Whitelist Application Update

[Unwillingly 18096]

2 hours ago, Kaii said:

 

Heyo! Issues such as being too tall or having white hair are reasons to be put on pending, but people aren't denied for these reasons alone. If an applicant doesn't fix the issues within 48 hours, then they are denied though thats after the applicant is either given a dm on discord or the forums. The only reasons people get instantly denied are if they're under the age of 13, the rules are not read, if the application is written in a different language or if the application includes inappropriate content, and so on. 

I'm making the point that regardless of the pending/deny label these things shouldn't really be taken into account because of how harmless they are, not that they get "instantly denied" for them. even putting players on pending on principle, it's a gamble as to whether or not they'll even bother revising their application later on. I'm also citing the infamous "human put on pending for having green eyes" (yes literally) incident which we seemingly never got any explanation for. as rigorous point out above, players should really be tested on their ability to understand the fundamentals rather than adhere to pedantic lore standards

[Suxals 529]

5 hours ago, Smol said:

Additionally, we would like for applicants to include a reference to recent server lore & include a current realm in their backstory.

I will also comment on this. I think most newbies won't look at the forums, since they are hard to navigate even for experienced players.

 

They will go to the Wiki and write about how their character lives happily at Haense, in the continent of Almaris. Or a farfolk that lives in the Sovereign State of Hyspia.

 

I could go on, but you get the point, if the go-to place for newbies for inspiration; the racial hub, is outdated, how can we expect them to know the recent happenings within the server?

 

I am trying to follow the logic of someone who is trying to apply, and the more I look, the more outdated pages I find, like settlement guides, locations page, etc 

 

Perhaps it is not an issue and everyone is accurate with the lore they cite, but I am mostly contrasting the demands we're making with what the wiki has to offer.

 

Pd: I find funny the "Modern History" page hasn't been updated in 9 years.

 

 

[Cheese 8874]

4 hours ago, Unwillingly said:

I dislike the elitism mindset some people (not CT specifically) have about applicants and "literacy" standards people have towards applicants truthfully and I wish that leniency was reflected in the application process

I’m not sure but the rest of CT, but I tend to look at the participant’s age and location when looking at their writing skills. If there’s room for improvement, great! Let’s foster that! But on the same note, lotc is a very big and even intimidating server. If you don’t have a decent grasp on reading and writing in english it will not be a fun time for anyone. Literacy standards are necessary and important and while i’m sure no one is counting on every applicant to be perfectly fluent/eloquently written, throwing someone with minimal english skills who doesn’t understand basic punctuation, grammar, or spelling, or is in constant need of a translator or TTS into the lion’s den (given many players are not as nice to our pink tags/not native speakers as they should be) probably won’t find lotc a good fit for them.

[Unwillingly 18096]

37 minutes ago, Cheese said:

I’m not sure but the rest of CT, but I tend to look at the participant’s age and location when looking at their writing skills. If there’s room for improvement, great! Let’s foster that! But on the same note, lotc is a very big and even intimidating server. If you don’t have a decent grasp on reading and writing in english it will not be a fun time for anyone. Literacy standards are necessary and important and while i’m sure no one is counting on every applicant to be perfectly fluent/eloquently written, throwing someone with minimal english skills who doesn’t understand basic punctuation, grammar, or spelling, or is in constant need of a translator or TTS into the lion’s den (given many players are not as nice to our pink tags/not native speakers as they should be) probably won’t find lotc a good fit for them.

and yet none of this is actually enforced once you're whitelisted. not a single whitelisted player will ever be, or has been, reprimanded for not spelling great, not punctuating properly, or writing poorly, so why do we hold applicants to these non-existent standards? also we need to be clear that I'm not talking about people who barely speak english and need a translator to play the server, obviously you need a basic understanding of english to play

I'm specifically talking about players who fall into the former category of not having great punctuation or spelling or the ability to write at-length. in truth I don't really know what you mean that, "if they can't do any of this, LOTC won't be a good fit for them." why not? there's many players who fall into this category, both new and old players alike, as long as they have a basic understanding of server rules and player interaction why are we measuring things like "basic punctuation, grammar, or spelling?" I've witnessed many new players who have subpar writing abilities but are somehow more desirable to interact with than LOTCers who spend 7 minutes describing how their Azure Orbs Panned Towards The Personage

[Laeonathan 5889]

Honestly, as a former CT, I think its silly to keep the same application process nearly as it was 15 IRL years ago - just whink about that. Its bloated and a waste of time, and from what I've seen, in no way ensures roleplay quality - and I think it shouldn't. Let people who come here learn, I did it too. My english was insanely bad and I had to google every 10th word someone used, often I struggled to understand people's emotes.

 

I learned. In my opinion, of the sake of the player and the CT handling applications they should simply be an "idiot filter":
CT should not make it  process. Don't check dozens of things. If they are smart enough to actually write smth up, even if it breaks lore, accept them. They'll be corrected ingame by other players. Its barely any effort.

BUT. We lose a lot of players due the long wait, sometimes over a week!

Remove pending. It's an extra loop that wastes times of CT, for literally no benefit. In doubt, just accept them. We have such a massive playerbase that the roleplay quality will still be enforced top down onto the new players. And even for people like me, who struggled a lot... we also WANT to improve because we want to be part of everything.

