The Lion

Form an actual argument. Necessity is the mother of invention. It's inevitable that someone was going to figure out a way to defeat an armoured knight with tools other than the norms. Be it telepathic steel balls or alchemical firearms, fast moving projectiles are possible using the current lore/mechanics of LotC. I'd stand with a well thought out post akin to this OP over some other lore. It's got mechanics instilled. Won't offset anyone's ability to simply bash a man in the face with a hammer before they can do their magic. Do not fight inevitability. As the mages have been cut down despite their lore induced empowerment, so will the gunslingers. A non-threat to any real sword.

Gunslingers work in DnD, I don't see why not here. I've been on LotC since the beginning and it's actually stupid we've tech locked this easily accessible and once doable ability to utilize primitive firearms. At one point 'hand cannons' were already in existence during Anthos by the server's own design of a plugin that allowed any ol' player to shoot fireballs out of golden staves using emeralds as ammo. Woe upon those who decided to supplant lore behind a plugin that had no explanation. Make it exclusive like Golem making once was and go from there. Only a handful of players will actually have the tech and will rightly be superior. Screw this lemming mentality taken where one character can't be more powerful than another. In real life, there are superior and inferior people. All are able to technically be superior, but because they don't aspire to it, they aren't. I don't see the point in barring characters from being better than other players. Some people are just better than others in life and that's purely due to the mentality people take with life. Sorry to break the ice. In future it'll be widely accessible I imagine, but that day will be around the day this server comes to a close, so what does it actually matter? Nothing will last forever. Too long has this been coming. Too long has the staff blindly denied technology from progressing even though we constantly cite the real world in relation to our tech. It's time to break the bonds and get beheaded for it. The Lore Staff has in the past played the role of the Church to Lotc's Galileo. Today that Galileo is Phil. To deny this is to accept you're no better than the Church of his day: A stagnant and dogmatically ignorant force of power.

