corcitura salt lore fix

[tantuni445 289]

11 hours ago, Islamadon said:

Corc players avoiding manned gates challenge [impossible]
 

 

Evil RPers dance precariously upon a cliff's edge. It seems that they do not grasp that if they take away the legal methodology of outing them as freaks, the greater community can return to old ways in looking at their skins and going "they make me uncomfortable". From this, they can just cave their skull in with a steel bludgeon, with complete RP legality, due to simple discomfort or the backing of newly passed cloak-and-basement laws (why were you there? do you have a license for that?)

 The Salt Test, necessitating an item, declaws unprepared testers and provides a higher degree of validity for "they are metagaming" claims in defense of Corc RPers in Sus Issues (LT Enforcement). This also applies for other testing methodologies, like Sigismund Candles for Mystics. Essentially, these pushes are advocating for the loss of your own player rights by enabling players to kill you for worse reasons (I am victim blaming, but only for Evil RPers).

NOTE: This response is not an official LT or ST stance.

 

[Sr_Dimentio 584]

Dude, Corcitura are the LEAST dangerous evil creatures on the server probably, not even creatures, A FEAT! They're normal descendants! Atleast give the feat this, getting to the thirsting state is very easy, more if you play more characters than the vampire, it will only add a liiiiiittle temporal relief of one week until they have to hunt again or they're in constant danger once again, I think it's harmless and I don't know why vampires are the ones with the easiest way of getting them when again, IT'S A FEAT!

[Arianthe22 242]

15 hours ago, DISCOLIQUID said:

If you ask them to /use an item they don't have, they have all the OOC proof they now need to know you're a vampire, and can just go get it while you are stuck in a mechanically inescapable gatehouse cutscene. 

You know... This is obvious but I never thought of it. I'll start doing that as a non vamp. Ask them to /use. Time to muddy the waters :3.

[Jaslaw 602]

Honestly needed. The test is so easily done with no cost to the player doing it that it just became a norm to do everywhere and its considered suspicious to not want your hand sliced open and than have salt poured into the wound. 

People not cataloging their feeding timers and all that is an issue of its own, but this would be huge for those that want to do some cool darkspawn rp without getting instantly found out with no real investigation rp besides a guard going ''why not?'' 

If you have an actual reason to suspect someone of being a darkspawn, do more roleplay! Find the proof! Don't just do one single ''cuts hand pours salt in'' emote and be 100% certain because thats straight up lame. It could still work if the person you are investigating is lacking on their feedings which could be cool but it won't be an insant GG its jover for them that they couldn't avoid in any shape or form

TLDR: More roleplay, makes being found out easily avoidable rather then an instant end to whatever you were doing. Overall huge +1

[Chuuwys 502]

On 4/21/2026 at 3:01 PM, Venomous_Pup said:

PLEASE. To put it in perspective, as I talked about in a different Discord, only counting ten Aether players, they are granted 14 edit tokens a week. You can get a full stack of Sugar from CT completely free, as you require no tools. With 14 tokens, you can edit 64 items in a stack, which grants you about 896 salt items per week. Times this by ten for a whopping production of 8960 salt items, which means to run out over the course of the year, you would need to test 24.5 people a day. This is just with ten Aether players, this doesn't consider the fact of other VIP members banding together or voting milestones, granted a bit extreme but uncapped production for an item that can instantly expose a Corc despite how carefully they play to be ruined because they get caught in some gate house is cooked.

ez fix, make it an alchemical item that requires an ST sign and cant be stacked or can only have 2-3 made per day. that way youre introducing just as much scarcity as you should to a supposedly special salt without also spamming it incessantly. if you find players getting picked out in overly specific or suspicious reasonings (i.e not testing 10 people but just so happening to test the next corc to enter. doesnt include if a city is on high alert for darkspawn etc and would likely be doing more tests). your scarcity of materials would then be better balanced to prevent spamming whilst also allowing room for people to be more watchful that it isn't metagamed, while still letting the test exist with some effectiveness. * and as others stated, also make it /use

 

otherwise +1 cos.. i think other than aurum gating against certain (usually harmless) darkspawn you cant really prevent anything else without just closing your doors and gates which is a bore

[Mordringfan 166]

+1

[Wonderland_Boy 1080]

[MysticalWeasel 910]

[_AzureLexi 765]

[The Vulgate Cycle 577]

I am not fully aware of where all this vampire testing is taking place, but to kinda give my two cents.

