Holy Hells do I Hate The Druids. A Hating of Inactivity and Magics.

[The Media Wizard 2954]

1 hour ago, Caelria said:

I've felt for a long time that the only way to fix the Elven playerbase is to approve only one Elven nation and deny the creation of any new Elven settlements at all. Do the same thing with the Dwarves and with Orcs. There aren't enough actively participating players to fill the myriad schism communities that plague Elvenkind, or just any race in general on a server that mostly floats around 150.

 

I believe @KaiserThoren said it best: the elves never learned that schisms are bad.

 

A lot of other communities on LOTC purposefully avoid schisms due to the fear of splitting their player base. Instead, these other communities use civil wars, coups or grand political systems to change power systems without eradicating their entire player base. There are too many egos and ambitions in the elven community to relegate it to one, single territory. Everyone wants to be a prince, lord or high prince.

 

A multitude of reasons can be given, but it always comes down to one key factor when elves split apart: control.

[Caelria 2618]

1 hour ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

Thing is though, if you go back far enough in LOTC history, 90% of the main settlements were once alternative settlements in some form or another.

We're not a frontier enterprise with a constant influx of well retained new players anymore. Unfortunately, the culture isn't quite the same either. Folk are blacklisted. Folk have histories. Folk will refuse to roleplay anywhere that isn't the home they first joined. The amount of fresh players without a history of attachment diminishes by the day. I remember seeing Snow Elves roleplaying in Sutica or as other races for years, just waiting for Fenn to come back and absolutely refusing to rejoin Elven roleplay elsewhere, because other Elves being stupid was the bulk of what they were taught. Others just logged out and didn't come back until it returned. Same for many humans and their kingdoms. Conquest does afford some degree of temporary unity, but what you don't see is the people who disappear and the massive human cost of unification through violence. In a community that is hemorrhaging, exsanguination is a poor prescription.

 

I don't even think the old standbys are necessarily what we should be preserving. The only settlements I think are worth keeping right now on the merit of their activity or culture are Elysium, Oren, Haense, and Savoy (honestly, with how similar Oren and Savoy are now, I'm not even sure they should be separate -- and this is from the perspective of someone who helped start the Neo-Savoy Project); with fasntasy racial capitals perserved to allow people who want those specific fantasies a place to go.

 

I still feel like it's true that players should self-manage and be entitled to do so, to a degree, but having seen the disastrous effects of self-management on the retention rates, climate, infrastructure, and culture of our server I'm no longer so convinced that just letting the biggest swinging sausage control everything is the play. Especially since those swinging sausages, with several notable exceptions, usually aren't very good at anything besides swinging their sausage around. Especially when the recent kiddie pool tyrants have shown they don't care about the health of the community, or really anything besides how big they can get for bragging rights, before they get bored and go inactive.

1 hour ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

Activity checks lead to hugboxing and I hope they aren’t what you’re thinking of when you talk about player distribution.

The activity check system is ridiculous. You don't need a spreadsheet to walk through every build at active hours of the day and see that they're almost all either empty or have four afk players in them every day of the week. 

1 hour ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

I wouldn’t want to play on a server where players are managed by staff like resources in a grand strategy game.

You should be a lot more upset at the fact that staff is preserving megalopolises for 0-5 active people that entrap new players who lack the experience or awareness to know that there are better options than the idea we should be careful about building a village for every Tom, Richard, and Stanley who wants to rope them into their ego trip. The "war is the solution" caveman faction's idea of burning down every new settlement like this that props up and bullying them into submission won't work if they can just respawn and build a new one somewhere else a week after you do it.

 

1 hour ago, The Media Wizard said:

Instead, these other communities use civil wars, coups or grand political systems to change power systems without eradicating their entire player base.

This is the way to do things. Enact change by roleplaying with people in house rather than enacting change by splitting the community into two pieces across the map from one another and either pretending the other party doesn't exist or bullying them to inactivity by warring them and calling yourself a winner. Roleplay is interactive. When the meta of conflict is to avoid and not to interact with people who challenge your worldview or ego outside of Minecraft Battlefront II, roleplay dies.

[NomadGaia 924]

42 minutes ago, The Media Wizard said:

 

I believe @KaiserThoren said it best: the elves never learned that schisms are bad.

 

A lot of other communities on LOTC purposefully avoid schisms due to the fear of splitting their player base. Instead, these other communities use civil wars, coups or grand political systems to change power systems without eradicating their entire player base. There are too many egos and ambitions in the elven community to relegate it to one, single territory. Everyone wants to be a prince, lord or high prince.

 

A multitude of reasons can be given, but it always comes down to one key factor when elves split apart: control.