Steel Company; 2-11 Heroes Of The Interstice Pt. 2 They prepare for the battle to come… Sighard An'Halstaig walks along with his herd. He explains to the others, "They can charge if they hear my shouts." He takes a step up and bellows out, "PERCIVAL STAUNTON!" To prove his point. Leaving an awkward silence until the sheep came ramming through the woods. Loyal beasts. A morale boost. Vicelin cuts the excitement of the fact, "We shouldn't encounter anything during the day." Kaldrius chimes in on Vicelin’s remark looking too and from, "Hopefully.." Vicelin then adds an order, “Now is the time we should split up and get into our starting positions.". And so, the herd suddenly stops by the entrance, the name still successfully instilling order and fear in them. Oakshade. Suddenly an Auctioneer comes rushing through. He hastily hooting and hollering as he flees the overgrowth. Unfortunately with nothing to sell. Damn looter. The gang stands still. Most instinctive twisted into combat stances at the sudden action. Pereus eases the tension, "Erm, an' watch out fer traps." Kaldrius untwists from his battle-stance, "Damn right." At that moment, Feremyr af Highcliffe appears with a smile. Petting one of the fluffy sheep with a smirk before turning away. Marching on. Vicelin draws his sword with a metallic hiss. Resting the ridge of the blade against his shoulder. Renuald aep Dyffryn takes similar precautions to Vic, saying, "Aye. Ser Lion, take charge of your team, send them where you think your lot will be best. My team. Drain some potions once the sun starts to set and focus yourselves." The Marked stir into action. Sighard promptly raises his head as he'd unsheathe his blade. Tightly holding it by his side. At the front of Team One, Bartholomew drones out, "Might be some insectoids left." Reaching over his shoulder to brandish his longsword from the baldric. Beside him, Feremyr grasps the hilt of his sword. The blade making an odd 'shling' as it exited the sheath. One of the many side effects of the Oakshade curse. Meanwhile Pereus' sword 'shling's' in its hilt, making strange noises. Lyeth looks at Lion, wanting to get this show on the road, "Lead on, Boss." The knight uses both hands to articulate a aurum halberd through the overgrowth. Careful not to snag it on the environment. The land he dwells is unnatural. Quiet. Almost torturously quiet. Kaldrius has similar feelings to Lyeth, "On you, Renuald." The metal man nods. Lyeth adjusts the cello briefcase on her back, leaning on the pole of her aurum halberd. The dwed follows along keeping his shield lower and his aurum waraxe rested on his shoulder. Ser Lion lets Renuald pick his direction before moving his team behind them. The ancient knight then encourages the gang, "If you're going through Hell. Just keep going." The teams split for the first time. Vanguarding, Vicelin and the Marked, Team One. The Mage Team of only Lion, Lyeth and Pereus are to confront the Djinn with a bargain after its subdued by Team One. Sighard looks about at the empty overgrowth and comments, "Wild creatures during the day have been culled. Ever since Avenel killed the Leshen." Renuald aep Dyffryn draws his longsword, placing it on his shoulder, following his team forwards to the gate. "We'll head down the street, Ser Lion. You've flares?" Lion shakes his head, his attention shifting elsewhere, "Can't say I have flares. Though, I’ve got a popper..." Pereus declares, "We won't need 'em. Ah got good lungs Ah can shout." Renuald gives a half-assed nod. Reaching into his dump pouch, "Here." He pulls a set of pop-up flares anyways, "For trouble." By the time he looks up to offer them. Lion has already turned off to survey what grabbed his attention. Renuald grumbles and looks instead to the other elf, “Lyeth, hold onto these. You lot get in trouble, send them up.” He pauses, “Kaldrius, Bart! Let's go!" Lyeth accepts them. Stuffing them in her shirt, "Okay boss." In the background a joyful raevir starts to hum the wonderful tune of 'remove courat' (remove kebab) out loud. Following Vicelin. Lyeth then exclaims with some motherly advice, "Bye guys! Remember not to get mad and try to kill me! Keep your calm!" Feremyr states, "By Godan, do I hate this town of barrows." Vicelin lowers his tone, glancing up at the webbing strung out across the building to his right, "No sign of movement." Looking to his team, "We should set up at the smith." Sighard sasses him, "Y'mean the lodge... right?" Lots of advice on where to set up crops up now. Feremyr asks and points, "What about the safehouse?" Vicelin quells them all, "Safehouse too. We can secure both routes." Renuald attempts to follow the original order, "I'll take my three to the Smith." They're sarting to march off. Sighard An'Halstaig looks after, "Renuald..." Vicelin reigns them in, "Two groups, Renuald." He mutters, “Not three.” Bartholomew confirms his position, "The cottage, then?” Sighard stirs the pot, "This 'battle buddy' **** is stupid. We're two groups. We're all our battle buddies." Feremyr echoes him, "Mhm." Renuald grows impatient with the blathering, "**** it. Forwards." Vicelin wades through the bushes. The forest utterly silent barring the calls of a lyre birds high up in the canopy and buzzing flies. Bartholomew grunts, advancing through the foliage after them. The construct Kaldrius dryly joked, "Looks like someone forgot to mow the lawn..." Sighard lets out an equally dry laugh at that, "Hah." Renuald asks, "...What's this thing you call mowing?" He pushes through brush, slipping through under it where he can. Lyeth raises a point before the last Marked vanishes into the foliage, "We need somewhere where you lot can keep an eye on us and we can keep an eye on you.". Pereus says, "Ah got an idea." "What's that?" Asks Ser Lion. Pereus, "We wait en ta' cottage 'till night. "Ta' crossbow one." Lion reaches to his utility satchel, "Aye. I brought playing cards." Lyeth punts some shrubbery with the end of her polearm. Shoving it out of the way. Ser Lion enters the cottage and operates the siege crossbow that's mounted on a swivel. Aiming the unloaded weapon in random directions to figure its restrictions. Sighard is heard in the distance, "I can dig traps around the lodge, Vic." Vicelin doesn’t seem to answer him. Heard asking, "How long until sunset?" Kaldrius automatically chirps, "We've got time." Lion can't seem to actually see them until they occasionally come bursting through the leafy growth thenforth. Pereus steps into the room Lion’s in. Pushing the leather flap out of the way. The matter of time is once again raised. Feremyr is finally heard elaborating, "Six hours." "Mhm..." the Mage Team can see the Shepherd. Sighard raises his head through the skies, gazing through the foliage. Feremyr’s voice gets more specific, "Five rather." Bartholomew confirms, "Give or take." Vic ends the debate, "Good." Lyeth explores alone, "Hrrm." She grumbles, carefully moving through the overgrown ruins. Pereus says, "Someun' shoul' take a post on ta' roof, see ef baddies be commin'." Lion nods, climbing up the roof with elven tact, making chat, "You ever gone to war before, Pereus?" The dwarf says, "Aye lad." The sun would slowly set, the darkness falling upon the group. Slivers of sunlight extinguished by the falling sunset. The Marked setup traps and Siegmeyer joins the Mage Team. The winds pick up violently at dusk. Surging before a loud audible snap is heard from the makeshift forests near the house Pereus and Sigmeyer take shelter in. A small funnel of vicious wind forming. Lyeth and Lion are able to see this strange anomaly of weather. The tornado brushing against the edges of the house the dwarf is in. Planks ripping off and lodging themselves into the trunks that have been splintered from the path of the tornado. Loud resounding cracks break through the silence of night. The rotting wood breaking clean off the roof and tearing everything beneath it. Pereus and Siegmeyer narrowly missing the brute force of the winds as they escape towards Lyeth and Lion. The winds howl violently as the night falls. The tornado smacking against the center of the building and tearing it asunder. It seems being around this area is dangerous. Debris flies violently from the sides of the tornado. The tree trunks bending outwards and swaying from the sheer force of the anomaly. Leaves and branches caught in main bulk of the tornado. It seemingly edging towards the building the four in the Mage Team are now scrambling into. Then, out of nowhere; black shapes would quickly swarm the skies. Screeching rapturously. The bark of the trees tearing away. Growing many anguished faces upon the trunks. Ser Lion crosses his heart, whispering to God, "Protect us from the demons." (Stay tuned for more...)

