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Posts posted by Xarkly
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28 minutes ago, Minuvas said:
I might be in the minority but I like a large diversity of realms. Under the old system I felt forced to align under large nations with ossified player groups. Breaking into these groups is difficult without prescribing to their idea of RP. It allows for very little about to venture out on your own. Combined with activity checks, this made leaving your own realm toxic.
Finally we can explore the map.
15 man player groups are fine. I don't see why ever nation or realm needs to cater to everyone. Maybe it's just a dedicated group of bros playing with each other and they want more than a 10x 10 house in Haense where they have no real agency over their RP.
You played in Oren, well then you can't play in my group because you were Oren.
The ability to experience multiple groups, advance in them, is a great boost for this server.
People actively try to kill small group activity on this server to promote their own groups. This has finally somewhat gone away.
What you call bloat I see as choice. Realms die here and evaporate and it balances alliances etc.
Please keep current system.
This is where the balancing act gets kind of tough to manage, but when I saw I think the server as a whole would benefit from would-be Realms being pushed to go under pre-existing Realms, I don't mean a state of affairs where everyone is crammed into a mega-city or beholden to one capital.
I'm not sure if some of what I wrote was misunderstood, but I absolutely agree that you should be able to experience multiple groups and multiple niches. Like I say in the post, part of what makes LotC good is that it's got such a diverse range of roleplay to participate in. I'm not saying that these niches should be limited or inhibited.
What I'm saying is that identical niches shouldn't exist independently because it usually serves to dilute that niche as a whole. In the same vein, every nation shouldn't have to cater for everyone, but those that do should ideally include would-be Realms that also want to exist within that niche. If there's a group that does genuinely embody a niche that's not encapsulated by any other Realm, then, like I mention in the post, those are an example of a group that probably do deserve to get their own tile to try their niche out.
A big cause of stagnation is a lack of internal dynamics and competition, which a lot of the time comes from competing ideals within that Realm, whether that's a vassal trying to get more power for itself or someone trying to push a change for the Realm internally. It's things like this that serve to best drive that conflict and make stakes, though at the cost of stability. The best example that comes to mind here (outside of the context of a war) is Orenian parliament before Haense's independent where you had groups with different agendas competing politically, and it was great because there were real stakes.
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1 hour ago, AndrewTech said:
I think I agree with most everything you've said here. Honestly, I believe that staff should start by 1.) publishing activity data again and 2.) enforcing activity checks to try to get this problem of overbloat under control.
I also think it might be healthy to distinguish different types of nations as well though. For instance, all nations, no matter their size, are currently considered to be "realms." Last map, settlements existed as well, which were traditionally very easy to create but didn't enjoy the same privileges as a nation.
To correct this problem of overbloat, I would propose the return of settlements. Settlement status should theoretically be as easy to get as a realm in the current application process. However, settlements should only be allowed to hold a single tile under this classification. To incentivize remaining a settlement, I would suggest dropping upkeep to 100 minas for their tile.
A separate application for nations, or realms if you really wanted to keep the name, should be implemented to be able to have a multi-tile nation. If you grow to the point that you can afford bringing on vassals or buying more land, then it should be easy to compete in a more rigorous applicatory environment and pay more maintenence dues.
By reclassifying all of these one-tile states as settlements, nation overbloat will diminish, and new nations will be disincentivized from forming outright.
From what Staff had said before, Realms were created as an all-encompassing entity because functionally Nations and Settlements from previous maps were effectively identical. I think that's a fair assessment, but I agree with you in the sense that I definitely think it would have been better if Staff had instead tried to develop Settlements as their own distinct thing (as pre-Nation entities) rather than just basically affirm them as Nations while taking no other steps to make barriers for becoming a Nation.
Holding a single-tile makes sense (I can't remember if this was a feature of Settlements previously), and there are other Nation perks that could in theory be withheld (treasuries, warclaims?) but I'd cautious about limiting them for limitations sake (i.e., withholding these perks doesn't necessarily help with anything).
But yeah, I definitely think the distinction being brought back would be helpful if for no other reason than to allow lower requirements for becoming a Settlement and higher requirements for becoming a Nation.
57 minutes ago, Spoopy_Duck said:I think another issue that causes these massive empty realms is the fact that every tile has a valuable resource (except amethyst) so keeping a one tile realm unless you settle on netherite is just a pure disadvantage in any sort of conflict scenario. This causes the drive to just buy land strictly for war economy purposes resulting in realms with way more land than they honestly need imo. (There is a lot of netherite in the north of the map leading me to think this is partly why many are choosing to settle up there as well)
Yeah, though I will say I don't hugely mind the tile-based resource system and the incentive of conquering to gain access to XYZ resource. I think this has only played out to a very marginal degree just because the server's culture still doesn't facilitate easy conquest, but yeah, the system as a whole would work better if you could instead buy something like a 'Resource Outpost' on a node tile that might allow you to harvest the materials without buying the tile and whacking a dead vassal on it just to be in compliance with the rules.
34 minutes ago, argonian said:Close your ears when Haensers tell you about international conflict and the Social Darwinism of "Might makes Right" and the "Strong eat the Meek" because they spent 99% of their history demanding the admins defend them from such strandards.
It's 2024 and not 2019 or whenever 2emps actually was, so not sure what relevance that has at all to Realm Bloat today. I don't even get the point of this being a jab at someone; I think the only person who played in that period of Haense who actually still plays today is Pureimp. Should probably go back to Inner Sanctum with bad takes instead of lashing out blindly.
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1 hour ago, squakhawk said:
Unfortunately I don't think there will be change anytime soon because it's not just my decision to make. maybe i'm wrong though, we'll see.
Appreciate the insight.
