Feedback on the recent Rule Update: Cultural Pedophilia

[Unwillingly 11158]

writing this on mobile so formatting might not be incredible with this one

 

With the recent rule update, in-character acts of grooming involving a character under the age of 18 are now prohibited. I think we can all agree that it's a great and long overdue change. 

 

However...

 

This rule doesn't address scenarios I and many others feel to be problematic and dangerous in the same fashion that other questionable types of RP are: Cultural pedophilia. 

 

Unwillingly, what the f*ck is cultural pedophilia?

 

"Cultural pedophilia" is as an act in which a character romantically involves themselves with another party in a fashion that is allowed via server rules, but outright pedophilia in-character. For example, a 200 year old elf dating an 18 year old elf. 

 

According to server rules, this is allowed, since the character is 18 and is not physically a child.

 

Rape, grooming, brothel, prostitution and bestiality roleplay are prohibited in their entirety, even in the mention or implication of backstories. In fact, to my knowledge, concepts such as rape are non-existent, non-canon in our LOTC universe. If these are concepts that are so strongly barred from the server, why is the line not drawn at what is the 100% textbook definition of in-roleplay pedophilia?

 

Let's take something else into consideration. With this being something completely allowed, characters are also allowed to abuse this in-RP for self gain as opposed to reporting it OOCly. We've seen players use this claim of elven-pedophilia as in-RP propaganda against a community or individual. See last map. In order to allow certain younger characters to join their council, Irrinor lowered their age of consent from 50 to 30 in order to better accommodate these characters. They were RPly referred to as pedophiles by their aggressors.

 

While it may be reasonable to RPly criticize communities who do this, if it's a case of blatant in-character pedophilia, it's something that should be immediately reported as opposed to being allowed to fester and escalate as an "It's just roleplay" situation. 

 

I want to make it abundantly clear, I do not approve of any form of lowering the age of consent, even if culturally. I equally believe it's questionable for communities or cultures to be altering their respective age of consent. This is not an attempt to deflect RP backlash.The point I'm making is that these are very specific situations that should be handled with OOC rather than RP. 

 

"But what about new players?"
I've considered the fact that this might be something that slips most new players' minds. While the universal age of 18 rule might be pretty clean cut, the idea of a cultural age of consent wouldn't be immediately understood. It takes time to learn the ropes, especially gaining full comprehension of elven culture. New players should be granted leniency so long as what they did was an honest mistake.

 

"How do we enforce this?"
With any suggestion for a rule change, there will always be a,"But how can this be tracked?" Comment. Why have any rules at all if not every situation can be monitored? No rule on the server will completely prevent people from breaking it - there will always be people who try, and there will always be people who get away with it. However, by enforcing a ban on cultural RP-pedophilia, you allow players who partake in this type of RP to be punished. It becomes unacceptable as opposed to simply tolerated because of "but it's technically allowed," drivel.

 

This post is not meant to be an attack, but rather, a criticism. To my knowledge, this isn't a conversation I've seen to be heavily addressed, so I'm interested in seeing thoughts and feedback from players and ideally, the admin team. 
 

[monkeypoacher 6993]

some random teenager shouldn't get called out as a pedophile & harassed on the internet because his 300 year old elf dated a 30 year old elf, no matter how weird it is. do not roleplay a 30 year old elf as a child mentally but an adult physically. it is so much weirder. please get a grip elven roleplayers

[excited 10833]

5 minutes ago, monkeypoacher said:

some random teenager shouldn't get called out as a pedophile & harassed on the internet because his 300 year old elf dated a 30 year old elf, no matter how weird it is. do not roleplay a 30 year old elf as a child mentally but an adult physically. it is weird. please get a grip elven roleplayers

The “mental development” thing isn’t even strictly true, it’s purely a cultural enforcement. 90% of elves act like kids either way cuz they’re played by kids. Beyond that I got no horse in this race 

[Taketheshot 3834]

What the **** elves. 

[Unwillingly 11158]

10 minutes ago, monkeypoacher said:

some random 12-15 year old kid shouldn't get labeled as a pedophile & harassed on the internet because his 300 year old elf dated a 30 year old elf, no matter how weird it is. simply do not roleplay a 30 year old elf as a child. please get a grip elven roleplayers

 

I never said we should start labeling 12 year olds as pedophiles, nobody thinks that. I think we're all pretty aware of the fact that new players are most often younger and should be granted leniency when they make these mistakes. Don't get me wrong, I and many other players agree that people who roleplay 30 year old elves as teenagers or even toddlers is just as strange, but a 30 year old elf is still not culturally an adult, and have free reign to date a 300 year old elf since the server rules allow it. That's the focal point of this post

[TreeSmoothie 4896]

as someone who has directly suffered grooming & pedophilia on this horrid server five times over:

 

300 year old elves dating 18 year old elves is weird. Hell, I mean, I've literally seen people do weird shit and explicitly sexualize-- "my character has known this character since they were a baby. my character is 50 but their character is now 17! so now they will have affairs and children". I've seen people do incest rp.

 

It's blatantly disgusting. INRP, it's absolutely illegal and OOC I don't associate with the degenerates that RP that stuff. But, in all honesty, 

Old x young elf isn't inherently bad and thus shouldn't be against the rules. My character is a relatively young elf and I've had them in relationships with older elves, we just didn't ... Be weird about the roleplay. It really is that simple. But in cases like what I spoke about ("waiting" til legality) -- those should be illegal asf. It's just creepy and fetishized, not "for roleplay". There's a good line between them, and I feel like most people should be able to discern them.

[rukio 8910]

I remember getting berated for telling someone their character is culturally a pedophile for being 80+ trying to get a 20 year old elf or w/e to reproduce with them. 

[monkeypoacher 6993]

18 minutes ago, hateful boomer said:

The “mental development” thing isn’t even strictly true, it’s purely a cultural enforcement. 90% of elves act like kids either way cuz they’re played by kids. Beyond that I got no horse in this race 

 

i have seen it roleplayed both ways because it's a not particularly well-explained cultural tradition. seen people who really should know better playing a "physically mature" elf with the brain of a child, for reasons I am sure you can infer from context

 

and yes I would rather have the kids on this server not involved in romantic scenarios to begin with, but the demographics of this server (socially isolated, awkward early teens who are into roleplay) make it an inevitability as long as we permit it at all. we should just state clearly that we do not tolerate romantic roleplay and ban it proactively so that we don't end up with some kids on the wrong side of a witch hunt for "cultural pedophilia" or some other fantastic nonsense

 

14 minutes ago, ᴜɴᴡɪʟʟɪɴɢʟʏ said:

 

I never said we should start labeling 12 year olds as pedophiles, nobody thinks that. I think we're all pretty aware of the fact that new players are most often younger and should be granted leniency when they make these mistakes. Don't get me wrong, I and many other players agree that people who roleplay 30 year old elves as teenagers or even toddlers is just as strange, but a 30 year old elf is still not culturally an adult, and have free reign to date a 300 year old elf since the server rules allow it. That's the focal point of this post

 

this "elven age of consent/maturity" thing isn't really an idiom in the community like people who have done years of sweaty dominion rp probably think it is. is a 300 year old elf dating a 30 year old elf weird? absolutely. should we have to worry about any of this to begin with? no

[Werew0lf 12021]

37 minutes ago, monkeypoacher said:

some random teenager shouldn't get called out as a pedophile & harassed on the internet because his 300 year old elf dated a 30 year old elf, no matter how weird it is. do not roleplay a 30 year old elf as a child mentally but an adult physically. it is so much weirder. please get a grip elven roleplayers

literally just this 

[1_Language_1 1671]

Honestly if you just wanna take care of this elf shit, just say with rules that elves can't have relationships until 50... or that elves can't have relationships if the older elf is more than 2 times their age... if it's not accepted by the server's playerbase then why isn't it upheld by the server? That way there can be 50 with a 100 but not 50 with a 150.. just a suggestion.

 

honestly what other ideas do you have to stop this? i'm just throwing out a suggestion to get the brainstorming going with the other players

[argonian 12837]

1 hour ago, monkeypoacher said:

some random teenager shouldn't get called out as a pedophile & harassed on the internet because his 300 year old elf dated a 30 year old elf, no matter how weird it is. do not roleplay a 30 year old elf as a child mentally but an adult physically. it is so much weirder. please get a grip elven roleplayers

this

[TryaxReck 377]

ban all forms of roleplay bc none of you people are able to use critical thinking 


let me romance rp in peace its all i have now I don't have noble or spook friends to invite me to cool cliques 

[DahStalker 2846]

i think we should just shelf elves instead of khas

[Shiredom 1548]

Remove any mention of elves to cleanse this heresy and force them all to become Adunians or Humans.

[Carson 936]

2 hours ago, ᴜɴᴡɪʟʟɪɴɢʟʏ said:

in-character acts of grooming involving a character under the age of 18 are now prohibited

Wtf, that was allowed in the first place?!