You know me Zill, but others might not so anywho, I've led the elves and specifically wood elves for a few years, though recently I've taken a backseat to things in lieu of the death of my character, and some other irl issues. I'd add something to this, as I think it oversimplifies things a bit too far. The problem isn't necessarily always ambition, but it's often the fact that most people are unwilling, or unable to compromise with each other. I've noticed this pattern far too many times in the elven playerbase. It often begins with a perceived slight, or something more direct. Maybe someone said something that clashed with you in a meeting or something, it could be anything, really. But these feelings tend to bubble beneath the surface, people don't talk them out like adults, and things end up bubbling beneath the surface. After a while, they just tend to pile up, until it hits a breaking point, and as Kaiser said, they don't tend to view schisms as bad. So they leave to do their own thing, to get away from the people they've got a grudge against. It makes leading elves exhausting, as it just becomes a game of trying to spot and put out these ooc fires between groups, when that responsibility should fall to people themselves.

[TimberBuff 2105]

6 hours ago, Slorbin said:

 

I'm disappointed, I thought this was going to be a post on how the Druids are stupid for having Animii and [supposedly] having smoggers. THAT is stupid.

 

bro so sweet of u to think of me man im happy that im cool enough to get complained about

 

this stuff is discussed irp and the characters mentioned are controversial within the community and have methods that most other druids disapprove of. y'know that internal conflict that people say is cool. 

[Tulan 443]

2 hours ago, Caelria said:

 

Every Elf wants to be the leader. Crabs in a bucket.

"But they'll bicker and fight..."

That's called activity. Exit your hugbox. Roleplay with strangers.

I'll have to disagree, but I'll bet no one in the community I am in wants to work with most other elves, maybe just wood elves and Fenn. We definitely dislike the High Elves. Too proud in their 'purity'.

 

Would be a nice sentiment if Elves could get along, but that's too much to hope for.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Tulan

[The Media Wizard 2954]

28 minutes ago, NomadGaia said:

You know me Zill, but others might not so anywho, I've led the elves and specifically wood elves for a few years, though recently I've taken a backseat to things in lieu of the death of my character, and some other irl issues. I'd add something to this, as I think it oversimplifies things a bit too far. The problem isn't necessarily always ambition, but it's often the fact that most people are unwilling, or unable to compromise with each other. I've noticed this pattern far too many times in the elven playerbase. It often begins with a perceived slight, or something more direct. Maybe someone said something that clashed with you in a meeting or something, it could be anything, really. But these feelings tend to bubble beneath the surface, people don't talk them out like adults, and things end up bubbling beneath the surface. After a while, they just tend to pile up, until it hits a breaking point, and as Kaiser said, they don't tend to view schisms as bad. So they leave to do their own thing, to get away from the people they've got a grudge against. It makes leading elves exhausting, as it just becomes a game of trying to spot and put out these ooc fires between groups, when that responsibility should fall to people themselves.

 

Very well said, Gaia.

[Bisscy 64]

 

[Myleres 1658]

where are u looking to become a druid? i have actively been taking students for the past year or so. and im not the only one. if you want to join our community then feel free to reach out,  (: 

[Qaz_The_Great 1189]

Human warrior > M*gic user (any race)

[VoidandNull 356]

19 minutes ago, Kuila said:

where are u looking to become a druid?

I stopped wanting to become a druid about half a year ago. I've kept up with some druidic politics, and I say that sparingly because I haven't associated with them in a VERY long time. Thank you though, and have a great day mate :)

[monkeypoacher 6993]

2 hours ago, Salvo said:

The only time elves under humans worked was helves under Savoy in 2014-15 and the reiter-welf protectorate, as caelria said people would just **** off or don't bother logging back on

 

That said, I think a somewhat full-elven autonomous state would work provided they don't just self-segregate in separate ghettos

 

i was suggesting elf alts

 

3 hours ago, Caelria said:

I'd love to see how many Elves roleplay in a nation conquered by PvPers versus how many just log out and don't come back to LotC. Seems like every time that's happened so far they all go somewhere else like Sutica or Elysium (or a human nation that can protect them). Happened similarly to humans in the War of Two Emperors or so I'm told. Systems like this work great in worlds where people can't just log out. I love activity and RP dynamicism, and I agree war should be freely waged, but bullying people who can't defend themselves into one place so your number is really big and then killing anybody who leaves isn't much fun either. Less heavy handed to just not let fast burning temporary alternative settlements start and dilute activity.

 

Not every problem can be solved by brute force actual tyranny either. You catch a lot more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. If you want to do Alexander the Great roleplay at least call it what it is rather than masquerading under the banner of server health, because once Alexander the Great is gone the the empire will fall apart just as fast.

