[✗] Darasvira: Disciples of the Aspects' Hand

[Lockages 489]

i like dragons, i like the color green, and that's good enough for me man. i havent read it yet nor do i think i will soon because im too ******* tired. good job either way though kale.

[ThatGuy_777 218]

Still reading, gonna pick up in the morning, but so far it looks good. Regardless, I'm definitely on board with the premise at the very least.

[ronin_champloo 5951]

25 minutes ago, The Media Wizard said:

I am uncertain if this was written in cooperation with the Azdrazi lorekeepers

 

It wasn't, no. I had talked to several Druids and Community Leaders concerning my re-write that I worked on - for community feedback, balances and possible RP/Conflict ideas, and there was either no mention, no talks of this at all or I was ghosted - I did, however, know about the existence of this from a mutual party, but I wasn't allowed to see or was just completely left in the dark concerning all this.

 

I would've loved to know more about this, since there could've been interesting segments or interactions with one another - but alas, this is not that blessed timeline.

 

I'll be reading and giving this a look based off balance in the near future.

[The Media Wizard 2954]

1 minute ago, Kneeil said:

 

It wasn't, no. I had talked to several Druids and Community Leaders concerning my re-write that I worked on - for community feedback, balances and possible RP/Conflict ideas, and there was either no mention, talks of this at all or I was ghosted - I did, however, know about the existence of this, but I wasn't allowed to see or was just completely left in the dark concerning all this.

 

I am sorry to hear that, Kneeil. I hope they remedy this.

[Keefy 2047]

1 minute ago, Kneeil said:

 

It wasn't, no. I had talked to several Druids and Community Leaders concerning my re-write that I worked on - for community feedback, balances and possible RP/Conflict ideas, and there was either no mention, talks of this at all or I was ghosted - I did, however, know about the existence of this, but I wasn't allowed to see or was just completely left in the dark concerning all this.

I believe this was done the way it was under the concern for the less. Mmm. Receptive members of that community. The belligerent ones that like to throw fire.

Kale recognized that this post at it's core would draw critique and ire, but felt the need to push through anyways, if only to give it the college try, even if it fails. 

[Bonito 2263]

this looks like it could better serve as a druidism amendment/submagic/thingy. Theres the power creep with being able to dodge the normal druid disconnect, going thru singing trees without learning the feat, the mobile fae ring, and the dragon pets; and this is only what i can still recall. i also think being able to bang a leaf lizard and birth a half dragon hybrid kid should be removed

[NomadGaia 924]

1 minute ago, The Media Wizard said:

 

As I said before, it absolutely makes sense. Reason and logic both point to the course that was taken. I also know, though, that some people are seeing this as an attempt to subvert or oppose an already established community. If a new subrace of creatures that could Wild Shape into animals appeared it would raise some eyebrows. The best of reasons does not negate the overall issue of doubling similar roleplay.

 

I am uncertain if this was written in cooperation with the Azdrazi lorekeepers, but I think it would be a huge benefit for this to be a cooperative piece if the intent was truly to create engaging roleplay between the two factions.

I see what you're saying about this trying to oppose the established community of the Azdrazi, but I think that's the point. I see these two groups being long time rivals, should this lore pass. They're diametrically opposed, ideologically. I think it'd be immensely interesting for the two factions to clash heads on the server, and I think it could make long lasting fuel for roleplay conflict to come. And I understand what you mean when you speak about the subrace of changelings, yeah it might raise some brows, but even then I'd hope that people could find something that works- make some cool events from it or lead to some battles. If there's to be conflict, I wanna see it irp And perhaps the roleplay may be similar in some ways, but I believe it has enough differences to make it an interesting addition to the server's lore. 

 

As as far as cooperation goes, I'm not seeing a lot in the way of constructive criticism. I'm not seeing anyone besides you saying "How can we make this work?" or "How can we make this mesh better with the Azdrazi community?" A lot of people don't even seem to be giving this a chance. I can't say I know a great deal about the extent of cooperation during the writing process itself, so I can't speak on that unfortunately. But in this, the public review, I don't see many making a vested effort to work with the lorewriters towards a more beneficial outcome.

 

I could be speaking too soon though, as the lore was just posted, so people are still considering their responses- reading and forming their critiques. I know people on both sides, long time Azdrazi players, and long time Druid players, and they're friends to me. I hope people can work together and see the good in this lore, and if there are changes that need to be made to make this work for everyone, let them be made to create something mutually beneficial.