So please, abandon this system that wastes your time and prevents many people from joining because they get discouraged with a silly bureaucratic system.

[TaraJess 2848]

8 hours ago, Unwillingly said:

I'm making the point that regardless of the pending/deny label these things shouldn't really be taken into account because of how harmless they are, not that they get "instantly denied" for them. even putting players on pending on principle, it's a gamble as to whether or not they'll even bother revising their application later on. I'm also citing the infamous "human put on pending for having green eyes" (yes literally) incident which we seemingly never got any explanation for. as rigorous point out above, players should really be tested on their ability to understand the fundamentals rather than adhere to pedantic lore standards

 

I'll step out and say this, and this is just me, I don't speak for other CT members. 

 

If an application has a singular issue with a skin/description, usually I accept them. When I msg them to let them know they've been accepted, I tell them 'hey please make this change to your skin/description' because I know ow those first round application skins usually don't stick around. They usually upgrade to a nicer skin that fits the LOTC aesthetic.

 

Now if there is an issue with the skin/description and other stuff on top, then it goes on pending to be fixed. 

[Crunchiest_Leaf 1242]

My orcs were killed by parents

[Cheese 8874]

9 hours ago, Unwillingly said:

and yet none of this is actually enforced once you're whitelisted. not a single whitelisted player will ever be, or has been, reprimanded for not spelling great, not punctuating properly, or writing poorly, so why do we hold applicants to these non-existent standards? also we need to be clear that I'm not talking about people who barely speak english and need a translator to play the server, obviously you need a basic understanding of english to play

I'm specifically talking about players who fall into the former category of not having great punctuation or spelling or the ability to write at-length. in truth I don't really know what you mean that, "if they can't do any of this, LOTC won't be a good fit for them." why not? there's many players who fall into this category, both new and old players alike, as long as they have a basic understanding of server rules and player interaction why are we measuring things like "basic punctuation, grammar, or spelling?" I've witnessed many new players who have subpar writing abilities but are somehow more desirable to interact with than LOTCers who spend 7 minutes describing how their Azure Orbs Panned Towards The Personage

Did you just ask why it’s important for people to have a basic grasp on punctuation, grammar, and spelling on a writing server 

[Unwillingly 18096]

1 hour ago, Cheese said:

Did you just ask why it’s important for people to have a basic grasp on punctuation, grammar, and spelling on a writing server 

if you're not going to engage with the point you should probably turn your attention inward before being passive aggressive or waffling on applicants (for standards that literally NOBODY else is held to on the server once you're whitelisted btw) because the truth is theres several people on CT who fall into this category of poor writing quality themselves, yet never in a million years would you throw these petty twitter one-liners at them or already whitelisted players or other staff members for it

[Schindleria 1]

I do not think that forcing references to lore is very inviting to new players. Obviously CT wants to make sure players know about the lore, but being forced to shove references in one's application doesn't really actually do that. Plus, making new players do research on topics they probably don't care much about beforehand is probably not going to make it as easy to complete the application.

 

I like the other changes though !

[carawithcookies 145]

I doubt the player will go through a long research on lore just to be accepted into the server, i joined lotc with VERY minimum knowledge on the lore and learned most of it from the other players in the server either through RP or just OOC interaction. I know CT expects new players to be familiar with the lore but i dont think this is the way to do it.

[DarkxWalker 248]

Bit of a late approach but I've always found the idea of applications on the forums a bit unconventional. Figured that, while LotC has been around for 15 years with a subpar similar application process, it's more reasonable to assume that the server's new player output and retention would improve with a complete overhaul of the application.

What I intend to say is that the server might benefit, more so from an in-game application process where a new player/wandering soul can submit their answers on the server optionally with a greylist allowing them to explore the map with the exclusion of interacting with other players aside from possibly monks (if they're getting reimplemented). This could be done through either a quick, straightforward tutorial followed by typing in /application, answering questions through either text, implementing MCQ questions of different varieties or a mix of both.

Given that this idea isn't exactly popular, but I have always been a strong advocate for it. The application would be redirected from Minecraft to an exclusive Discord channel for CT to review and implement the player onto the server with the click of a button, or a few.

Good idea? Maybe, but I cannot be bothered to actually turn this into a suggestion with the whole yabble of feedback and whatnot. Figured it would be a good idea to chime in my two cents anyways.

[The Tough Guy 4319]

17 hours ago, Unwillingly said:

not having great punctuation or spelling or the ability to write at-length

 

stop calling me out bro 🥀

[faust 54]

My opinion kind of falls along the same lines of what a lot of people have already said. When I was applying (and even now) trying to navigate the forums to find specific lore to reference takes you down a very convoluted and confusing path where more likely than not you're going to find threads entirely unrelated to what you were looking for. IN MY OPINION the lore is much easier to digest when you are learning it the better way (IRP) as opposed to trying to understand a potentially outdated or unnecessarily wordy forum post. I am biased I hate navigating these forums. 

 

As much as I understand wanting a person to flesh their character out beforehand this change seems like it would be more likely to turn away those who simply wanted to try out an RP server & now they have to invest in learning the lore beforehand to even have a chance. Better solution if the goal is for people to have a basic understanding of current world lore when coming on the server is for someone to make a summarized compilation of current realms/other lore for new players to have an easy way of knowing the general information needed without having to hunt for it. The only downside to that is that it would have to be consistently updated.

 

Spoiler