One thing I do think is unfortunate is that for some reason Admins don't feel like they can speak freely on the issue? I don't really understand why this is the case at all, and I actually think it's a big contributor to the issue. People are frustrated because they don't actually know what it is Admins are trying to achieve here, and both your input here and 60th's comments in Mod Discord have done the opposite of clarify the state of affairs.
Is it a case you're both beholden to dysfunctional senior Admin policies, or something else? At least understanding the basis of the policy (or lack thereof) would be a helpful step towards comprehension.
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- Popular Post
- Popular Post
LET'S TALK ABOUT REALMS
SpoilerThis one’s been cooking over the last few days.
The topic of ‘Realms’ (which are now synonymous with Nations) and ‘Realm Bloat’ have recently been in contention ever since players started noticing the exorbitant rate of growing Realms on Aevos, largely thanks to the Admin’s approval of nearly all new Realm Applications. It’s been discussed a lot in Moderation Discord, and Tree made a post on it recently that you should check out here, but the issue boils down to the fact that LotC currently hosts a grand total of 21 unique Realms, with more Applications pending and on the way.
This is going to be my own take on the issue, which will try to explain (1) what the current process is, (2) which it’s bad, (3) why players don’t have the current tools to realistically deal with the problem, and (4) what a better solution might be.
I: CURRENT REALM APPLICATIONS
To understand this issue, it’s important to look at the current process of creating new Realms.
If you want to make a new Realm, there’s four components to the process:
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Submit a Realm Application: You can find the template for these here, but you’ve probably seen them often enough by now. Basically, you answer some straightforward questions about your Realm, its lore, its structure, etc. As we’ll see in a minute, these questions (and ergo the majority of the application) are entirely useless.
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Collect 15 Signatures: For those of you who played on Axios, you might remember the signature process for applying for old land charters -- this is basically the same thing. 15 people have to comment on your Realm Application as an indicator that “yep, I am going to roleplay in this place”. For the same reason this system was abolished on Axios, this is very one-dimensional and very silly. It’s not at all a difficult thing to get 15 people to comment on anything, and, even if these signatures are given with the best intent of roleplaying there (which all of them won’t be), intention doesn’t always translate into action. Starting activity from scratch is an enormous undertaking and usually requires leaders to be unreasonably active to drive RP until their settlement kicks off, which rarely happens. We’ve known signatures are not an accurate indicator of activity for over seven years since the system failed in Axios.
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Pay 5,000 Mina: This is simple enough, it’s just a deterrent from spamming Realm Applications (which is undermined by the issues discussed in this post), but, when paired with the costs of buildings etc., this is a reasonable aspect of the application. 5,000 isn’t a small number by any means, but it’s not colossal, either.
- Soft-Approval: This is one of the bigger problems of the application process, since there is actually no review of the contents of the application. The Admins say as much in the rules: “although all fields [of the application] are required, the application is mostly just for tracking purposes and collecting signatures”. This firstly begs the question of why bother getting people to fill out the application at all if it doesn’t matter, and it’s especially nonsense that the application mandates a 1,000-word minimum submission for your Realm’s lore. In the same vein, there’s evidently no qualitative review of the merits of the application and why, as asked in the application, this applicant can’t fit inside of the many pre-existing Realms.
So, long story short, the current Realm Application process will let you make a new nation from scratch by: (1) submitting an application form, the contents of which are not reviewed nor relevant; (2) getting 15 people to comment on your application; and, (3) paying 5,000 mina. Staff do not conduct any kind of review on the content of the application or its impact on the server, which is what gets the problem going.
Tldr; Realms are very easy to create.
II: WHY THIS IS A PROBLEM
Okay, so, Realms can be made with minimal barriers - why is that actually a problem?
Like I mentioned earlier, one of the main criticisms this system is getting is enabling Nation/Realm ‘Bloat’ to a far worse degree than in previous maps. Before we talk in detail about what bloat actually is, it’s worth mentioning the two competing ideals when it comes to deciding how Realms should be created.
Micro v. Macro: LotC is a server that tries to market itself as a very sandbox experience where you can forge your own story in a world populated by hundreds of other players -- the server’s advertising mantra of “become a king, an emperor, a wizard, or a warrior. Your path is your own; what will you choose?” is on our website’s homepage. While this has been memed on from time to time, it is true that one of LotC’s strengths is player agency. It is a major appeal for the server to say “you can make your own nation and become a king!”, and this is some of the agency that the Realm Applications are (admirably) trying to realize.
But, when you’re playing on a server with lots of other people, your agency is naturally limited by the agency of the other players. In a nutshell, it’s a balancing act between letting players pursue their ideal fantasy experience (such as wanting to become a warlord or king), and making sure this pursuit doesn’t harm the experience of other players.
So, does being easily able to create a Realm harm the experience of other players?
My answer is yes, and this is where we get to unpacking the issue of Realm Bloat.
Realm Bloat: So, what exactly does this mean? The term is pretty self-explanatory in that it describes a state of affairs where there’s a lot of Nations/Realms existing at once (like there is right now). But why is this a bad thing? If it lets players pursue their idea of fun and make their own kingdom, what’s the big deal?
Like I mentioned earlier, LotC currently has 21 Realms (as of the annexation of Stassion yesterday), which is far higher than it has been in years past (previous maps would usually regard an excess of 10 as too many). Let’s say LotC has a population of 200 on a given night; while some nations will always be hubs with a large activity percentage, the Bloat issue largely comes from the balkanization of the smaller Realms. This could mean that 100~ players are split up and scattered across their various Realms, trying to keep them active and relevant.
So, put simply, Realm Bloat represents the dilution of activity.
There’s not necessarily less people playing, but it can sometimes feel like that if there’s enclaves of 5~ players spread out across the map. I’ll put it like this, and you can tell which sounds better for the overall health of the server:
- 50+ players regularly active inside a single Realms; or,
- 5 players spread out across 10 Realms.
