I think is worth mentioning-- a large majority of the people on the server use it as an "escape from reality" and a stress reliever, so if someone is having a bad day or week, I completely understand not wanting to get involved in conflict and just wanting to chill, because I'm like that every once and a while too, but it shouldn't be on the other people involved in the RP to cater to what you want, if you don't want conflict, then avoid it, don't force others not to create it.

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I AM the LORD of the CRAFT

 

Based though

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3 hours ago, Security_ said:

without need of a /modreq hey me and my friends need a babysitter for our whitelisted role play experience.

That was good 

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5 hours ago, UnBaed said:

 

 

Too many players view themselves as the protagonist

 

 

 

That is often because many players [in my eyes, at least], have the mindset that they are the “protagonist” on the server.  They are the Dragonborn, and LotC is their Skyrim to explore and do their quests in.  Anything that is a monster or is “evil” should be killed so that they can continue on their merry way.

 

Many dark mage/creature RPers often hate dealing with others because they feel as if everyone else views them as a Story Team member hosting an event where their characters get to kill an evil wizard or monster and earn a prize.

 

 

I am literally the protagonist and all dark magic roleplayers are just side quests in my goal for ultimate power.

 

Jokes aside, yeah, playing a morghul ******* sucked because everyone views themselves the heroes of the story and refuse to lose because of it. I try to view killing dark things/non ET entities (at least in recent times, I know I was bad about outright killing in the past) as a last resort, besides its so boringly final. There's no character development for either person if they just get PK'd after one or two encounters. More fun to have it be an ongoing hunt/whatever the word is, so long as they're not out there PKing people for bullshit reasons and ruining those people's fun by extension.

Edited by rukio
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Opened cause I thought this was a meme/shitpost. Needless to say I was disappointed.

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I think its important to be distinct in that people should not see themselves as the protagonist of the server but there is nothing wrong with seeing yourself as the protagonist of your own story.

 

The distinction probably is difficult for newer players or people who are new to roleplay. I should not expect everyone on the server or anyone I interact with to treat me as the hero or the protagonist, but it is entirely fine for me to play my character as the hero of their story. An example of this is Edric, my own character. He has gone from a village blacksmith to killing a hellhound and an ice witch, to him, this is an incredible achievement that no one from his home would ever believe. Thats why he calls himself Witchslayer, and used to call himself Houndsbane. In RP, Edric brags about this because to him its a huge deal. Ooc, i dont expect people to care, nor be impressed. Nor am i impressed when people ooc say "its not impressive Sham. My character 4 maps ago killed FIVE witches" or something of the like. The entire point here is that my character is not the protagonist of the server, so doing this should be a big deal and make him feel like he is the protagonist of something - his life.

 

But yeah, aversion to conflict is crazy. I prefer the term drama to conflict though. 

 

Drama drives interesting roleplay. Tavern rp can be dramatic, war rp can be dramatic. Anything can be dramatic, but getting upset over others creating dramatic rp, or avoiding dramatic rp, is just going to lead to boring experiences for a large number of players. Some players might be happy to spend hours sitting in a tavern talking about the weather, or running their bread shop and chatting with customers, but many people Roleplay exactly because they are tired of the mundane, or slice of life experiences of their lives and want something dramatic.

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16 hours ago, UnBaed said:

Most of them have often described as if they feel like they are NPCs and are always meant to die in any confrontations with guards or other players.

 

Big upvote here from me. This is why I value capture/jail roleplay so much more than immediate death for villainous characters. There's still the chance for punishment, but it actually does something towards character development for both parties. You could even insert the chance for certain guards to be more willing to take bribes than others, which is an incredible angle to develop guard characters from imo. There's even other options, like having a hand removed for thievery, which are far better than simply death (even death by CRP, to say nothing of PVP). It couldn't hurt to be at least a bit more creative with our punishments. After all, there's so many interesting ones out there in history!

 

This leads back into the protagonist problem you mentioned, where good always triumphs with a clear immediacy. Yes, it's generally good for good to triumph, but delayed response makes a story better. Darth Vader didn't die in his initial confrontation with Obi-Wan because his story wasn't ripened yet. His story developed through several Episodes of confrontation, chasing, and other interactions with the "good guys". If we could find a reasonable way to translate that sort of manhunt into guard/villain interactions, I think the stories of both sides would be all the more developed for it. And, in the end, if the crimes become piled high, trial and public execution in the square is far more interesting and engaging than lopping someone's head off on the side of the road.

 

These sorts of sentiments are a tale as old as time from me, but I still hold out hope that even small changes could help these sorts of rp interactions go more smoothly and be more rewarding for both sides.

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I don't know people, scars are hot.

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Good post dude. Right on 

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On 12/3/2020 at 6:39 PM, UnBaed said:

 Most of them have often described as if they feel like they are NPCs and are always meant to die in any confrontations with guards or other players.

Thought I don't play anymore I do like to keep my eye on the forums. In regards to this..

 

There was once a time where a dark mage was enough of a threat that instant death on capturing was justified, because capturing one was no easy feat. Likewise, in this same time, a voidal or holy mage was diverse and useful enough to be actively sought out. You fought magic with magic, not brawn - unless in greater numbers. Now, I genuinely believe a good swordsman could beat any magic wielder.

 

I'm not saying what should or should not be the case, I'm not saying to go back to the old days, but it's important to realize that the view on what you do to a dark/villainous character has never changed. The change occurred in the strengths and skills of those playing these characters, and the increasing boldness of those non-magic folk who are realizing... That these great threats aren't threats any longer. Perhaps not an active thought in their mind, but one slowly invading everyone who comes to face these once-threats.

 

TLDR; Something hits different about shades when half the playerbase use their tendrils for an uwu tail/erp and half try and be dark overlords. They stop being scary. Other magics too. Not to mention the mechanical restrictions as magic over time slowly becomes more streamlined and less guidelined.

 

For villainy as a whole, I've never really fallen into trouble with anyone I've ever actually been a villain towards. People unrelated to it have complained, called names, tried to say it was "poor rp" despite never being present to begin with. But anyone I've ever actually threatened, swung a sword at, or even killed, generally tends to compliment the RP and thought behind the actions. In my brief tenure as a shade rampaging around Atlas, everyone that died to him PK'd before I stopped due to people unrelated to the RP not wanting me to play a villain that killed people. I bitched out, and to those who would do the same I say -

 

If you are a villain, direct your audience to those who appreciate it. If others complain or come for you, damn them and continue on your way.

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