Steel Company; 2-11 The Heroes Of The Interstice Date: The First Seed, 1628 The monotonous thump of hoof on earth carried with us for every mile. Three riders trailed a motley crew of weathered souls. Marked with purpose. They marched in silence as silhouettes amongst the dawning horizon. Uncertain of what the night would bring. Two of the three riders were on horses, the other, a donkey. The odd-one-out is a knight. Clad in dull black steel and broken-in leather. His helmet some kind of futuristic invention. The suit of armour protects him from the ominous environment. Observing the world through redstone lenses. Sealed from head to toe by buckle and binding. An alien to the misty lands trod. Packing with him enough weapons to hold off a small army. He stares ahead at the next rider up the chain. She’s wearing red-dyed leather fashioned to act like dragon scales. Seemingly war ready on her towering steed. An elf as old as Aegis. Just like the knight. Similar kit even; a halberd, longsword and various potions carefully packed in hide bags. Long crimson hair flowing. An aspect of beauty on the usually barefoot hobo. Different to the knight, her steed’s hind carried a large rectangular case. Easily as long as a warbow. Perhaps it’s made for a cello or some equally large musical instrument. Ahead of the hobo is the last rider on a squat horse. A bald dwarf eased along in its saddle. His clothing a blue contrast to the red of his companions. Dressed for the cold environment, you can tell he’s a resident of the area. Strumming his beard in thought almost absent minded as the road trip automatically progressed. He had more glassware than steel. The look in his eye shouted scientist as he carried a wide-variety of alchemical concoctions and tinkered toys in a carefully prepared satchel. After a few days travelling the party found themselves a few hundred meters away from Oakshade. The abandoned town was fled from after an other worldly realm manifested within in it. Known by the Marked as the interstice. Twisting reality and unleashing horror. The town decayed. Rooftops and basements collapsed in on themselves after nature took over. The stonework in ruin. Whispered tales talked of flying harpies haunting the area. Long armed monsters and a powerful Djinn that vanquished the Mortal Realm's most wizened void user. It was a genie and the lord of the interstice... Renuald aep Dyffryn gathers everyone together. Kaldrius Synalli dons a rather hefty steel warhammer in both of his gauntlets. The Atronach having no struggle maneuvering the weaponry as he perches it onto his pauldron. Renuald addresses the huddled assembly, "Everyone clear on the plan? Pereus Frostbeard answers, "More er less aye." Sighard An'Halstaig holds up his hand. "Repeat, Renuald." Ser Lion says at nearly the same time, "Repeat the plan." Sighard An'Halstaig pipes in, "The sheep must hear." Petting one of the woolen creatures. Renuald gets distracted a moment before repeating the plan, "Kaldrius, still have your aurum warhammer? And, plan is, we enter as one team. The 6 o us will be the vanguard element to provide cover and soak up damage for the mage team. Everyone know their teams?" Kaldrius Synalli nods at that. Switching his warhammer for that of an Aurum one. Ser Lion asks a rhetorical question, "Are we now the Mage team?" Lyeth is also surprised by the change of team names and absence of the bargaining plan being explained. I suppose it's up to the Mage Team to decide. Bartholomew offers some advice, "We best pause to meditate here -- knock back our potions." Sighard trudges forth. He bluntly remarks, "Don't all chug accuity. One screech from god-knows-what, we'd all be down." Assuming that everyone was using accuity brewed for hearing sensations. Lion mentions, "I don't really mess with potions." Looking to Bart who stops himself from chugging a potion, "Ah, right." Vicelin breathes out a stream of fog. Trudging along the path. Frost lining the surface of the many times churned mud. He mutters, "It isn't night yet. Wait until sunset. Until then, we get in position and await the shift of realms." Pereus takes out his aurum waraxe. "Ye readeh lads?" He looks to the others. "...Well. This'll be interesting." Renuald doesn’t answer the question. Instead walking on carefully. Bartholomew grunts. Raising his helmet to peer into the bitter sky to have a last look. Kaldrius, the metallic centurion proclaims, “For Avenel!” Its visor narrowing onto the roadway before the banding group. Lion dismounts the donkey and pats Chappy for what may also be the last. He takes a knee and says some teutonic prayers briefly. Pereus nods towards Kaldrius, "Aye fer Avenel…" The dwarf catches a glimpse of the haunted ruin, he snorts, "Bettah nae take ta' pony in there." Sighard blandly utters in a tone most hushed, "Cresthome, Norland, King Beo." The sheep then begin to slowly, yet steadily march after the group. Bart stops looking up and loudly stomps after Vicelin. Ser Lion rises from prayer finding his hand grabbed by Lyeth. Looking for comfort in this evil place. He tells his Mage Team, "Keep your eyes peeled. Note your exits." The party passes into the village... (A lil teaser. Heroes Of The Interstice Pt. 2 coming tomorrow. Also, +1 to the dude to spot the Pulp Fiction reference. Any excuse to use Ezekiel 25:17! Glad you liked the post, Theater Go-Er. If you want more, I'm gonna need you to smash that rep button.)