When you have a highly-populated Realm, this facilitates stuff like guilds, armies, government, knights, magic, religion, courts, vassals, conflict, and dozens of other niches. These are good, because they, in turn, drive activity within that nation without any particular people having to ‘grind’ activity. Put simply, roleplay breeds more roleplay.
In a community limited by tiny numbers, the same isn’t true. Instead, it typically devolves into a few individuals breaking their backs to grind activity, or, as we often see, the Realm falling inactive. It would be a different story if there was potential for these Realms to grow, but in a climate where we have 21 of these Realms and several applications pending & on-the-way, it’s hard to argue that there is room for meaningful growth.
Even then, you could set aside all this is not for another problem …
Isolation: So much of the server’s history and memorable periods have come from roleplay between nations, whether that’s from fighting wars, building empires, etc. The main boon from Realm-to-Realm interaction is a sense of dynamism and the immersion of a wider world, with a wider story. Conflict is the mother of all stories, but in a server where most communities are conflict-averse, this leads to stagnation.
In other words, one of the main issues current Realm Bloat has is that the majority of Realms are isolated and inwards-focus. In other words, there’s a commitment to avoiding other Realms. To be fair, this is a natural instinct while building up a new community, but the consequence is still that a new Realm with this policy (i.e., nearly all of them) don’t drive any Realm-to-Realm roleplay.
I don’t bring this point up with a view to identifying a solution per se (since, like I said, preservation is a natural instinct when starting up), but to further highlight that the benefits of Realm Bloat definitely do not outweigh the issues.
III: INSUFFICIENT TOOLS
A problem might not always be a problem if methods exist to deal with it.
In the case of Realm Bloat, Staff have taken the position that the issue is one for players to solve themselves. There are tools to deal with this problem -- chief among them are diplomacy (i.e., convincing a fledgling Realm to vassalize under a stronger, pre-existing Realm), and warclaiming (i.e., conquering a weaker Realm).
But, while these tools do exist on paper, in reality they’re not really feasible solutions to Realm Bloat.
Part of the problem is the culture that easy Realm creation has made. For lack of a better word, this does feel something like a sense of entitlement to unburdened land. What I mean by this is that it’s not exactly an easy sell for a strong Realm to convince a weaker one to join them, because … well, why would they? As an independent Realm with few barriers to creation, you don’t don’t have to answer to anyone either IRP or OOC. Your culture and niche is unfettered by that wider Realm, and you yourself can do whatever you like. Even if your sandcastle is tiny, you’re still the King of it -- for many of our players (especially younger ones), this is a decisive factor.
The most obvious reason why a small Realm would merge with a bigger one is for protection, but, again, the reality is that this is an uncompelling factor. While raids can and do happen outside of war, they don’t happen to the extent where a small Realm feels the need for protection (in fact, even big Realms struggle to fight raids by PvP-centric groups). The end result is that there’s no real reason for a small Realm leader to give up their independence for a diplomatic union.
This leaves us with a big Realm warclaiming a small one to take it over. Again, this sounds fine in theory, but it doesn’t compute with the way the server and its culture operate. This simply boils down to a balance of costs -- is it worth a Realm spending the mina to warclaim and annex a smaller one? If we consider that some new Realms do appear to be placing themselves in out-of-the-way tiles, this can make warclaims fairly pricey. For pure example’s sake, if we look at Ravenswood’s Realm Application, it looks as if it would cost close to a minimum for a minimum of 50-mina per player for the nearest Elven tile (I’m not sure if Talarnorr is still a thing, but we’ll use that as an example) to reach Ravenswood for a warclaim, so 500 mina for every 10 players.
That cost alone isn’t wild, but this is before accounting for the subsequent Enclave upkeep and the general complications of having new land that can be an enormous distance away from your actual Realm. Paired with the general headaches of organising war, frequent accusations of harassment when targeting a small community, and gear costs, it’s easy to see why most Realm leaders would decide that it’s not worth trying to absorb a small Realm (absent any other factors).
Even if they did, the ease with which new Realms can be created again is further undermining -- there is a 2-month cooldown on a group from re-making their Realm if it’s conquered, from the point of view of tackling Realm Bloat as a whole, warclaiming is definitely not worthwhile.
IV: TOWARDS A SOLUTION
How, then, should this issue be tackled?
It’s a difficult problem to solve when we’re in this deep and have 21 Realms and more on the way. You can’t realistically roll-back these newer Realms or create conditions where they’ll be forced to vassalize, so any solution will take time to have an effect, anyway.
That said, I think that solution already lies in Realm Applications. While Admins for some reason have taken the stance that the content of these Applications don’t matter (again, all that matters is your 15 buddies and your 5,000 mina), the answers applicants put in these forms is the handle Staff need to judge the actual merits of a Realm Application.
The Niche Standard: There’s one particular question on the Realm Application that should serve as the handle on this issue, and it’s this one: “How does your settlement offer a unique niche not already found in an existing polity on the server?”.
When we say “niche”, we normally mean a particular flavour of roleplay that every Realm tends to have as a general guide for their culture and style - this can range from high-fantasy Gondorian-esque (like Numendil), to low-fantasy Slavic mediaeval (like Haense), and everything else in between. These niches shape a nation from its architecture to the different kinds of roleplay you can experience within them, and the diversity of Realms with different niches is a big selling point for LotC -- there’s something for everybody.
Multiple Realms inhabiting the same niche, though, is a problem.
A Gondor nation is great for attracting like-minded classical fantasy enjoyers to build something together, but if there’s two Realms with that same niche, then surely that only serves to dilute the niche - instead of a large body working together to build that niche, it’s pointlessly divided. When a niche is already occupied, Admins should definitely be denying a Realm Application that wants to fill the same niche and encourage them to go under the existing Realm.