 

This is such a bizarre perspective and there are so many completely mystifying statements being made. Why do you think players would be any less likely to quit if they're forced into a staff-mandated elven Bantustan? Are "elves" and "PvPers" really separate buckets that cannot be intersected? Does playing an elf take away your left mouse button?  

 

But also you're completely unhinged and read way more into my two sentences of text than I could have possibly sought to convey. The goal isn't to march all the elves to India and turn around only when they're afraid of falling off the world. It's to unify a bunch of 4 man shitter principalities who cannot put up any resistance, subjugate Elysium or Sutica, and build a nation out of what remains when the vanquished elven microstates either assimilate or quit. 

 

Functionally this is exactly the same thing you're suggesting. You would have the same petty squabbles under staff-enforced elven unity, except that you would have no victorious governing coalition, no conquering generals, and a leader selected based on staff asskissing instead of merit. The One Malinor Policy would collapse almost instantly, same as any nation that has been sacrilegiously conjured into existence by the staff. 

 

 

[ronin_champloo 5951]

druid bad. magic bad. shelf all magic

[Shmeepicus 3942]

What a read.

[Caelria 2618]

2 hours ago, monkeypoacher said:

But also you're completely unhinged...

...Functionally this is exactly the same thing you're suggesting. 

You got me, I'm unhinged and also bizarre. Our opinions are functionally the same but also I'm wrong.

Are you trying to change my mind or are you being performative?

 

I'm not suggesting you kill and subjugate every Elven settlement. I'm not suggesting every Elven settlement be wiped by the hand of god indiscriminately. I'm suggesting you stop approving new ego/schism settlements as an OOC catalyst for war or to undermine another community the new settlement's founders couldn't control/don't like (the political equivalent of quitting a job as a bartender then opening a new bar down the street to spite them) on a whim, and then enforce existing inactivity rules on the ones that are already dead and exist in name only. That's much more natural than someone on an alt coming in and conquering every Elven playerbase in some misguided pursuit of order.

[Ryloth 4312]

I wish the druid community could just get a big fat Thanos snap wipe like other magics have, and get some self-teach altars. It'd eliminate the upper echelon hugbox of authority controlling the entire magic with as many gates and gate policies as their settlements. Druidism is as big as Void magic, and it should be treated the same due to its size and presence -- and it's simply an antithetical area to Void magic anyhow, capable of undoing corruption, and the players tend to be extremely anti-void on their characters too.

 

I've only had a positive experience with rogue druids and (sometimes) the Father Circle, but that's typically only been in interactions with the NLs and only the NLs. Funny enough when logged onto other accounts, the Mother Circle provides positive interactions for me ... it's almost like a username holds some significant weight when regarding a reputation of antagonist anti-druid RP. They won't want you around if you're one of the names in their Discord they reserve headspace for with multi-page logs in the search bars.

 

I can't think of a better phrase other than "drain the swamp" when I think of how to fix the druidism community. It already takes six months to complete dedicancy unless you know a green-tag and give them an under-the-table something-or-other. You can see it first-hand with who (some, certainly not all) of the main druids are now, their application time gaps, and who they interact with. Cut-and-dry it's favoritism and bias. I just wonder when I'll lose attunement on the alt after they find out who I really am.

 

The magic of Druidism is one of the cooler things on LotC and it could really be used aggressively to combat a lot of the other running-wild magics across the universe we play in, but in the hands of the current players, it'll be slice-of-life interactions with a maybe-maybe-maybe eco-terror action taken out against another magic community. I'd love to see it more frequently -- and it does happen -- but it doesn't happen enough, and it's because of the bad examples at the top.

 

 

This is the problem with the druid community. Simple as.

 

15 hours ago, OhDeerLord said:

Ando Alur when it was floating? While that event was happening any attempts of using IC gained knowledge was blocked as being called Metagaming. We had a ST lock signs behind someone who legitimately broke in to places to investigate and break things. We were told by staff and players to leave it alone, so people could have their fun. We were blocked from doing things by being told 'It's a settlement, it falls under settlement conflict rules so you need a heist to do that' and then in the same week told 'It's a event location, you can't do that here'.

 

It took me and the boys two days to break in, and Werew0lf with his lads blew the city apart with PRO permission. I think the druids could pull it off -- and don't get me wrong, of course there's the OOC level given the PRO perms -- but if you ask Story Team I without a doubt believe if the Druids tried to turn off their voidal tear it'd happen. After all, the PRO consented to the bad outcomes for his city when he approved the tear's creation -- therefore he is liable for all damages that follow thereafter. That's what I was told.

 

Likewise now, you're more than allowed to go to the remnant corruption and try to purge it. Kind of like how I've gone to both Mother and Father circle to inform of Vasiyeva getting necro-corrupted by [redacted] necromancers for the past month, but nothing happened -- and now the city is torched as a result.