Demotheus

That's why I have a caveat about killing people...I also wanna do another lore peice on ghosts regarding moving on that you'll like.

They're both lumbering construct like slaves. The differences you list are negligible and don't really address the main point I'm getting at. Paleknights are not ghosts. They are not an upgrade to ghosts. Furthermore, people who will play ghosts just to be strong aren't doing it right. People who align with a faction as a ghost and help serve them aren't doing it right. That's my opinion anyway.

Paleknights are NOT ghost upgrades. They are not even close to resembling a ghost and I hate when people try to pretend they have anything to do with ghosts other than ghosts being stuffed in a rock. They lose all of their ghostly abilities from what I've read, and are essentially completely different creatures in my eyes. I want ghosts that are like in horror movies. Not a ghost-filled construct that is designed to serve a master. That's not how ghosts should be. Ghosts shouldn't be the sort of creature that serves anyone. They should haunt, and be scary, and provide RP that is high tension without it involving the balance of the world or some crap like that. Paleknights are mystic brand dreadknights. Not an upgrade to a ghost. People role play ghosts for certain reasons, and I don't think it's to become a discount dreadknight. Ghosts provide a substantially different kind of roleplay than that, and in my eyes, more valuable. TL;DR Paleknights are not ghosts.

No problem. I think I wrote at one point how this differs from Izkuthii (the emotion eaters). I'm kind of using pseudoscience stuff regarding real life aura's, and how if you're not happy, or if you're miserable or afraid, your aura (think chi stuff and what not) is thrown off, and reflects different colors. In LOTC terms, I take this as compromised aura. They don't actually feed off of emotions, they utilize emotions in people to steal the mana from their aura (which makes up a large portion of ectoplasm) with a wee bit of life force from their normal drain, and change it into usable ectoplasm. Izkuthii eat emotions. Ghosts use emotions to exploit weaknesses in their aura and steal it and transfer it into ectoplasm. Shades straight corrupt the aura from the getgo, no matter their emotion, and turn that into amber. If I've understood you properly, this is the main point of contention you specifically mention and hopefully I've cleared it up a bit more.

That response is straight cheeks. -1, but...+1...so +0. Meh. I actually LOL'd when I read this. Anyway, can you elaborate on what you like and don't like? it'd be more helpful, thank you. :D

Like I said, mysticism claims otherwise regarding souls and ghosts...but that's irrelevant. Being specific about souls is one of the dumbest things LOTC has done imo lorewise. Furthermore, ghosts aren't very scary as they are now. We don't even get to walk through walls. That's a staple of ghostdom in all of popular culture. Ghosts are powerful forces that, in many iterations, feed on fear and misery. That's my vision with ghosts. They aren't meant to be some uber powerful force of great sweeping change or something that must be banded together against to eradicate. Ghosts have motives and goals and "purposes", some are more manipulative in LOTC while some are straight up horrifying. Anyone playing a ghost as part of some overarching plot to take over the world or something is, imo, doing it wrong. A ghost that works to save the world or something is also doing it wrong. My ghost has a couple motives. One of them is that they want others to be ghosts too, since being a ghost is awesome - in their eyes. They're glad they're a ghost, and like to mess with people to no end. They have some character development stuff as well, which adds some depth, but more and more I'm trying to steer my ghost away from casual chit chat RP and more into the direction of being at least a semi-malevolent force of SPOOKERY. Spookery that people can enjoy being spooked by. Ghosts have little use for people's minas, and this lore serves to encourage ghosts to be more spooky or ghost like to gain power, and avoid killing in that interest. That's what this lore is. I'm trying to make ghosts in lotc more of what they are commonly thought to be. Not just second chances at characters. Not "Oh I died, better become a ghost to basically play them the same as always but with special spook powers!" characters. I want ghost encounters more and more to be like in the movies and ghost stories. There's a reason why ghost stories are so prominent...it's because the people who experience (what they think are) ghosts and hauntings live to tell the tale. I'm being long winded about this, sorry. I'm not trying to encroach in your spook role play or in necromancers and ghouls dynamic of henchmen and overlords with grand plots to manipulate the mortal masses and such. I don't want ghosts to be some weird spook faction, or have anything to do with conventional spooks. I want them to have a primary motive, and be rewarded for doing that thing that ghosts are supposed to do.

I'm afraid I'm not following you on this. What I'm getting is that you're making the claim that a Ghoul remains on equal measure with everyone else, and when they level up they of course get more powers and stuff, since they're no longer a ghoul. They're still an undead type creature, lich, wraith, etc. So if we are to make a direct comparison, which is a fact I think you're missing here, is that ghosts are similar to undead in the sense that undead is a classification of a type of creature. Ghosts are a classification. Haunts are equivalent to a ghoul in this sense. I dont' really know what a Revenant would be compared to the upgrade of a Ghoul, but I'm pretty sure a spectre or poltergeist ranks up there with a Ghoul becoming a liche or wraith or something. Correct me if I've gotten the path wrong. Ghosts and Ghouls are not low quality second rate second chances at existing. My ghost was never even RP'd as alive. I created it from scratch, and the quality of RP I've got from it has been immense. I'm sure ghouls could say the same thing as they increase in power and clamber for a higher plane of consciousness and gradually conquer mortality. These are not second chances at existing, to me. These stand on their own as characters, even if it's inspired or reincarnated from a previous character. So, to explain better, Ghouls upgrade through their stages to their big boss monster form - wraith, liche, etc. Ghosts go from a bumbling haunt that doesn't even KNOW it's a ghost, to spectres and poltergeists. It seems to me you're equating all ghosts with the lowly ghoul, when that's not the case at all. You can only really equate a haunt with a ghoul, and you'd be correct since they share a lot of the same aspects. Barely conscious of their own existence being chief, imo. Also, last I heard/read, ghosts have full souls (according to mysticism's lore). But this is contended with a few other perspectives I've heard of as well. Either way, the lore on souls is being buttfugged regularly anyway. Souls are so vague that homunculi are allowed to have them - defeating the purpose of them being homunculi, so who really cares anymore anyway? Just thought I'd add that in, not that it's relevant.

Ghouls get to ascend to higher levels of spook which rapidly become far more powerful than a ghost. That said, I did forget to add the red line that says that only spectres and poltergeists can do these sorts of things. A haunt or revenant cannot. Apart from that, ghouls and ghosts are two separate types of spook entirely. They don't have the same motives and purposes in rp.

I see where you're coming from. That said, spectres aren't good ghosts. The key difference between a spectre and a poltergeist is whether or not they have accepted their death gracefully. My spectre has accepted their death gracefully and isn't angry that they are dead. It enables them to do the things they enjoyed in life a lot more discreetly. My spectre is pretty malevolent underneath the surface. Poltergeists still retain the ability to claw at people and such. Ghosts have never been said to be able to throw people about however. Basically a poltergeists ability to harm people is still far better. They retain the ability to, whole possessing someone, give them minor bleeding and such. While beefed up on ectoplasm they can deliver nastier wounds as well. Perhaps shredding and stuff, and if necessary, full on slicing and biting and such. With that in mind, let me know what you think. That's just my perspective.

The Enhancement of Ghost Powers through Increased Generation of Ectoplasm OOC Note: Ghosts have long been known, to those that study them, to have a certain influence on the emotions of others. They've always been created by dying tragic, or violent deaths as well, usually filled with fear, or some other strong emotion. The draining aura of a ghost is no coincidence in this matter. It's how they replenish their ectoplasm, draining life force and mana from everything between people and even thin air. This affect is especially present on people, and it seems to be getting more and more impactful. A person's emotions affect their aura, and make themselves vulnerable to many kinds of attack. In this perspective, a ghost's draining aura primarily leaches small amounts of life force from the victims, but mostly tears away at their aura like a shade would. However, ghosts are not nearly as capable of corrupting the aura at will as a shade is, and they do not simply steal away emotions like Izkuthii do. A ghost must manipulate the emotions of their victim(s) such that some of the core layers of their aura begin to change color. This usually occurs through moments of stress, and negative emotion. This is why many ghosts take prefer to strike fear into the hearts of their prey. Fear is a very potent emotion that is relatively easy to illicit out of people. However, many ghosts prefer more subtle means as well, such as stress, anxiety, and misery. All of these negative emotions rattle the defenses of the emotional core of the aura, and leave it open to be drained and transferred into ectoplasm by the ghost. Many, with some prerequisite knowledge, could easily figure this out through logical assumptions. However, for the past many dozens of centuries of history of ghosts, they've all been feeding passively, not actively. Even those who seek to scare people and terrorize them because of how delicious their fear is aren't feeding actively. That is why poltergeists are generally seen to be stronger, more aggressive ghosts, than Spectres. However, this is not always a hard and fast rule, and in future it will become one less and less. What has changed in recent years is the emergence of Mystics, powerful mages that deal with the energies of ectoplasm - the stuff of Phantoms. Through Mysticism, many things are made possible, but to a ghost all that is important is the realization of the extent at which they can possibly manipulate ectoplasm. The only way they can manipulate ectoplasm, however, is by manipulating themselves - which means for this to be sustainable they must have MORE of themselves. And so, for the past few years many ghosts have been trying to figure out how they can gain more ectoplasm apart from their slow, trickling passive drain. Only recently have some spectres and poltergeists cracked the code for ectoplasmic feeding. They've begun to understand now that on some level, negative emotions of mortals come into play, and they are able to generate more ectoplasm than otherwise. At this time, ghosts aren't aware of the specific mechanics by which they act when they do this, and rather assume they're feeding on fear, horror, misery, panic, anger, etc. directly, when in fact they are feeding off of the compromised aura's and converting that into ectoplasm for themselves. Through these studies, high level ghosts are now able to ramp up their previously slow and passive draining. While this has little more effect on mortals around them, as they simply feed on the aura's which is essentially waste from the soul, something that will become more evident with this discovery is an surge in hauntings of various kinds in the effort of getting acquiring more ectoplasm and enhancing their power. The more ectoplasm a ghost can amass, the more powerful their existing abilities become. Ghostly Abilities affected by having more ectoplasm Resisting demanifestation: A ghost who is fed and fat on ectoplasm would require more effort to be demanifested and purged than a ghost who is otherwise not. Ghost Telekinesis: A ghost's telekinesis is enhanced greatly from T3 all the way up to possibly T5. However, a ghost can only be at max telekinetic strength when essentially physically touching their subject. In effect, their strength becomes that of an orc when in physical contact with an object, and thus cannot fire off small objects like speeding arrows such as a mortal telekinetic can. They can flip tables, grasp and throw people, and even attempt to break down doors with this strength. However it must be used somewhat sparingly, as every exertion costs ectoplasm. They fatigue at a similar rate as a normal telekinetic would, unless they are causing sufficient horror to sustain themselves better. Active Drain: A ghost can sustain their abilities use by causing sufficient fear, agony, and misery such that they can drain enough aura and convert it to ectoplasm fast enough, and in large enough volumes, that their ectoplasmic usage is replenished. By no means would this mean they can just throw heavy objects around non stop, it just means that they can do it regularly, for longer. This is a ghost's bread and butter. Preferably, they would cause misery to more than one person at a time, and thus have more active links to fuel themselves with. It's in a ghosts best interest to hoard their ectoplasm, and only use enough to defend themselves, or illicit the ability to feed in the first place. Ectoplasmic Backfire: At the core of every ghostly power lies Ectoplasm. In order to drain mana from a person or group of people, the ghost must link their ectoplasm with their aura. They're not aware this is what's happening, but that doesn't change the fact that it is. This means that there will always be residual ectoplasm left over from whatever ability they used on whatever subject. It doesn't last very long, perhaps a half hour at most before it dissipates, but it's enough to have an odd effect in certain circumstances. If someone dies near the ghost while it's draining them of their compromised aura, the link between them will shatter and backfire on the ghost. While this has little physical effect or even visible, the ghost feels it. It's not pain, but it is far from pleasant. Upon death, ectoplasm is generated in a short burst as the soul leaves the body, tearing away remnants of life force and mana with it. However, due to the ghostly link, the escaping soul has an easy source of ectoplasm to take from. This is a means of protection as the soul travels between planes to get to wherever it needs to go. This means that, for the ghost, they lose substantial ectoplasm. It isn't life threatening, and wouldn't cripple them (unless they were already depleted of ectoplasm), but it is counter productive. They would likely lose most of, if not all of the ectoplasm they had acquired from the terror they had caused in that person. The first time this happens for a ghost will make it abundantly clear to them that murder is rarely ever a good option for them. The only time this ectoplasmic backfire can be negated is if the ghost kills someone in the company of another person who is horrified by the display, and generates sufficient ectoplasm to counteract this. That is why there are many tales of ghosts leading people to their gruesome demise just in time for their loved ones to round the corner to witness the screaming stop for ever. This is also why there aren't many stories of ghosts killing people on a whim. They always toy with their food, and rarely snuff it out, unless it would generate a decent profit of ectoplasm from witnesses. Corporealness: A ghost can become semi-corporeal when using more powerful abilities, such as higher end telekinesis. This means they become visible for a time, and are able to be pushed against and affected by people around them. While properly injuring the ghost would require gold or some other weakness, such as bright light of sunlight intensity, they can be pushed around. For example, if a ghost is lifting someone, another person could try to push the ghost over. With sufficient effort, a ghost can lose focus for a moment, and would lose control of the subject of their influence. Not quite as easy as it is to mess with a mages concentration, but doable with a good head start run and shove. Others: Generally a rule of thumb is if it can be logically enhanced with more ectoplasm, it will be. These are the three primary examples, however. Red Lines: -Killing someone, or allowing someone to die while you are haunting them comes with a substantial consequence. Ghosts should do this sparingly, if at all ever. The point of ghosts is not to antagonize through murder and pillaging like other dark creatures do, but to antagonize through mind games or shock horror and fear. -Ghosts, at "T5 telekinetic ability" have a max telekinetic strength of an orc, and can only utilize their max strength at touching range. They may only physically grasp objects or kick them, etc. with this ability. They cannot do this from range. At a range of ten meters they can only lift a few minor objects. Past 15 meters, they can't manipulate anything at all. -Using any ghostly ability that would logically require actual effort (physical manipulation/ghost telekinesis, possession, etc.) requires use of ectoplasm - not simply the ghost's life essence, but literally pieces of their body - in a sense. Unless being sufficiently refueled, a ghost will lose steam eventually. This also means that the more a ghost depletes it's own ectoplasm (and the less returns it gets on that depletion) the easier it is to kill. -Draining does not exhaust people physically, but similarly to how shades operate, it is the sole reason for the icy ghost aura, and the depressed feeling people get when they have prolonged exposure to a ghost. -When exerting a stronger amount of ectoplasm, such as lifting heavy objects, you must become visible for the duration, and for at least one emote after the duration. Picking up a person, for example, would take at least one emote, and throwing them would be another. You become visible in the first emote, and remain visible for at least one emote following the release of the person. While still unharmed by mundane weaponry, they can be shoved, or otherwise have their conversation broken with sufficient effort, and as a result, drop the subject in question, or have the power they're using interrupted. -These powers are reserved for Specters/Poltergeists and "above". (Gravens, apparations, etc.)