But why be a Baron when you can be a King?: Obviously, the issue the above solution would run into is Realm Applicants arguing something along the line of “well, I could do a better job at this niche …”, “I don’t like the Nation Leader of the Realm filling this niche” … etc. While these concerns will sometimes be valid, this ties back into what I mentioned already about a certain entitlement to Realms - since they’re handed out so freely - and there’s no compelling reason to ever go under another Realm. Why would you give up your independence to answer to someone else?
This will be a natural and perpetual complaint, and, in dealing with it, we have to remember the balance between the Realm Applicant and the rest of the server. Limiting player agency in this regard is definitely a good thing, and I’ll list a couple of reasons as to why:
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Making Groups Work Together is Dynamic: A large reason why a lot of Realms feel so internally stale these days is because of a lack of dynamism and conflict. Stable Realms these days so often struggle with stagnation because of this, paired with an apparent void of ambition within its non-leading players, because, again, anyone with ambition can just go create their own Realm with ease. However, in a situation like I mentioned above where a group that would have made their own Gondor realm instead works under an existing Realm, it not only boosts numbers but can create dynamism and competition as the former group might try to work their way to the top of that Realm themselves, so that they can be the big dogs. A system like this is ideal because it allows new ideas to surface, and the best ones to come out on top to keep niches fresh, rather than everyone doing their own thing without any contest and stagnating.
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Nation Status should be Inherited, not Created: This is a big one in preventing Realm Bloat. In an ideal world, I don’t think there should be Realm Applications at all (though I will list some exceptions a bit later); instead, if you want to be a Realm, then you and your group should have to achieve that status in roleplay.
How?
Again, this boils down to a product of dynamic interaction. Realms are difficult to run, and so it doesn’t make sense that they’re not difficult to achieve. Having a group work their way up within an existing Realm not only vindicates that group’s activity, but also their ability to run and maintain a Realm to begin with. Whether that’s being affirmed as heir through peaceful means, or usurping a throne in a coup, these are far more organic means of Realm creation and self-regulating means of keeping your nation fresh and active.
It is a valid point to make that this may not always lead to OOC good faith, but I think we as a server do need to move more in a direction of dynamism and energy instead of stagnation, towards which something like this is a necessary step.
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“But I can’t get land :(“: This isn’t a reason for limiting player agency, but it is an important argument to address for this system. It is true that some existing Realms are quite stingy when it comes to giving groups land within their nation, usually from the perspective of stability, but it’s not accurate to say that this is the case for all Realms. Smaller Realms that grow often do so because they let various groups settle in their land and bolster their overall strength, and this remains true to this day. I often find that this argument is better interpreted as “but I can’t get land in the place that I want it”.
But even if it was true that no Realm was willing to hand out land from the get-go to an aspiring junior Realm, this shouldn’t be a huge deterrent, either. Particularly in human circles, so many factions (i.e, Noble Houses) have risen to prominence simply by getting a manor in a city and conducting an active family through it. This is another example of a self-affirmation of activity that a group does actually have the tools to grow as an eventual Realm, and, in cases like these, they’ll often be awarded with a keep and tracts of land in time.
With the above understanding of niches in mind, let’s look at some Realm Applications currently pending and some accepted over the last few months. I apologise to any Realm leaders if this comes off as criticism; it’s not aimed at you, but the Realm system:
- Gotrek Union: A Dwarven industrial settlement with a focus on lore like Golemancy/alchemy. Its only attempt to differentiate its niche from Urguan is “... the settlement offers a more unique style of roleplay - that being one not governed by leaders or kings, but instead one led by its head of operations”. This not only doesn’t make sense (head of operations is a leader), but it’s not a niche.
- Ravenmire (not sure if this still exists): A magical settlement that cites the incorporation of alchemy and clockwork as its standout features. Its niche is difficult to define, but it has repeated mentions of “progress” and “evolution”. This is no discernable reason why this niche could not be filled in an existing Realm.
- Vikela: This appears to represent the current “Sutica” niche, which is, in essence, the lack of a niche and defines itself as a gathering place for characters that don’t fit in elsewhere. On its merits, it is difficult to see how the Application’s answer it’s niche being populated by tradesmen warrants a new niche (economics is inherent in any city). A self-proclaimed desire for freedom in a monarchy does just seem to be a product of every player wanting their own sandcastle.
- Aeltarys: A settlement with extreme Targaryen/Game of Thrones inspirations. The unique class structure cited as its niche isn’t elaborated to feature any practical distinctions from nobility in any existing human nation, and while it’s dragon-based religion is notable, there exists non-religious nations wherein it could be practised, and even then it could be adapted to fit within existing religions (i.e., folklore-based spins and sects).
- Vlachia: This one is notable for its actual history on the server, but fails to say why it could not exist within an existing Realm. It’s puzzling why this didn’t vassalize under Veletz, which it lists as a nation in which it previously participated.
- Ravenswood: This defines itself as a “true melting pot of people … we welcome everyone and remain neutral”. This appears to mimic the niche of Vikela precisely, while also adhering to the tenets of isolation which this post discusses as problematic.
Of the above six Realms examined, there is no identifiable reason why any of them could not exist within a current Realm and serve to bolster that playerbase, create dynamism, and nurture themselves in an environment where there’s not a risk of going inactive and populating the map with dead builds reminiscent of the free-build era. This is not to say that each of these should be doomed to stay as vassals - instead, it should be part of the road to becoming a realm. It would be much healthier, for instance, to see Ravenswood work together with Vikela for their niche, for Veletz to sponsor Vlachia’s conquest of Haense, etc.