Steel Company; 2-11 Follower Of The Son "And you will know my name is THE LORD when I lay my vengeance upon thee." Zanira Almasi turns away, feeling a chill run through her. Grand Master Lion sits back down. The room returning to normal lighting. Flushed with passion from reciting the monotheistic Church-verse. He composes himself. Balling his fist towards her with a promise, "She will not kill you... Without my permission." Zanira freezes up once more unable to speak. She glances back to him briefly. A look of fear on her face; she is open and honest in that. The Lion breaks the silence, "IF you intend to poison and destroy my brothers and sisters. You will not be spared. At my behest, you will be harvested like a crop." Zanira instantly retorts, "Why would I harm anyone?" Lion responds, "The reasons, I cannot see. However, I believe none are exempt from being perverted to evil. That which is all around us. Waiting to decay our minds if given the slightest chance. Best to see through the visages of other people. Look at the truth of their actions. Do not be blinded by the propaganda they herald." The two sit in silence. Lion considers how he himself may be spewing propaganda. He counters his virtuous rhetoric with a self-countering point. "Today I killed a man." Zanira quietly responds in a matter-of-fact way, "You did." He continues, "And tomorrow I will save a man. I couldn't say if I've killed more men or saved more men. Yet my intention remains the same. Stick to my code." She retorts, "Doing good doesn't outweigh wrongdoings." Lion considers this as well. Answering in a train-of-thought that will eventually get to the point, "You saw me show evil. A contained force of death and aggression. Locked away by the order of my good willpower. The universe will do unto me as I've done unto it. Doing good and evil deeds do weigh. They weigh on our souls. I could choose to be evil and pick you up. Slam you into that wall. Thrusting your skull back and forth till there was nothing left to crush upon the cobble. Or I could choose to be good. Remaining seated. Offering you the tools to articulate your freedom of expression, your medical pursuits. Good and bad DO have weight." Zanira weighs that herself. Telling Lion, "Those actions don't erase past actions." The Grandmaster nods, "Tis true. We all must live with our pasts. Hopefully letting those actions and experiences appoint you to create your moral code. In your own words: I choose to be good as much as I can, but I'm not perfect. Even when I asked you for your honest opinion about where I stood on the morality spectrum, you responded; neutral. Weighted. Balanced. You are right in saying actions do not erase past actions. Yet, we can only choose how we make future actions. Will you feed the evil inside you; corruption or will you feed the good inside you; virtue. These choices are entirely up to you. Good or evil. You decide every time." He lets that settle in. Zanira remains in thought for some time, Lion takes the formative moment and adds, "My view might just be darker than yours, but it's not hard to objectively see our intentions align. The only difference between you and I is my choice to pick up a warhammer and your choice to pick up a medical satchel. War and peace both seek the same end." Zanira rubs her hands down her face, silent. Her eyes slip shut. The scene fades out as she continues to discuss his company, "Orym doesn't want me to associate with your company, you know." (It’s been a while, but I think I’ve found a place to call home in Axios. A company of heroes, scoundrels, scholars and swordsmen. Together, we’ll be great. Let this serve as the first episode in a series of non-chronological tales surrounding actual In-Game RP surrounding the master guild, 2-11.) Date: The Amber Cold, 1630.