 

In conclusion I like people on both sides and I do not want them to fight about this so lets make some cool lore that leads to some cool conflict irp and doesn't fuel ooc distaste toward each other.

[Keefy 2047]

Just now, Kujo said:

this looks like it could better serve as a druidism amendment/submagic/thingy. Theres the power creep with being able to dodge the normal druid disconnect, going thru singing trees without learning the feat, the mobile fae ring, and the dragon pets; and this is only what i can still recall. i also think being able to bang a leaf lizard and birth a half dragon hybrid kid should be removed

I imagine alot of changes will be required if this doesn't get denied, because of the unique relationship between Taynei and the Aspects, before touching a mag, so I can see your points with alot of these.

[SoulReapingWolf 2258]

Okay, I've taken my time to read through all of it and I feel like this lore piece is pretty complete. The abilities are detailed. 

I have two main questions I got while reading the lore. The first being how much Draan does a Darasvira have and if there is no specific Tier Progression are the abilities they have learned as soon as they go through their first rebirth? Or must they be taught by an older more experienced Darasvira?

Additionally, if a Darasvira becomes a druid or posses any other kind of compatible magics do they have 2 'mana pools' one for their Darasvira abilities and one for their druidic or other magic ones or are they shared somehow?

[Keefy 2047]

Just now, SoulReapingWolf said:

Okay, I've taken my time to read through all of it and I feel like this lore piece is pretty complete. The abilities are detailed. 

I have two main questions I got while reading the lore. The first being how much Draan does a Darasvira have and if there is no specific Tier Progression are the abilities they have learned as soon as they go through their first rebirth? Or must they be taught by an older more experienced Darasvira?

Additionally, if a Darasvira becomes a druid or posses any other kind of compatible magics do they have 2 'mana pools' one for their Darasvira abilities and one for their druidic or other magic ones or are they shared somehow?

@KalehartWould be better equipped to answering this.

Draan I believe is 10, if one becomes both, what tires you out works both ends. So if you use draan and mana to do one thing and then go to do another it'll tucker you out.

HOWEVER, I'm just answering what I can to give Kale some sanity after he formatted it. 

Also I believe the abilities must be taught by older ones. These arent Azdrazi/Nephilim, they dont have the intuition to just know what they are given, so it takes time for them to learn to walk so to speak.

[ScreamingDingo 16990]

deific aligned dragaar will be the bane of my existence

[The Media Wizard 2954]

1 minute ago, NomadGaia said:

I see what you're saying about this trying to oppose the established community of the Azdrazi, but I think that's the point. I see these two groups being long time rivals, should this lore pass. They're diametrically opposed, ideologically. I think it'd be immensely interesting for the two factions to clash heads on the server, and I think it could make long lasting fuel for roleplay conflict to come. And I understand what you mean when you speak about the subrace of changelings, yeah it might raise some brows, but even then I'd hope that people could find something that works- make some cool events from it or lead to some battles. If there's to be conflict, I wanna see it irp And perhaps the roleplay may be similar in some ways, but I believe it has enough differences to make it an interesting addition to the server's lore. 

 

As as far as cooperation goes, I'm not seeing a lot in the way of constructive criticism. I'm not seeing anyone besides you saying "How can we make this work?" or "How can we make this mesh better with the Azdrazi community?" A lot of people don't even seem to be giving this a chance. I can't say I know a great deal about the extent of cooperation during the writing process itself, so I can't speak on that unfortunately. But in this, the public review, I don't see many making a vested effort to work with the lorewriters towards a more beneficial outcome.

 

I could be speaking too soon though, as the lore was just posted, so people are still considering their responses- reading and forming their critiques. I know people on both sides, long time Azdrazi players, and long time Druid players, and they're friends to me. I hope people can work together and see the good in this lore, and if there are changes that need to be made to make this work for everyone, let them be made to create something mutually beneficial.

 

In conclusion I like people on both sides and I do not want them to fight about this so lets make some cool lore that leads to some cool conflict irp and doesn't fuel ooc distaste toward each other.

 

If the intent of this lore is to generate long-lasting roleplay with the Azdrazi, then they should have been consulted throughout the entire process rather than trying to force the groups into conflict naturally after the fact. This was submitted to the forum rather than the roleplay group that would be most affected by this lore's implementation. Leaving the Azdrazi in the dark on this was not a good idea.

 

As for "giving this a chance," I think most people — including myself — have said that the lore looks great. The only concern that I have seen raised is about its proximity to the Azdrazi due to being a contested dragonrace. This has been the main point of critique and we have suggested changing the dragon aspects to a more fae-based creature. It is a drastic change, but it is the main change the opposition seems to be suggesting.