The point I am trying to make by this is that this is the kind of critical thinking Admins need to engage in for the wellbeing of their own server. With that in mind, I will say I think there’s two instances where Admins should consider approving a Realm Application with the above withstanding:
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An Actual New Niche: This speaks for itself, but Realm Applications should be a tool for new niches that are actually new and unique. While I will always advocate for new groups to grow themselves within an existing Realm and either take over that Realm or expand from there, I do think there could be a place for some new Realms via Application. An example doesn’t immediately come to mind because I do personally believe most niches can be facilitated in the vast network of existing Realms, but Farfolk cultures is probably a vague indicator.
- Roleplay Events: What I mean by this is when a roleplay event leads to a new Realm being made. A good example of this is a successful rebellion, or a vassal being granted independence. More loosely, I also think cases where it makes roleplay sense for a Realm to form at alright - think Balian, where a huge chunk of Oren went into exodus after the Brothers’ War.
I'll bring this ramble to an end at this point.
It's a difficult issue to manage, mainly because of that balance of facilitating players looking for the freedom to do what their want with roleplay and preserving the overall wellbeing of the server. That said, I feel like I've gone into pretty explicit detail as to why the wellbeing of the server isn't served through Realm Bloat. Ultimately, I'd hope that Admins will reflect on their policy and the kind of server they're looking to foster, and change their approach to Realm creation accordingly.
Have a good Sunday folks.
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providence cathedral box looked better
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Pagan he may have been, Friar Villorik offered the King's soul a prayer so that the Lord God might guide him to the First Sky.
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Despite his best efforts, Villorik found himself humming the bloodthirsty tune throughout the weeks before battle.
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Friar Villorik held little love for the Haeseni royals and their schemes, from the sinful adultery of Marius Audemar, to King Georg, who had put diplomats to the sword.
The White Flame, however, was an exception.
He would forever be glad to raise his blade for her.
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"Let the end begin," vowed Villorik.
21 -
The sun broke through the grey pall around midday.
Friar Villorik sat atop his destrier as it wound through the grasslands north of Hippo's Gorge. Behind him, the axels and wood of the wagon being pulled by the destrier creaked under the weight of Haeseni dead, with their gold-black cloaks wrapped around their lifeless forms as shrouds.
Despite that, Villorik felt at ease.
Their deaths had been far from in vain.
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Friar Villorik sat unblinking at his campfire, and stared into the burning kindling.
As he grew older and wiser, he felt he understood the will of God's Light less and less. These last weeks, he had found himself in a mental mire as he tried to puzzle out whether the carnage unfolding upon the world was an upset wrought by the Shadow, or the will of the Light as some kind of test.
He had since decided it did not matter.
Whether Covenant or Alliance, there were but two paths forward.
The Void, and the Skies.
The Queen of Numendil's proclamation only served to affirm which path Villorik would trod.
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- Popular Post
- Popular Post
IN THE NAME OF THE QUEEN
SpoilerThe hooves of Villorik’s mare crunched against the frosted earth.
The wind stirred the warpriest’s greying, raven locks as he trot down the Heartlands road. He had long since left behind him the ruined pearly stones of Breakwater, the gaping craters of Brasca, and the trodden expanse of Westmark the night before. Now, as the spring sun peeked its head over the tree-lined horizon and cast long, golden shadows across the land, he entered the borders of Veletz proper.
He gave his mare’s neck an idle path as he kept his narrowed eyes fixed on the road ahead. His grey-black cloak shifted in the wind whenever it gusted, and, as the sun’s golden rays grew longer and brighter, the light flashed against the hilt of his platemail, his the daemonsteel sabre belted to his waist, and the silverworked Hussariyan cross around his neck. He passed a few serfs about their morning work,who eyed him with scepticism from afar as they tried to discern whether he was a lone raider, but he passed them without a second glance.
By the time the sun had reared its head in full, he came to the first hamlet some hours south of Brasca. When they noticed the mailed horseman, the roughspun-clad serfs gripped their pitchworks, hoes, and hammers as they huddled together near the hamlet’s well, and wives ushered their children inside in frantic voices as the men stared Villorik down.
The Friar brought his mare to heel some thirty feet for them, and for a moment he only watched their grim-set faces. Finally, he reached to his waist, but it was not his sword he drew.
“I require a message delivered,” he said calmly, and the sun sparkled on the mina in Villorik’s hand.
By midday, that message reached Winhburg.
_____________________
“You who are taken by the Shadow,
I am the Friar Villorik. I come in the name of Amaya of Venzia, Queen of Haense, White Flame of Valdev.
I come alone. Send unto the field a son of Horen to duel in your name, and the Light shall favour the righteous victor.
I will come at the tolling of the Terces bell tomorrow.”
Spoilerdm if you want to set up a pk duel tomorrow, assuming the rp doesn't get voided by mods due to the investigation
40 -
"The Holy Light takes many forms, it seems," Friar Villorik mumbled. Whatever form it took, the Lord's will would be done.
6 -
Light favour you,
I know not which archives you have studied, nor through which experiences you have lived, but I am pleased to recognise that we are of a similar mind, Davide of Furnestock. For indeed, as you observe, the might of the Church was once so that it could quake and mould the mortal plane as God willed, from times long ago when Exalted Owyn marshalled faithful militants on Edel as Father Petyr notes, to the recent Imperial annals that you yourself cite.
As for how this great power came to be squandered, I similarly concur. Perhaps it is simply that, in a world beset by constant change, the Church simply fell behind. Admittedly, I do wonder if this event was determined by the Holy Light, as the essence of all things and threads of all fate, or whether we have failed God in some way by allowing His Church to falter. The answer is yet obscure to me.
In any case, while we are like-minded on many matters, my views differ in some aspects.
As for the Church’s traditional role in promoting the unity of mankind, I am not convinced that therein lies a solution to the powerlessness of the present-day Church. While an Emperor sympathetic to the Church may indeed enable the Vicar of God to achieve many of their goals, this power - in the modern day, at least - would still ultimately be borrowed, and contingent on that Emperor’s sympathy and piety. And, as you will no doubt note from your study, there have existed a great many Emperors who fell prey to the Shadow. I sense you may agree that, in this hypothetical Empire, the influence of the Church would remain sufficiently negligent so as to allow the Emperor to ignore the Church when convenient.