In what way does this change anything about mages except define the previously existing limitations of void use? Due to muscle deterioration, a mage is physically weaker than your average soldier (who are actually a lot more fit than your average civilian). Mages are able to technically lift and carry heavy (metal) objects, yes. Yet, after a short time of use would find their stamina very drained. Mages might be able to pick up a warhammer and give it a good swing, but after a handful more are not going to be lifting it much further or at least the swinging with staggered, easily-dodged hits. The same applies to pretty much anything that starts to get over even 15 lbs. I'd even wager that with some mages, due to their mastery, it'd be even less. The point of a vanilla mage is that they use their magic to compensate their weaknesses. If you wanted to be a Heavy Metal Warrior, you chose the wrong profession or more likely are just doing magic wrong. Any wizard worth the spit will find a means to overcome their limitations. In-fact. This examination of the void user is exactly what's needed to combat the apparent disease that is powergaming magic. No one wants to RP their curses, but are more than happy to enjoy the blessings.

Blessings of Sven upon us, Colour your redlines red. Some people need their attention drawn to perceive them.

Lion's Mobile Skinning Parlour arrives to town and bids for this contract with a basic design layout preview for the client: https://gyazo.com/925b7f6469ea9dc4581e6683236dde7e Not yet shaded, very little detail thus applied thus far. Think of this as a teaser. I want to see if you're happy with the shape we're going for in accordance with your design brief. I went with darker colours because you mentioned its use being for some... unsavoury characters. The height of the scarf is enough to cover most mouths you apply it to. Any changes you'd like to offer or errors in communication on the original design brief we missed, or shall I continue to skin in the details/shading/textures? Just +1 if you're happy with the path I'm going on. Keeps it simple. *update* https://gyazo.com/fd6d3b291cdd05fe9b8908d98528b61d

I don't see why this submission wouldn't pass the mark. It's like the one of a handful of entries on the matter of astronomy and fits with lore already established IG. Plus it's following the good faith and making the lore entry an ACTUAL IC DOCUMENT. Wow, now that's what I call application to the server as a whole! My only question is, what would happen if I looked at the moon through the magnified lens of a scope. What would I see? I use default texture pack. Most others do as well. Lots of cool RP comes from showing players star patterns that they can functionally use in MC. Rangers, ho!

Aye. I suppose that piece of shaman lore has been around long enough to be common knowledge, but sometimes a few eggs need to be smashed when reality comes knocking. I think your model is still sound even with the stars not moving, but if we're gonna say there's planets (which would make a lot of dope RP like dwemer stuff) then we have to take account of what that entails. I think that it's really awkward to say there's objects we can't actually see in vanilla, but I suppose it's the essence of RP to imagine scenes that don't actually have a mechanical representation. Moving objects where the texture pack does not move. Perhaps some Dev could make it possible to have a mechanical representation of at least the 7 planets? I only say it's awkward because I'll always see the F above the moon when it rises and know that when its setting, the F is below the moon. Despite what shaman tells me IG about a Constellation drawn in the skies above my head on tuesday, but not on thursday lol Cool stuff tho guys. I hope to see where this leads!

((This is where it comes to new territory in terms of lore interpretation. According to new creation lore, the sun and stars are basically the bodies of gods that sacrificed themselves. I mean, there's gotta be an answer here because obviously as y'all pointed out; there's seasons which would suggest we orbit. The moon has phases which suggests orbit is going on. How does lotc lore fit in with irl lore? As aptly pointed out above, are we looking at the realms of gods or flickering bodies of light? If you pointed the telescope at the moon would you realise that it's the Soul Stream? I think there's a lot of discrepancies that hopefully can get tied up as a result of this lore proposal. As far as I'm currently concerned on the nature of LotC's universe, the only thing in orbit is the moon. Everything else looks the same every night because we're not in orbit around the sun or anything except held in-place by it, but endlessly flipping in that place. Maybe there's room to invent some new ideas here that stray away from IRL conventional astronomy since this is a fantasy setting. Like maybe seasons in LotC are caused by the moon which is apparently magic? Who knows. I'm asking questions that may need an LT to be answered. That all said, I totally am on-board with the lore proposal and love what you've all created here. I just think that there's some observable facts IG that shouldn't be ignored because it's easier to explain in-terms of a creating lore posts (like the stars not actually changing at night and there being legitimately fixed star constellations). Where mechanics meet lore, new ideas come through. I'm really just wondering how observable constellations fit-in with the lore proposed. Despite whatever answers come and what is made canon and what is not-canon at the end of the day. Astronomical lore is being fostered here! I'll live with whatever I get and move accordingly in RP cause like WOOOO ASTRONOMICAL LORE! FINALLY.

The Lion gets wind of this proposal and contemplates the information being presented. At first he feels hollow, the famous wizard Ambros has been a staple to the astronomical game for many years. The information that The Lion published just a Seed ago appears to be an infant's mock-up of this presentation. Surely, he'll be overshadowed and once again remain the dark shadow standing in the light of common knowledge. Yet, The Lion, unknowing of the advanced skills of mathematics that proof claims in our silly world conjured similar ideas about the skies from his basic mountainside observations. Meaning that with two confirmations of facts, the ideas being presented from both camps are finding truth in this world. Becoming canon law. In that very moment, an epiphany dawns on him. Perhaps he could collaborate with these other Astronomers. He addresses a letter: To Dr. Ambros, I see that you've discovered much of what I have and then some. Though, I wasn't aware that our mortal plane being flat was wide knowledge. Certainly in all my years since 1300 when the written record restarted and the modern era began I have not heard these claims. Yet, it doesn't matter now. The proof is all in mere observation to the fact in-play. Now, I do not own a telescope, so I couldn't find these uh... 'primary celestial bodies'. However, I have found and recorded actual star constellations that are actually in our sky at night that you can actually see with your own actual eyes. These two constellations throw a lot of your work regarding seasons and these so called Shaman Zodiacs into question. I've not stared up long enough, but I'm fairly certain the stars are not shifting based on seasons. The stars appear fixed year-round. I'm willing to be surprised and proved wrong. Sol being the center of the Omniverse actually does well to prove that it's origin, the place where the Dead King named God committed pyholtuot and split into celestial bodies to embolden Mortal power. Now... that might just be religious understanding, but I've used a lot of my religious understanding in application with skies thus far and most of it aligns. All that said. We should work together. Free of politics, no strange promises. Pure collaboration. Pure science. I'd like to map your finds like I've mapped my finds. Surely if your primary celestial bodies are real, I will find them in the night sky for all to see. *he's attached some sketches he's made of chief constellations he's recorded for purposes of navigating a realm without the use of a compass. A technonology he is all too lucky to see in his inhospitalble frozen hell where barely a soul comes to visit he.* ((I'm questioning at what point we abandon the actual physics of the vanilla texture back and start mixing in our IRL knowledge of the sky as it appears you've done. Unless of course I've seriously just never noticed the seven primary bodies. I made this post IC as I like the idea of presenting lore like that too for similar reasons regarding IG relation. It'd be fun to collaborate!))

Dude yeah, I like debating with you. Orcs seeing women as equal is a huge thing here which would mean that even if Krug WERE a woman, it wouldn't actually impact that much. I suppose what I'm itchin' at here is that I believe Availer's ancient history contains flaws and oversights, whereby Krug was referred to as a man and this of course being the first piece of lore setup all lore that followed it. I'm suggesting that Availer was wrong based on the nature of Krug's curses. Why would Iblees think making Krug ugly would be a curse and why could Krug not be shaken like the others? This is the main point of the whole thing, I think that we're mistaken about the Four Races and the origin of people. Brothers and sisters would've been required for this pseudo-biblical creation story Availer gave us to make more sense than it already doesn't. In his account he himself states that he doesn't know some very key details about it all. @h e x This is almost no effort on my end to produce these arguments, I feel the lore that I've read about origin suggests that one if not more of the original four were actually women. Most likely being Krug based on the seemingly random curse of extreme ugliness, the fact Iblees couldn't sway Krug like the others, and her founding of a closely-knit-tribal society. Keeping the family tribes together is something I align more mothers than fathers. I maintain that Krug was a woman and that Availer set writer's astray with his vague account everything following was based off of. It's really not that insane to consider especially when you look at how many animals are larger or more fearsome than their male counterparts. Godzilla is female, so was Krug.

Maybe orcs are like seahorses! This would make sense considering how few women they've historically had. (I notice a lot more these days tho). I'm jesting again, I don't actually think orcs are seahorses. Maybe the character whom allowed the Tale of Dom to pass IC was mistaken or didn't want Krug to be regarded as weak because of the contemporary gender discrimination issues we face. Decided to say it was not Krug who gave birth, but this Grahla character. Gender discrimination runs deep. It's caused many women to take pseudonyms and pretend to be men just to be received with respect. I understand how this is a really big, "I am your father." moment for you, so conflicted, "It can't be true!"

Because the apparently All-Knowing (but not so all-knowing) Wandering Wizard said Krug was a man, but why would a man care about his looks? Why would Krug have been different from the others and not given in to Iblees? Genders may have different desires and Iblees didn't know how to connect with Krug unlike the others who were easily swayed. Krug, as a woman growing up in that hell and becoming the leader of the war nation would've taken more strength than a man needed and was what strengthened her resolve against Iblees. What would you offer a strong independent woman? Not much, leading to a fight. In my experience in the service industry, I say with certainty (at least in the UK) that a woman is much more likely to kick-off and get aggressive. This leads me to believe that Krug was the Mother of War. The one who invented conflict for a limited resource, her babies. @Marijuana Grahla could've actually been a man. I have a heavy suspicion these were all written out of character based on Availer's first account and passed IC through usual methods that most lore is learned by IC. No-doubt doing that is going to set the tone for used pronouns. Rather than doing what I've done by coming to the conclusion IC I will say that it may be confusing for players, but not the new ones. It's just confusing for the old ones to consider that they perhaps based everything they've written on the assumption that four brothers could populate the world. That's relevant only because I think it sets up the fact that our writers come from a male-centric point of view. This is a classic case of Mulan.

All lore would be written from the male perspective because Availer said 'he' and 'sons' and he posted the first piece of lore. This could be a major oversight. @Marijuanaology With gender stereotypes in-play which we've both clearly submitted as our logic, we see why a man, Krug would not give a **** about his looks, but a woman Krug would. Why would Iblees think making Krug ugly was a curse if there was nothing about her appearance she cared for? Even if Iblees is assumed an idiot, Iblees still thought it would get at Krug, why? There's few instances where women on this server have come up and become powerful leaders, I can think of two in-fact. Which is actually a point I made and will re-address: Krug being a woman gives more validation to her leadership and power. To be a woman and rise up through the hardships of our assumed gender-stereotype universe created for the Server to become a nation leader? That takes real strength. Krug strength. I wrote it humourously because I am a jester and because I knew that it would evoke the flames of chaos in the hearts of players to consider that their beloved hero was actually a woman. Knowing this would be a topic of contention, I came out the gate with humour. Mostly also to show that this kind of hypothesing and ensuing debate is something I see as fun between fellows and nothing I'm actually like dogmatically down for. I expect it to be considered because I've laid out claims and justifcations that warrant my claims. However! I will concede that Krug prolly wasn't an elf because well, as I know and you do, the original 4 looked similar. Making everyone related in some way which means that the fact was a given. When presented with new information, a mind is meant to be changed. That is what I attempt to do to my readers and what my readers attempt to do to me. I'm open for being wrong, but seriously consider that Krug was actually a woman. I mean, how do Four Brothers mate if we're going down that route? One had to be a sister. Or did God create them partners? We don't really know because of another instance where Availer's account was vague and unreliable.

Most potent conclusion. Yet, why would Iblees think that a curse upon Krug if she truly lacked vanity in the first place? Maybe that's the clincher and Iblees made Krug become worried about her looks, creating vanity which fueled into the curse of bloodlust (uncontrollable anger?). Could have been an insult to injury, but sadly we've got little to work with here. Very good analysis of Iblees' flawed logic about what made Krug tick tho, I could completely see Iblees doing something like that. Imperfect character is the Archdaemon.

I direct you to the final portion of my original post: I can even see arguments against this idea such as; Krug was cursed because of touching Iblees, not because Iblees cursed Krug! If that were the case, why would Iblees say, and I quote again, "and your descendants shall grow ugly and heartless.” Literally the last thing Iblees is mentioned saying to Krug is the prolonging of the afflicted features.

This is true, flaws are universal. It is also true that each race started from the same point. Yet, again, I ask why would Iblees think that making Krug ugly would be considered a curse? Krug had to have been beautiful. Why was Krug disinterested in Iblees? Krug may have been a heterosexual woman that wasn't swayed like Horen, Malin and Urguan. edit: I'm having hella fun talking about this with you guys! It's really interesting to see what comes up in these sorts of historical debates. I like actually being engaged like this.

Flip the genders and the story remains the same. Y'all got a reference for that claim? (he does, leading us to read about Grahla, the supposed mother of the major clans in an article written by Urara, famous orcish/human User. There are volumes about the births of the children of Krug and Grahla, yet was she just as mistaken as Availer? The outcome wouldn't change regardless of Krug's gender. The children born of the two that made up Gorkil, Dom, etc. would still be the gender they were written about as it's closer to modern history. As we delve into the ancient history, the record gets fuzzy. The official page on Krug stating, "Krug mated with Grahla, and together the two had many children who became the leaders of the first Orcish clans. It is unknown when Krug passed on, although the Journal of War in the Hidden Scrolls indicates he was killed in battle with Iblees." We're uncertain about his death, but know all about the births? Seems fishy to me.

Or did Krug have children with men?

