[✗] [Rewrite] Ologs - Krug's Indomitable

[siglms_ 932]

OLOG REWRITE!!!!! POG!!!!!

[truelarper 593]

this is actually fire? time to bring you back

Edited May 12 by truelarper

[Jaslaw 602]

18 minutes ago, Reece Nolan said:

 

I don't think there needs to be a downside, that's why it's a CA. Players apply by explaining the lore thoroughly in their own words to demonstrate that they understand how it works, to prevent power gaming. It's not like the average player is going to say "Olog please!" And be handed an unstoppable CA, in-fact, that seems like what they're trying to get rid of.

 

I don't know, I think this rewrite is good, it cleans up an old lore piece, gives it modern formatting and some narrative fluff. Overall a positive change, just has some semantics issues in the wording.

Well USUALLY it should not. But when it is an open CA anyone can just apply for and make a character in I do not really trust it. The identity of Ologs to this point was ''you are strong but at a cost''. That kept their numbers small and made them ''balanced'' in a way, while also making it easy to get rid of bad apples that would abuse Olog mechanics.

When you take away the cost, all you are left with is just an OP CA that just kind of exists for the heck of it. My issue is not fully that there is ''no downside'' in of itself, the issue is the ammount of buffs and abilities that they get at no cost. Its litterally just orcs, but better. And I swear to god if I see one of these things become a templar I will cry.

As of right now, Ologs can not get any magics- They only get acess to 3 nonecombative feets and NOTHING ELSE. On top of their simple minds keeping back.

That is their justification for the power they have, meanwhile this rewrite? It simply takes all of that away and gives you a needlessly powerful persona, that can do politics, intrigue, magic, reaserch, ANYTHING really. 

It frankly just seems unfair to people who play none orcs at this point, normal orcs are already bad. Getting special rules in lore as well as having boosted strength and being able to get away with a lot more- Taking that and cranking it up is NOT a good idea in the slightest. Trust me the kind of people that will be drawn to the idea of ''super OP with nothing bad about them!'' Persona, should not have that kind of Persona. 

[ClassyDryad 2367]

@PanasheaRage takes 1 emote to incite and lasts only 4 emotes so it's basically just roughly the same thing as using a longbow.

 

Also I personally think this would still result in a lion's share of existing orcs just moving to olog because it doesn't have any downsides compared to orc. Again this rewrite feels more for orcs to obtain concrete combat buffs more than it feels like it exists for the niche of olog players.

 

I'd consider maybe making it so only child orcs can undergo the olog ritual but that would ultimately just be a temporary solution to the above.

[BakedPotato 1018]

10 minutes ago, Jaslaw said:

But when it is an open CA anyone can just apply for and make a character in I do not really trust it.

Most CAs can be played by just anyone as a lot of them are created by someone else with the exception of endgame CAs, i dont rly think ologs are as op as u believe in this write, if anything id call it a nerf

[Panashea 3323]

4 minutes ago, ClassyDryad said:

Again this rewrite feels more for orcs to obtain concrete combat buffs more than it feels like it exists for the niche of olog players.

 

 

An uruk with heavy armor /w boomsteel and a bow or a warhammer has the same combat efficacy as an Olog in this current write.  Nothing stops ologs from using warhammers, long bows, or medium armor/heavy armor in the current write. Bolstered strength on its own is still stronger than what's provided here.

[PrimnyaQuorum 3999]

What does this rewrite aim to address? It seems to me like its just another attempt to buff orcs/ologs as a whole. 

 

Why the inclusion of some rare BM ritual thats half outlined? Why do orcs need to become ologs? Why do ologs need magical compatiblity when most other olog-esqe creatures lack it? 

 

You cite bolstered strength but that has baked in, and much more severe limitations, alongside those having it having to find rare knowledge alchemy. Open CA means open CA. I don't think this is fixing any issues w/ ologs

[Jaslaw 602]

21 minutes ago, BakedPotato said:

Most CAs can be played by just anyone as a lot of them are created by someone else with the exception of endgame CAs, i dont rly think ologs are as op as u believe in this write, if anything id call it a nerf

The issue is that magic is really good. Templarism makes it so you can cast insane spells and not lose any physical strength, heck even magical Seer ((that Ologs can not become as of right now)) has some pretty good spells and no cost physically. Kani is also one, and I am telling you- There WILL be martial arts magic Ologs the second this passes. This also comes in addition to them being as mentally capable as any other race, right now they are on part with children in their mental prowess. THAT ALONE is a huge bane to playing them as pf right now, it locks them out of leadership possitions and any ''higher up'' rank for example. With it gone? They are really just orcs but better.

Not to mention that physically, they might have been nerfed a bit. From 3x to 2 times ((Basically for the whole combat. Holy hell 8/12 emotes is insane most combats do not last much more than that)) or 1.5 x normally, but the durability, size and overall insane power is still there at its core. It is a good bit of an issue there.

And well, not really. MOST CA's will need you to search out a specific magic/feet user and than the CA will most offten than not be weaker than this. It is deceptive because it might not LOOK like a lot- But I have played a lot of CAs in the past, and holy heck this is INSANE.

((Alongside other CAs having banes or even PK mechanics tied to them for mid ''strength''))

Edited May 12 by Jaslaw
Added on last line

[Panashea 3323]

17 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

Why the inclusion of some rare BM ritual thats half outlined? Why do orcs need to become ologs?Why do ologs need magical compatablity when most other olog-esqe creatures lack it? 

It doesn't say orcs need to become ologs, in addition to many orcish clans already having olog lineage that got retconned when Ologs were made into separate CA. (i.e Braduk).  The inclusion of the blood ritual is pretty overt as a connection between Iblees, Krug, Shamanism and Spiritualism .

Golems can be equipped with Sigils as well as being described as being stronger than ologs.

 

Zar'akal Crunch can be used in conjunction with Naztherak other other compatible magics.

 

Azdrazi also have an olog tier ability in conjunction with their magics.

 

Pale Lord get menhir craft, eidola storage, augments and so on. 

 

I understand that these are created creatures and thus are more difficult to create but it's clear they do not lack magical ability or compatibility via their mechanics.  Plenty of people post asking people to play Brutus Golems and there is no issue with them being super strong or "gated" because they're not an Open CA.

 

17 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

You cite bolstered strength but that has baked in, and much more severe limitations, alongside those having it having to find rare knowledge alchemy.

 

Bolstered strength [3x] as it stands is stronger than an Olog's rage[2x]. An uruk using a warhammer is as strong as the only other pronounced effect via their fist. Bolstered Strength has a cooldown, but no limitation to how many times it can be used. Homunculi can also stack mutations or normal uruks in addition to Shamanism or other compatible magics. Orcs already have the ability to do what is provided in the submission. 

 

 

17 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

Open CA means open CA. I don't think this is fixing any issues w/ ologs

Ologs are already an open CA with 3x the strength of normal descendants. This write would lower that strength cap and outline it within the core orc lore without having to know about tawkin. 

[Jaslaw 602]

13 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

What does this rewrite aim to address? It seems to me like its just another attempt to buff orcs/ologs as a whole. 

 

Why the inclusion of some rare BM ritual thats half outlined? Why do orcs need to become ologs? Why do ologs need magical compatiblity when most other olog-esqe creatures lack it? 

 

You cite bolstered strength but that has baked in, and much more severe limitations, alongside those having it having to find rare knowledge alchemy. Open CA means open CA. I don't think this is fixing any issues w/ ologs

Yea stuff like Bolster Strength also has a 3 or so emote ''cooldown'' after it is done which leaves you unable to do anything... this rewrite does not have anything CLOSE to that. Its just that but BUFFED into insanity.

[Panashea 3323]

2 minutes ago, Jaslaw said:

The issue is that magic is really good. Templarism makes it so you can cast insane spells and not lose any physical strength, heck even magical Seer ((that Ologs can not become as of right now)) has some pretty good spells and no cost physically. Kani is also one, and I am telling you- There WILL be martial arts magic Ologs the second this passes. This also comes in addition to them being as mentally capable as any other race, right now they are on part with children in their mental prowess. THAT ALONE is a huge bane to playing them as pf right now, it locks them out of leadership possitions and any ''higher up'' rank for example. With it gone? They are really just orcs but better.

 

The post explicitly says they cannot become Templar, nor can Ologs use Kani while in enraged. Orcs can already learn Kani and Templar and their strengths would be equalized should the write pass. Ologs have already become leadership positions, TheDutchSupremacy has been leader of a clan for like 6 IRL years and last map we had an Olog Rex.

[BakedPotato 1018]

4 minutes ago, Jaslaw said:

Not to mention that physically, they might have been nerfed a bit. From 3x to 2 times ((Basically for the whole combat. Holy hell 8/12 emotes is insane most combats do not last much more than that)) or 1.5 x normally, but the durability, size and overall insane power is still there at its core. It is a good bit of an issue there.

When raging they cant cast any magic btw

[Anbennar 2350]

3 minutes ago, Panashea said:

last map we had an Olog Rex.

This was crazy btw. 

[Jaslaw 602]

5 minutes ago, Panashea said:

 

The post explicitly says they cannot become Templar, nor can Ologs use Kani while in enraged. Orcs can already learn Kani and Templar and their strengths would be equalized should the write pass. Ologs have already become leadership positions, TheDutchSupremacy has been leader of a clan for like 6 IRL years and last map we had an Olog Rex.

Where does it say they can not become Templars?

And not being able to cast while in rage, is a plus. But it does not really ''justify'' its existance or make it that much better, it is still an additional option for combat which makes them TWICE as strong as a normal person, its really a case of ''OH NOOOO! My toast is perfectly baked and my lobster too buttery!'' at that rate. And as much as I find an Olog leading ammusing, it gives WAY too much oportunity for stuff like that happening outside of orc comunities and actually doing mentally difficult stuff while still remaining quite simply broken as better orcs. 

[BakedPotato 1018]

1 minute ago, Jaslaw said:

Where does it say they can not become Templars?

It gives a list of what they can learn starting with shamanism