 

I believe that the lore writers should take one of the following avenues:

 

1. The race is changed from dragonfolk to something else entirely. The "meat" of the piece can stay relatively the same, but making it something unique to the server and other factions would leave a better taste in my mouth.

2. The lore is touched up with direct cooperation from the Azdrazi if the intent is truly to work with them like the Ascended and Undead of Aegis did.

 

I cannot wait to see how this lore evolves going forward.

[SoulReapingWolf 2258]

3 minutes ago, Keefy said:

Draan I believe is 10, if one becomes both, what tires you out works both ends. So if you use draan and mana to do one thing and then go to do another it'll tucker you out.

Oh god, don't know how I missed it. Thanks for pointing it out. 
 

12 minutes ago, Kujo said:

Theres the power creep with being able to dodge the normal druid disconnect

I think I had a conversation with Kale about this. He mentioned something along the lines of since the darasvira  are so aligned with the Aspects being unattuned would also revert their demi-draconic nature. So I believe while it might seem a bit iffy at first. I understand it requires a special ritual that not only involves unattunement but also reverting a darasvira's demi-draconic nature. Some of your other points I can understand making a bit more sense tho such as the quarter dragon kids. 
 

5 minutes ago, The Media Wizard said:

f the intent of this lore is to generate long-lasting roleplay with the Azdrazi, then they should have been consulted throughout the entire process rather than trying to force the groups into conflict naturally after the fact. This was submitted to the forum rather than the roleplay group that would be most affected by this lore's implementation. Leaving the Azdrazi in the dark on this was not a good idea.

I don't think lore would really move forward in LoTC if you had to seek everyone's approval. Since Druids, Paladins, Azdrazi, Dark Mages, Voidal mages and Dragon Kin are all mentioned in the lore should they all be approached? 

If we did this today Azdrazi would have to similarly include paladins in their rewrites or anything mentioned in them. Seems like an awfully and impossibly long process just to make sure everyone and their mothers are happy (which they'll never be)

[The Media Wizard 2954]

6 minutes ago, SoulReapingWolf said:

I don't think lore would really move forward in LoTC if you had to seek everyone's approval. Since Druids, Paladins, Azdrazi, Dark Mages, Voidal mages and Dragon Kin are all mentioned in the lore should they all be approached? 

If we did this today Azdrazi would have to similarly include paladins in their rewrites or anything mentioned in them. Seems like an awfully and impossibly long process just to make sure everyone and their mothers are happy (which they'll never be).

 

I think there is a big difference there. A new magic that can affect another group is different to making a similar-looking and acting race to one that is already exists. If someone wanted to make a new race of catfolk, they should speak with the Kha lorekeepers. I do not think that is a lot to ask or expect.

[NomadGaia 924]

1 minute ago, The Media Wizard said:

 

If the intent of this lore is to generate long-lasting roleplay with the Azdrazi, then they should have been consulted throughout the entire process rather than trying to force the groups into conflict naturally after the fact. This was submitted to the forum rather than the roleplay group that would be most affected by this lore's implementation. Leaving the Azdrazi in the dark on this was not a good idea.

 

As for "giving this a chance," I think most people — including myself — have said that the lore looks great. The only concern that I have seen raised is about its proximity to the Azdrazi due to being a contested dragonrace. This has been the main point of critique and we have suggested changing the dragon aspects to a more fae-based creature. It is a drastic change, but it is the main change the opposition seems to be suggesting.

 

I believe that the lore writers should take one of the following avenues:

 

1. The race is changed from dragonfolk to something else entirely. The "meat" of the piece can stay relatively the same, but making it something unique to the server and other factions would leave a better taste in my mouth.

2. The lore is touched up with direct cooperation from the Azdrazi if the intent is truly to work with them like the Ascended and Undead of Aegis did.

 

I cannot wait to see how this lore evolves going forward.

I can agree with a lot of these points, though there are some I still don't agree with. The Azdrazi are so much more than dragon people, they live and fight for certain reasons- their niche goes beyond that. Just as the niche for this particular lore piece goes beyond it as well. The aesthetic is similar, yes, I understand that, but that shouldn't exclude other dragon-kin races from the server's lore. Azdromoth is not the only dragon, after all, and that's been the case for a long time.

 

I do agree with your first point, however. If these two groups are to coexist, and butt heads irp, there should be more communication oocly between them.

 

I'm looking forward to seeing the lore go forward as well! Let's GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO