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Let's Spread Lore: A Modest System Proposal


Zarsies
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1. I can see an argument that follows from this that applications needn't be made for a character, but rather, for a player. You don't apply for a TA for your necromancer, you yourself, the player, apply to be interviewed about whether or not you know enough about necromancy to guide people through learning it, yourself or otherwise.

 

2. Definitely needs checks and balances in the form of limitations. When you start a new character, you can choose [1] magic, or, you can only choose so many slots of magic to have them self-taught. Maybe you're required to make some kind of roleplay application that details how your character learnt the magic, who they are, some ideas of what they plan to do with it.

 

3. In furtherance to the previous point, I could see an initiative to create roleplay means by which you could justify learning these magics. More altars on the server itself for events, magic books, sure, but also starting locations and wandering event characters or organisations that can be used as justification. Maybe there's a school of wizards somewhere on the map which is run partly by players, but also partly by ET played mages who can pass magics on. This might lead toward a world in which player and staff run stories are brought together into single organisations which make magic stuff happen, not sure.

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I agree and disagree. If you taught a void magic and get to choose a magic to learn on a new character as a result, it shouldn't be something community and coven based. People can still act extremely powergamey & rude without having infractions- Necromancy heavily depends on your fellow spooks (for things like being revived) to be chill and availible, which, if people can just choose to learn the magic, gives no quality control to the coven. It also introduces the possibility of ooc plotting ('I dislike your coven so I'm making a new one'). It also erases the trials and other things people had to do before gaining that magic, which, though its not required by lore, groups still do for the flavor.

 

TLDR: I support this w/ common magics like some evocations, not dark magics. Those should still be found irp

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I do not want bans and ban history to be public knowledge. 

 

As for magic I think it's laughable that someone can PK their character and within the week of making a new one its given rare feats and everything they could possibly want due to OOC ties while other good roleplayers languish and suffer for not having those connections. Magic/feats/etc are a joke and a who you know OOC club and always will be. 

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Maybe I speak from a point of bias, as someone who has been tirelessly working to spread magic from what feels like an ever-stagnating Naztherak community, +1

 

This is going to be a bit of a vent, but I've been growing more and more jaded and discouraged with the state of a community I've been pouring my heart into trying to rebuild for just shy of a year now. I want more players. I want an actual community to roleplay with and, as much as I appreciate the small bundle of proactive players we do already have, roleplaying with the same 3 people is not sufficient for storybuilding and RP longevity in the long run. I want more players. I want an actual personal community to expand and interact with, people to plot and scheme against others with.

 

But I feel like I have gotten nowhere, and I'm still stuck where I was when I first made my TA last year. We've had small bursts of storyline and activity, but this is a community of 12 or so naz MAs and only about 3 or 4 of which are active. I dont know if these are average numbers for a dark magic, but if it is, if shouldn't be. The community I desperately want to build still feels like it's in the same rut of inactivity it was in two years ago and I don't know why, and I don't mean to throw shade, but above all I feel like I'm the only one putting in effort. The more I think about how to build my community, what I can do to spread the magic and bring in new faces, the more discouraged I get. I'm frustrated, sad, and am admittedly very close to calling it quits on trying to build Naztherak as a magic.

 

I just want people to build a story with. I want collaboration and a revitalized community, and I have a bit of hope that this might help :(

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As an innocent no magic simply stab with sword man, as GOD intended...

Isn't people just stacking magic and magic being a circle jerk, gained OOC through your friends already not only a stereotype but actually how things are? Enshrining that as an actual feature, passed on from one persona to the next is a... to be light, weird idea.

 

no it would not be better if it were more accessible, there are already enough spooks and maniacs with magic running around, don't need more. it's not even interesting anymore, its just dull if everyone has something or things aren't actually like, rare. It's all just... *shrug* oh look that again... wow...


Ban history etc - no.

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Sure, PKs move the narrative along and help keep things from stagnating too heavily. Hell, CAs should have a set time limit centered around creating a narrative that's interesting for other players to engage with as well. On topic though, easily gained and easily lost is the general vibe and theme of MC in its entirety. All for things being easy to get, master and replace. Assuming clear and easily followed guidelines are present.

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7 minutes ago, Unwillingly said:

Maybe I speak from a point of bias, as someone who has been tirelessly working to spread magic from what feels like an ever-stagnating Naztherak community, +1

 

This is going to be a bit of a vent, but I've been growing more and more jaded and discouraged with the state of a community I've been pouring my heart into trying to rebuild for just shy of a year now. I want more players. I want an actual community to roleplay with and, as much as I appreciate the small bundle of proactive players we do already have, roleplaying with the same 3 people is not sufficient for storybuilding and RP longevity in the long run. I want more players. I want an actual personal community to expand and interact with, people to plot and scheme against others with.

 

But I feel like I have gotten nowhere, and I'm still stuck where I was when I first made my TA last year. We've had small bursts of storyline and activity, but this is a community of 12 or so naz MAs and only about 3 or 4 of which are active. I dont know if these are average numbers for a dark magic, but if it is, if shouldn't be. The community I desperately want to build still feels like it's in the same rut of inactivity it was in two years ago and I don't know why, and I don't mean to throw shade, but above all I feel like I'm the only one putting in effort. The more I think about how to build my community, what I can do to spread the magic and bring in new faces, the more discouraged I get. I'm frustrated, sad, and am admittedly very close to calling it quits on trying to build Naztherak as a magic.

 

I just want people to build a story with. I want collaboration and a revitalized community, and I have a bit of hope that this might help :(


God i feel this on a spiritual level mate, keep at it and keep trying new things. It feels like i went through the exact same thing with the Mysticism community. Wishing you the best of luck with it <3

As for this post, i wholeheartedly love this concept, i've got plans to make at least Mysticism more open for the general populace to get involved with and the ideas offered above would also go a long way towards enabling more engagement with certain Lores.

+1 from me

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+1 players should get the chance to experience the fantasy aspect of a fantasy server
but im unsure how un-gatekeeping magics by letting someone who's had the magic for years to self-teach themselves again will solve it. we just need more magics and feats that can be self-taught to begin with.


i also support lowering the amount of time required to master magics. voidal magic taking an obscene amount of months to get better at while the magic is extremely boring and barely useful until maybe T3 and your persona is too physically weak to do anything is honestly such a boring experience. pls lower the time required for someone to actually enjoy magic

3 hours ago, Zarsies said:

I want everyone to permakill their characters. I think having a PK (or otherwise ultimate shelving, you get me, sunsetting is cool too) as an option in the background of your mind for a character is good and healthy. When it comes to the state of RP I consider people being open and willing to PK to be a sign of good health; when you aren't covetous, protective, and defensive about a character you are avoiding a font of many agonies. Thus the timesink of learning magic and the rarity of player content leads to OOCly motivated behavior: unrealistic defensiveness and foresight, subtle metagaming and/or powergaming, and ultimately a resistance to PKing and avoiding or kneecapping conflict. I find that clinging to be a sort of pain and, pardon my French, a sort of RP-immaturity. I don't mean to shame those who don't PK, obviously LotC has a deeply ingrained mechanic to allow characters to endure between monk resurrection and no enforced aging, but in the end I believe it to be good to allow yourself to experience it and always expect or be open to it. There's catharsis and great satisfaction in conclusions.

 


also a good idea. being able to PK a persona and provide a cool narrative. my main issue with it is that when you're in a position where your persona HAS to be alive because you're building and running a community, and getting the magic just extremely time consuming let alone extremely hard to get again because you never know if another persona of yours is even gonna get that chance again, it's just hard to actually allow that persona to PK, rather than keep running that community that you've been with for a long time, and provide events and other narratives over time.
as unwillingly and white wolf said, building a community is ******* hard, and i've always been against the idea of gatekeeping a magic for only 3 players so long as the RPer in question is decent enough to be taught

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As much as I would like to agree, no. There are lore pieces that can and will be abused if spread to the wider playerbase, and it would give enforcement staff a field day dishing out blacklists and lore team amending lore because various players simply can't be trusted with it.

 

Ultimately it feels very much like a silver-platter policy after briefly skimming the post. Magic and feats should be earned by players who have proven themselves trustworthy and through IC effort, rather than having it served to them after doing nothing and because the 'magic is cool and powerful'.

 

I see void mages powergaming strength and lack of fatigue, overpowered casting and violations of redlines.

 

I see alchemists only taking alchemy to earn minas on the side without reading the flavor lore.

 

I see many others taking magic because its powerful even though flavor-wise it wouldn't fit the character and the only reason they're doing it is to minmax.

 

 

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I think it's a more fundamental issue of lore as a concept being inaccessible/indigestible by a lot of the more junior playerbases (i.e., humans). This attitude has certainly gotten better in recent maps, but I think this issue is perfectly encapsulated by the fact that there exists a substantial demographic of "magic RPers", whose focus on the server is primarily engaging in these magics and seldom proliferating out amongst the broader playerbase or having these magics form a part of their experience (and not just an individual character; obviously) rather than the crux of their experience. I cannot support the idea of cementing this concept, which seems like it might be enabled by your proposals.

 

It's not a meme to suggest that a lot of OOC communities and friendgroups have formed along the boundaries of mundane and magic -- this is amply evident from just me looking at my LotC Discord servers. 

 

With that said, your proposals only really service one side of that boundary, the existence of which I don't think should reasonably be denied. The more pressing priority for the Lore Team, in my opinion, in any kind of reform, should be brainstorming as to ways to actually make magic and lore as a whole more digestible and interactable to the more junior 40-50% of the playerbase. I won't get into any personal ideas as to how to do that because I'm meant to be studying and this isn't the point of your thread, but I did want to comment I don't think this does help spread lore in my opinion, as someone originating from the 'mundane' side of the boundary.

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45 minutes ago, Moribundity said:

I see void mages powergaming strength and lack of fatigue, overpowered casting and violations of redlines.

 

I see alchemists only taking alchemy to earn minas on the side without reading the flavor lore

 

this already happens

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As in all things I entirely agree with Zarsies

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4 hours ago, Zarsies said:

What are your thoughts on a system where self teaching and grandfathering are more open? For example, say a player has had a TA in a magic and fully taught 3 players across - I don't know, 1 year? - and has received 0 infractions in that time. Therein lies an implication of trust. I propose we may give such a player a sort of pass, whenever they wish once their TA-having character PKs or is otherwise ultimately shelved, to self-teach and/or be grandfathered into the given player content as they wish.

 

I've been saying this for a while. I really think that lore should be a bit more open and less paperwork to encourage roleplay and negative developments for characters (and ultimately their death).

 

A lot of the server lean back from PK because in order to master XYZ it can take literal OOC months of their time and atop of this particular lore pieces are very restrictive. Sometimes you just get tired of a persona, and would love to make a new one with a particular roleplay concept to help drive RP but then you sit there and go "Man now I got to get out the phonebook and hit up all my ooc contacts".

 

I think this should for sure be a thing albiet one of the few things I would want to see moderated more / have more consideration when accepting these sorts of approvals. 

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