Hello again, Readers. Long time, no see. As I have further delved into the madness that is researching and making Humanity’s Blessing make sense to our current lore, I uncovered many other truthseemings along the way. Most just make me smile and nod, but after speaking to a fellow, senor_tortuga, in the orcish war nation recently, I was inspired to instead publish what I’ve uncovered about Krug: KRUG WAS A WOMAN! NOT ONLY THAT, BUT SHE WAS AN ELF! Yet, Mister Wizard, how could it be true? I’ll tell you: REFERENCES https://wikia.lordofthecraft.net/index.php?title=Ancient_History From the Wandering Wizard Availer’s Account of the Ancient History of the World, we learn many things. Such as the creation story and how the mortal realm to be. We also learn how Man and Woman were created and the offspring they had that were ultimately challenged by Iblees whom cursed them. It is widely contested by popular scholars that Iblees came to Aegis in the form of a dark elf woman. Focus now on Krug’s curse. Krug was cursed with bloodlust. This makes sense as the orcs worshipped the warrior lifestyle and was punished by Iblees with a curse that would make them boil for blood. "And you Krug, the most hated of The Descendants, you shall always have the lust of war. You are strong? Well the strength shall be used against your brothers, used to pillage and murder! Your lust for battle shall be unsatiated and your descendants shall grow ugly and heartless.” Krug was cursed with hideous looks that corrupted the skin and enlarged the body in disproportionate ways as a result of being the first to defy Iblees. Why in the Dead King named God’s name would a man who ruled a War Nation give two shits about his looks? Because Krug was a beautiful woman. That’s why. Krug cared about her looks, Iblees saw this and cursed her out of spite when Krug leaped at her to attack in the days of yore. "Krug was the last to be tricked. Iblees tempted him with wealth, with food, with power. None interested Krug. Iblees was furious, challenging Krug in open combat in fury." Now that we’ve established that both Krug and Iblees were two beautiful women, we can understand why Krug NEVER trusted Iblees and actually despised her. There is little room on this earth for two beautiful women to coexist. They will like Mean Girls, pick on each other and hate one another for almost no reason based on truth. This led to Iblees knowing she couldn’t win over Krug with lust like she had Malin, Horen and Urguan. This led Iblees to instead do the only thing a pretty girl can do to another. Beat her down in a duel. Thus sparking The Great War. Yet, Mister Wizard, I totally see that Krug was a woman, but also an elf? That seems far-fetched, like you’re just trying to make the orcs mad at you intentionally. Quite the opposite, I’m just pointing out the facts that the ancient history seems to spell out despite the dogged use of the male pronouns throughout the stories of Krug that would make it appear Krug wasn't a woman. Take a good look at an orc. A really good freakin’ look. THEY HAVE POINTY EARS and drumroll please… they’re almost nearly as infertile as the elves in the completely opposite way. There’s too many orcs that are men, but not enough that are female. Just as Iblees cursed Malin to have many women, but few men which led to their own infertility. Krug must have been from elven-ilk before receiving the curse from Iblees. art by murdvish, found here:https://wikia.lordofthecraft.net/index.php?title=Uruks So there you have it. Krug was an elven woman. Based on the fact that half of her curse was based on vanity. Also based off the fact that orcs have pointy ears like no other race except that of elves. I am 100% writing humorously because the material may come as a shock to nerdbois, but am also 100% not joking and want these insights to be considered. Women and men are people that share the same ambitions, flaws and virtues. I don't see how in any way it'd be far-fetched that Krug is a woman based off the reverence orcs actually hold for the few women they have. These women almost always reaching heights of power equal to their male counterparts. Crap, it'd even lend to Krug's credit as a powerful leader and warrior when considering she's actually a woman. So yes, I can see there may be questions. I can even see arguments against this idea such as; Krug was cursed because of touching Iblees, not because Iblees cursed Krug! If that were the case, why would Iblees say, and I quote again, "and your descendants shall grow ugly and heartless.” Someone may even ask why it matters if Krug was a woman or not? It matters because the lore points to it being the case! An oversight by Availer whom referred to Krug as a he! *Edit* So maybe Krug wasn't a full blown elf because each of the first four did actually look alike. Meaning that the fact is a given that they'd be of the same ilk. However, considering Krug as a mother instead of a father even provides insight into why orcs are so protective of themselves and their culture. The mother would've wanted to protect her children from bad beings like Iblees, Outsiders and Necromancers for example. The lore is going to all be written in a male perspective that followed the first piece of lore simply because Availer said Krug was a man when it seems more likely Krug was a female.

I've failed to see this PM, nor do I see it now. Perhaps it was lost in the mail and needs to be re-sent?

I suppose these two posts can standalone for judgement. I'd be heartbroken if they got denied because it's all possible by RP precedents in spirit communication and actual RP digs that Mirtok made the sariants do in like 2012. Mostly I'd be heartbroken because I've written 32 pages (14k words) on expansions to this all. I just can't post it all in one go. I want my readers to have a paced out experience.

I googled 'hamon overdrive' to see what you meant. Is this what you meant? Pretty cool visuals, hella random demon shot hahaha