"Where be volume II and I?"

((But why?))

Why would they want to go up the ranks? They're not intelligent enough to know about that.

Because who the hell wants to role play a brainless minion for more than a day or two? It's not interesting. It gives you like one or two options for RP. It's STUPID. This isn't JUST a story. It's also a game. People like to enjoy themselves.

...Yeah, that's not the final form of a ghost. Paleknight's are so wildly different from ghosts it's amazing you even think that. The closest thing to what you say that would be considered even remotely true is that a paleknight is a ghost that is trapped in a stone body, basically. Idk why a ghost would want to be, for all intents and purposes, a DreadKnight and at the same time lose a lot of freedom. Invisibility, ******* with people, possession, etc. for less than living physical presence unless they just REALLY like killing people - and most ghosts aren't like that. Just a correction, is all. I feel like the final form of a ghost would be far more ghostly than a suped up golem.

Did you quote the wrong person...? Or something? Cause you've left me confused. I didn't insult anyone, or call people names. ...Nothing you said relates to the quote in what you said (which is a quote from me??) at all, as far as I can read. Pls clarify. lol

Yeah, people also argue about other video games, too. People are passionate about the things they enjoy, go figure! People don't like seeing stupid **** in the thing they enjoy that ruins the thing that they enjoy. HOLY COW, WHAT A REVELATION! Do you know how often overwatch players argue over who is and isn't balanced and who needs a nerf and so on and so forth? The mechanics of Lord of the Craft are it's lore, primarily. This is important to people who actually love this ****. Imagine if someone took your favourite book, say it's harry potter, and insisted that their headcannon was true canon and that conflicted with your own idea of what's right about the harry potter universe. Fan theories fly about and you don't agree with them, you say something. Maybe you're just devoid of any passion for anything other than **** posting, the both of you.

You probably just didn't read half of what I wrote. Or missed the point. Which is, you're making my point. Men aren't and cannot be expected to just be 'cattle' to frost witches. It's not like humans and cows. Humans have never been cows. Cows do not become humans. If they did, we wouldn't be too keen on eating cows. Frost witches were women. They were women who, probably, liked men. Some of the frost witches became frost witches because their husbands were eaten, they were put in that vulnerable state, and thus marked for frostwitchdom by the frost witch who ate the man. They were people, and just because they are not frost witches, doesn't strip that status from them. They still have those feelings, they still are the person they were before inside, but the body they are now in requires them to eat the flesh of men. You are the one making the janked analogy to humans and cattle. I'm pointing out how that analogy is broken beyond repair due to the fact that human individuals have never been cows. Human women can turn to frost witches. Cows cannot become humans. Frost witches eat men because they HAVE to. Many enjoy it, many are sociopaths, and many also didn't choose to become frost witches. It was more or less forced upon them.

They can get into genuine relationships with them because unlike people viewing cows as food, frost witches have been the same species as their food before. Not all frost witches are quite willing (in character) to be a frost witch, but were turned against their will. Your own screenshot says that explicitely. A known tactic of frost witches is to devour a married man and turn the grieving widow into a frost witch. Yes, she definitely wanted to join the creatures who ruined her life. She's heckin' jazzed about it. At the end of the day, people have never been cattle before. Frost witches are and were always people before turning. Why would turning to ice and craving man meat all the time in all the wrong ways strip away empathy and emotion? There's tons of examples of horrible monsters like vampires who don't want to hurt innocent people, but sometimes HAVE to for the sake of their own survival. Few humans enjoy the act of bolting a cow in the head so they can eat it later. It makes us uncomfortable to end something's life like that. That's why a lot of people are vegetarians, and others will only ever eat something that can be purchased in a form that doesn't look like the thing it was. They objectify it easier and consume it. I know I wouldn't be able to raise a pig from birth till butcher time, and eat that pig. **** I couldn't butcher it unless I absolutely had to. Like end of the world, either me or the pig, scenario. So, hopefully you understand how frost witches can have genuine relationships with men, as well as compassion and - remember they were people before - sexual compulsions just like any other living, breathing thing.

*violently coughs* Goats *Cough cough*

Right?

And just like Ascended, their true age would rapidly catch up with them. IE: frosty for 50 years turned as a 20 year old human would rapidly age to 70 year old gramma.

You mean literally all the time?

Right?