PCSwift

I think that Nephilim should be able to terrorise druids with their flame breath so that they hear the cries of a numerous trees burning alive. Druids calling PvP prevents this. Simple as.

3 minutes ago, Crevel said:

I think that Nephilim should be able to terrorise druids with their flame breath so that they hear the cries of a numerous trees burning alive. Druids calling PvP prevents this. Simple as.

u realize that if enough people attack the druid grove, then the druids can still call pvp. so that argument doesnt really make sense.

"no matter what, there's less roleplay involved, and power is placed in the hands of the victim; but not the power to make things more dynamic and interesting, but instead a nuclear option to subvert any sort of meaningful narrative."

So you don't like pvp, is the issue. Because you say pvp has no narrative because words aren't exchanged, therefore it's bad.

I'm not a particular fan of PVP, no. It has its place in warclaims, but this is a roleplay server; roleplay must take priority by default.

" or they call pvp, in which case the ensuing fight does not produce any sort of meaningful roleplay at all and instead results in either a popping, the victim mech-fleeing and avoiding consequences entirely (lmao to old orenians calling pvp on crossbow assasination attempts"

He ran away-he got away from the conflict just like one would in CRP. It is SHOWING the conflict through mechanics, you don't need words to say he ran away, you just run away. 

You can't outrun a crossbow bolt. The reality of the situation isn't represented via mechanics; the capability of the two combatant characters isn't represented via mechanics. Instead, you fall back to the OOC skill of the player at PVP, which isn't what roleplay is, or should be.

I'll give another key point here: magic. Suppose I, a mage, throw a fireball at you, a Knight, and you call defender default; how is the fireball supposed to be represented mechanically? The reality is that it can't be, because a magic plugin would be a) a bad idea and b) is never going to happen. Villains like Gashadakuro would never have succeeded in a defender default setting because, ironically, it actually provides people with the capability to avoid conflict roleplay by just running away or falling back to OOC skill. 
 

Point is-you don't like pvp. You can't redefine roleplay as 'text-based interaction' and call yourself a winner, I think roleplay involves mechanically moving around, and the city you roleplay in-whether it is day or night, or whether your skin is cloaked or not. All of those things are mechanics too, so why stop at clicking? 

roleplay is playing a character, and having your character interact with other characters. you can use mechanics to represent roleplay, but pvp isn't a representation of roleplay because the contest has nothing to do with the skill of the actual characters. 

"here's nothing new brought to a character through pvp, no actual matching of skill. a seven-year old elf can defeat a grizzled olog in pvp, completely disregarding the realities of the story, so why should any serious roleplayer want defender default? "

I can do the exact same thing in crp through powergaming and spam dodging. My 5'9 human character can beat an orc through wrestling because I say he can, and no-one can stop me other than my sheer will and time commitment to winning a crp. It's not a fault of the system-its a fault of the player. Again, a fallacious arguement.

It's probably WORSE in crp, tbh. I can transfer items over that can absolutely break the balance of crp, and bully tf out of people to win rather than create a story. It's on the player, not the mode of combat, to keep the narrative.

fine, but the system of crp default permits individuals who approach each other in good faith to actually have a good roleplay experience. the same is true in defender default so long as they both stick to combat roleplay, but if you instead turn to pvp, you disregard roleplay and narrative entirely. 

it's one thing to say that issues with crp default are because of players - that's probably true, and it means that players who are out to roleplay will have a good experience with each other. you get bad eggs, but you get bad eggs in every game, no matter the playstyle.

however, if you turn to defender default, then the issues become because of the system. you can't work around them - the rules become designed to permit people to basically avoid roleplay, which is funny because the people who argue for defender default are also the same genre of player who argue that the server doesn't have consequence anymore.