In fact, I opine that mankind united may well enable the further degradation of the Church. Though you may protest upon reading this, stay your rebuke a moment as I explain. The power the Church yields on the world stage today is fitful, and derived nearly entirely from leverage. By virtue of the fact that Haense and Veletz feuds, the Church divines some influence as these rivals will seek to levy religious support against the other. This is, of course, a most improper source of power and a testament to the clerical weakness of which I write, but I cannot deny that it forms part of the Church’s relevancy in the eyes of scheming Kings.
It is, ultimately, accountability of which I write. An overlord who can freely ignore the Vicar of God in theory may face no accountability from his subordinate vassals and nationalist subjects. There is some degree of accountability to the Church between feuding states, but it is only incidental on the whims of the sovereigns. Consider those excommunications of which you have written - though their practical impact was mute, it no doubt forms a rallying cry for those who opposed them, a wayward assurance that their cause is true and just.
The ambitions of Philip III and Anastasia I met an ill-fate at the Battle of Eastfleet; Heinrik Sarkozic’s beloved Adria became a footnote of what is now crumbling Veletz; and Gaspard van Aert has provoked a devastating war -- perhaps some will of God was indeed invoked, even if the Church neglected to establish itself in the aftermaths of these events. This is, once again, noting the inconvenient truth that the Church could have done nothing if any of those factions it allied with at the time had erred from the Light, for only by their political machinations could the Anathema be punished in the first place.
Now that we have spoken of the crux of my theses, let us turn to the only other matter on which we are not entirely aligned. You view the Church’s role as that of mediator who would bring disputes to a peaceful resolution before the baring of steel. I am not so inclined towards the necessity of peace -- wars, both just and unholy, have characterised our entire history, and I am stalwart in my belief that the will of the Light must often be achieved through force. There is, of course, nothing wrong with peace, but only if properly attained. A peace that does not reprimand those fallen to the Shadow is no true peace - look at the Petran civil war, for instance; a conflict sparked due to the infidelity of a woman who only recently claimed the title of a Queen of Canondom. The Church’s intervention to resolve this dispute, and excuse the sins of Renilde I and Marius Audemar, would have achieved no true peace, as the mark of the Shadow would not have been cleansed.
No, the Church should not just be a mediator who can be freely ignored on political whims -- it should be a judge.
An overseer of the mortal planes and vindicators of the Light, who brook no transgressions by human Kings and Queens and who purge the Shadow in whatever for may take; for, as I have written, the Holy Light is a torch that must illuminate those who can be saved, and burn away those who cannot.
Without a return to the power of yore, this will never be achieved and the Church will remain forced to barter for what little influence nations will yield.
We must rebuild ourselves, and no longer rely on fickle crowns.
May you ever elude the Shadow,
Friar Villorik
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27 minutes ago, Crevel said:
A Haeseni-born priest residing in the United Kingdom of Aaun by the name of Petyr pens a critical reply to the 'warpriest' in regard to their essay,
"To the ordained Friar Villorik,
While your claimed respect for the Scrolls is commendable and expected as a priest, it does not bode well to claim that centuries of written theory and analysis of the Holy Scrolls is naive. The history of our faith has seen great academics that have experienced many realms and many cultures that have surely influenced their analyses, and their essays prove much more optimistic than the dribble you have written that insults the very foundation of our Mother Church. You claim that the Church as an institution is totally reliant on the whims of ambitious princes but was it not the Exalted Owyn, an orphan who grew to rally the faithful of his uncle's armies in his youth, who restored the Kingdom of Idunia to virtuous rule from the sinful and ambitious Harren? Was it not he who created the institution that began the Mother Church as we know it today?
While the Exalted Owyn is an extraordinary case due to being exalted, he is the exemplar of a man of virtue overcoming the tyrannical rule of an ambitious king with no respect for the Lord. These men and women, whether they occupy positions in realms or not, will forever exist and the tremendous power that they hold in spiritual unity transcends national identity. It is a power that can overcome any oppressive ruler. As long as these men and women exist, as they will as the Lord's mercy is forever shown in our daily lives, the Church as a mouthpiece of the Lord God's virtue will forever have power whether a standing militaristic force in possession of the Church exists or not.
I recommend that you take more time on your marches to think more of the power of the Canonist collective lest you forget who you are truly fighting for.
"In the kingdoms of Horen, he mingled strange and corrupt practices with the wisdom of holy men. Even now, the Lord watched, and sent miracles, that the world would repent."
Scroll of Gospel (5:34-35)
Father Petyr of Albarosa"
Father Petyr,
Though you claim our views differ, I am obliged for your reply nonetheless; for it is only through discourse that we might progress.
I must firstly state that I think your core disagreement stems from a grievous and hasty misinterpretation of my meditations - namely, that I forsake the analysis of the Scrolls. Indeed, this is far from my contemplation. That you cite the works of the most holy Exalted Owyn and his restoration of the Idunian realm is the very core of my interpretation of the Holy Light and God's plan -- the need for militant believers to restore what has fallen to sin. What you mistake for a sweeping condemnation of all Canonist history is, in reality, a commentary on the pacifism of the Church in recent decades when it has lacked such spirit as was displayed by Exalted Owyn in the restoration of the Holy Light when the Shadow has grown heavy. We are, by all accounts, saying much the same thing, it seems.
As with any institution whom assume the responsibility of teaching and enforcing order, there must be two pillars; that of the teacher itself, who espouses the principles and tenets by which faithful men must live; and that of the enforcer, who rectifies the transgressions of those who wilfully eschew those teachings. As I have written, the former is the Holy Light's illumination, and the later is its burn. One, I have come to surmise, cannot exist without the other, lest those taken by the Shadow deny the teaching with utmost impunity.
As these great men you cite once did, so must we aspire to follow in their footsteps so that the Shadow will be forever denied. For those who do not return God's love must live in fear, or never shall the Shadow be dispelled.
- Friar Villorik.
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Meditations on Faith - Vol. 1:
A Powerless Church
SpoilerSANCTUS LUX IN TE;
I am ordained Friar Villorik, a warpriest of the Holy Mother Church.
I write this from within my lodgings in the Covenant war camp as the campaign against the League of Veletz continues. I took up arms in the name of the Vicar of God in order to expunge the Anathema from the Heartlands, but this is not why I write; in the long months of marching and battle, I have had a great deal of time to meditate upon the meaning of the Canonist faith, and the Church of the Canon.
When I studied the Scrolls prior to my ordainment by the late Father Tonito - may God keep his soul - I was sure in my faith, and my understanding of the Holy Light. Yet, I know now that this understanding was born purely from academia and study of the written word - in other words, naivety. First-hand experience of the world brings with it a far greater understanding of the fellow inhabitants of this realm, be they pious or pagan.
Thus, I have committed to the recording of these meditations in the hope of kindling progress within the Church.
This first volume shall opine on the nature of the Church’s power as an institution.
"God promises refuge from suffering in all times, that the sons of His Sons should never bow before Iblees again."
- Scroll of Gospel, Book of Silence
___________________
Let us begin with this question - what is the Canonist Church?
This is a question with many answers. It is foremostly a teacher, responsible for the performance of the holy sacraments and spiritual needs of the Canonist Realms. The Church represents order, and teaches the tenets of Canon law enshrined in the Holy Scrolls -- we must then contemplate what the Church’s role becomes when these teachings are spurned, and therein lies the focus of this meditation.
The Church lacks independent power with which to enforce its teachings and punish transgressions.
This is not to say that the Church lacks any power, but it is a conditional power derived from nations for whom it is convenient. This present war between the Grand Covenant and the League of Veletz makes for a fitting example - in excommunicating the government of Veletz, the Church has firmly aligned itself with the cause of the Covenant. While this cause is righteous, it cannot be denied that the religious aspects of this conflict - namely, the sins of Veletz in the form of sacrilege and consorting with light-spurned Darkspawn - are secondary to the political goals of many, though not all, of the Covenant nations.
Therefore, in exacting penance from Veletz for their transgressions against the faith, the Church must rely on the political objectives of the other Canonist Princes. I have come to accept that we, as the mortal swords of God, would have no means to vanquish our foe were it politically inconvenient to the majority of the Canonist Realms.
Likewise, if the Covenant sovereigns were to now sin unapologetically, the Church is practically powerless to act upon it. For while the goals of the Covenant enable us to strike down the sinners in Veletz, there would be no such aid to banish any shadow that befalls the Covenant itself, for they alone form the Church’s ability to act.
The quandary is this clear - the Church is without any power of its own, and its mission on this mortal plane is hindered. We, the very agents of God, are forced to barter and compromise in order to achieve one objective while sacrificing others. Our mission is only attainable insofar as it aligns with the machinations of mortal kings, and true commitment to fulfilling the will of God and His Skies would leave the pious few standing alone.
This is the truth as I have come to understand it, both from study of the Scrolls, and seeing the Holy Light shine upon the land.
The Church is, in truth, powerless.
"And verily we are all commanded into the service of the Lord, and into service of others, be we physician, craftsman, or king."
- Scroll of Spirit, Epistle to the Magi
___________________
Can the Church escape this mire?
It can, for the fundamental aspect of all power is the same. As it is, the Canonist clergy are learned men and women committed to the teachings of God by way of passive preaching. Yet, in times of war, the clang of steel so easily drowns out the wisdom of the Scrolls -- for when the Deceiver pulls his strings upon the souls of those who have fallen to his shadow and commits them to sin, preaching, sermons, and sacraments can do little to oppose them.
If we are the torches of the Holy Light, then we must illuminate - we must cast away the shadow of sin and ignorance through our teachings. Yet some shadows lie so thick that they cannot be merely illuminated -- they must be burned. As of now, and as of many decades past, the torch of the Holy Light has dimmed so as to only illuminate, and those most detestable shadows cannot be burned away.
The Church has hosted many militant sects over time, from the warriors of Saint Jude to the darkslayers of Owyn, yet we are without a steadfast armed force dedicated wholly to the role of faithful jurors - without competing national loyalties, nor material ambitions. This task is not completed overnight, but over decades. But, with perseverance and commitment to our role as not only God’s shepherds, but warriors, it is wholly possible for the Church to gain true and unfettered power with which to accomplish our most holy mission.
In these times where the Shadow lies long across the land, it is not enough for the Holy Light to shine.
It must burn.
"Thus Owyn raises the sword of flame. And lo! the light of God is redeeming, and wicked reject it.
Iblees and his servants are destroyed forever.
The world is become paradise."
- Scroll of Auspice, Vision of Strife
18 -
"Like a human politician wearing Orcish skin," the grim-witted Friar observed dryly. He kept his sword buckled, and hoped there would be a call for battle.
18 -
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[!] A letter is sent by messenger pigeon to the author. The hand is plain and jagged, but concise.
"May God bless you.
I am Friar Villorik, a warpriest who partaking in the conquest of Veletz on command of the Vicar of God. I have further undertaken the duty to expunge the taint of the Deceiver from the lost souls of Veletz.
I duly pray that the Deceiver's taint has not grown so heavy as to obscure the cause of this war from your mind. If this is, however, the case, then heed me so: the League of Veletz forsook piety and morality when they conspired with the brigands of Stassion to murder King Edmund of Aaun, who was a stalwart ally of Veletz at the time. The League of Veletz forsook honour and integrity when they tried to force the Commonwealth of the Petra's diplomatic affairs, and sent assassins to murder the girl-queen Catherine when she resisted their vice. The League of Veletz forsook peace and dignity when they kidnapped a Princess of Balian without provocation, and attacked the Haeseni capital after they escorted the Pontiff to Veletz to negotiate her release.
The Grand Covenant has undertaken this war to destroy a tyrannical state before it can wreak further havoc.
Your children can flee to peace. The lands of Canondom will, adherent to their standing faith, welcome all refugees fleeing the war. There is nothing keeping you in Veletz but the blindness cast upon you by the Deceiver, and it is for you alone to shirk this and return to the light. That there is nowhere for you to go is a lie.
You need not to fall. There is naught that compels you to defend the lands rightfully besieged in response to the tyranny of Veletz but pride wrought by the Deceiver. If it is true that you wish to protect your children, as any mother should, then you should flee your home without question and seek sanctuary in the lands of the Covenant. You endanger yourself, your children, and your home by fighting for the Anathema. That you are destined to leave your children orphaned is a lie.
The Captain General is Anathema. That he offered you hearth and home does not undo this truth, as any warmongerer would gather allies. That you vouch for their warmth while simultaneously ignoring the grievous offences committed unto the nations of the Covenant is surely a mark of the Deceiver's spell upon you, which you must resist. That these are good and godly people is a lie.
If you wish to live, fair lady, then live - abscond the lands of Veletz for their crimes innumerable. None seek the blood of you nor your children, for your only crime is succumbing to tyranny. Leave, and all will be saved, and the land may well be suitable to be returned to once the shadow that lies heavy upon it is expunged.
If you stay, lady, then know it is out of pride. It is out of ignorance. It is out of evil.
If you stay, and if you fall, the fault will be purely your own, but none will bar your refuge.
If your children fall, the fault will be purely your own.
Seek me out and partake in the sacrament of confession, so that you and your children might be saved.
May God save you."
61 -
"Another exiled and anathema boy, fallen to the Deceiver," Friar Villorik sighed. He watched the morning's pale light gleam on his Ruskan sabre, and the words of the Scroll of Virtue inscribed on the steel. "Another one to be cured of greed and malice."
15 -
That night on the march through Veletz, Friar Villorik prayed for Tonito -- the man that had ordained him, and finally helped him realize his promise to Sixtus V.
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"Lady de Vilain,
May God bless and illuminate you. I am Friar Villorik, a warpriest of the Holy Mother Church who has taken up arms at the command of the Vicar of God to expunge the anathema.
Though our kin may cross in battle, we need not be enemies of spirit, for circumstance draws our blades more often our own hands in life. All the same, God would not forgive me if no effort was made to enlighten you on the Deceiver's touch on this war.
We can look into the depths of history at this conflict, but in truth there is no need - the recent past is amply illustrative. It is undeniable that Veletz did once stand for progress; it stood for a united heartlands, capable and strong, who wielded the respect and influence of Aaun, Petra, and Numendil. With deft diplomacy, the Canonist League was dismantled, and thousands of troops would draw steel in the name of your Captain General. With this might, the realms of Balian, Urguan, and Haense would have been felled.
Why did this not transpire?
The Heartland Accord is not gone. It stands against you wholeheartedly with greater resolve than ever Haense nor Balian had mustered.
This was not the doing of your enemies, but your own.
You lost Petra when you held Queen Renilde captive and forced her to sign a treaty she had no wish to. Much worse, when the child Queen Catherine likewise refused, you sicced mercenaries to slay this young child.
Is this your progress?
You lost Numendil when you played host to Darkspawn within your halls, and unapologetically set churches ablaze in retaliation for Petra wishing to conduct their own diplomacy free from your vice.
Is this your progress?
You lost Aaun, your greatest and truest ally who, despite having warred against you in the past, stood at your side unfaltering in recent decades. And yet Veletz partook in murder of the Aaunish King, and the army of Veletz was smashed in the streets of Whitespire when they came to protect King Edmund's murderers.
Is this your progress?
The world you preach for is one of tyranny and fear, in which any who fail to abide by your whims are subject to murder. God weeps at your evil, or your delusion, as do all mankind.
For it is not Haense nor Balian that was poisoned your allies. It is not they who have defeated you in battle. It is not they who have led us to where we now stand.
It is yourself.
You have betrayed and murdered your own allies. Your progress is tyranny. Your progress is nothing.
The beacons you would light now have been burned to cinders long ago. Repent, Lady de Vilain; seek me out and partake in the sacrament of confession, and you might yet be saved.
- Friar Villorik."
44 -
Father Villorik prayed before God for the Stassion blood that was about to be spilled.
12 -
"Perhaps the good King should attend mass," Friar Villorik hummed, "there is no greater way to vent one's vexations than the sacrament of confession."
23 -
"The good Queen should attend mass," Friar Villorik hummed. "There is no better way to vent one's vexation than the sacrament of confession."
21
Let's talk about Realms
in Debate
Posted
I didn't play in Haense during War of the Two Emperors.
You're clearly not commenting because of anything to do with the post. You saw someone from Haense making a post about an issue on the server in 2024 and started commenting about Renatus and Telanir in 2019. You've just brought some random bullshit from 5 years ago onto this post to try say "YEAH WELL IF THIS AFFECTED YOU, YOU WOULDN'T BE SAYING THIS", without any basis which is absolutely ill-will.
Dm your rant and get off my thread.
I actually think Norland is probably the best example of a human group that should be its own Realm just because it is steeped in actual years of history and culture that is pretty distinct from any of the other human groups, which you mention with the whole juxtaposition. I'm not sure how it worked when Norland was a vassal before -- I assume it was entirely autonomous with an oath of fealty?