 

I think when you choose to play an FA or a Dark CA or anything like that, you're essentially signing up to play an antagonist that can and most likely will eventually get caught. You're an enemy that most people train irply to fight, detect and destroy. 

 

I think if you make peace with that, it becomes a lot easier to take the loss. 

 

Also- I have seen plenty of examples of people who are able to play a Corc and not instantly get caught. I know of two Corcs oocly that walk around major settlements that are able to do so just fine because they dont draw attention to themselves and avoid the obvious things that would prompt a test. 

 

So making a darkspawn test even harder in response to bad faith rpers feels a little silly to me. 

Like someone else said, at best, I would make the testing method require an alchemical salt (rp signed, not ST signed) so that there has to be a little more work put into it but otherwise

 

It's the risk you take by playing a corc

[Wonderland_Boy 1080]

Now, on a more serious note, I’ll say this as both someone who played a vampire for well over a year and as someone who ruled over a vassal (aka Ipanema) and had to deal with darkspawn by making the gate process more efficient
 

The salination lore for Corcitura is shit and has always been shit. Vampirism is an FA focused on infiltrating a nation in the best way possible, so much so that STs denied the idea of a vampire lair because the purpose which the lore pushes for, is to live within cities rather than simply being villains
 

Nevertheless, the fact that salt isn’t even roleplayed as being made, and people just go to CT, edit a stack of sugar, rename it salt, then use and abuse it during RP is just insane. There were a number of times where I had characters close to becoming nobles but lost everything because they needed to go somewhere and were outed in a gate process.
 

Even players can use the lore in bad faith. I’ll give an example that happened during the temp map.
 

My vampire, Zaheer, was at the beach and was being interrogated by a templar alongside others. The vampire rewrite lore had only come out not long before, so I was still getting used to it. None of the people there even knew how the new salination lore worked, so they first tried using templar flames on him. Of course, it didn’t work. Then they moved on to trying nearby sand, which also didn’t work. I had confirmed OOCly that only saltwater would work, which then led to the same person who had tried both methods simply dragging him into the water after the OOC clarification to test him.
 

Of course, this is only one example. Nevertheless, the main issue with this lore is that salt is abused as a tool to catch people, even when there is little proof they’re vampires, and it will continue to be that way. A change to make them immune to salt isn’t perfect, of course, as people have said earlier in this chat. There are better ways, like making it alchemical or just using ******* blistherthorn.
 

But this is just my opinion: salination lore is fucked when you consider the kind of playerbase we have on LOTC.

[tantuni445 289]

7 hours ago, The Vulgate Cycle said:

I am not fully aware of where all this vampire testing is taking place, but to kinda give my two cents.

 

I think when you choose to play an FA or a Dark CA or anything like that, you're essentially signing up to play an antagonist that can and most likely will eventually get caught. You're an enemy that most people train irply to fight, detect and destroy. 

 

I think if you make peace with that, it becomes a lot easier to take the loss. 

 

Also- I have seen plenty of examples of people who are able to play a Corc and not instantly get caught. I know of two Corcs oocly that walk around major settlements that are able to do so just fine because they dont draw attention to themselves and avoid the obvious things that would prompt a test. 

 

So making a darkspawn test even harder in response to bad faith rpers feels a little silly to me. 

Like someone else said, at best, I would make the testing method require an alchemical salt (rp signed, not ST signed) so that there has to be a little more work put into it but otherwise

 

It's the risk you take by playing a corc

 

 

Hello there! thank u so much for ur comment, but I must tell these things. When we see an unfair problem in the mechanics of the lore, we create our own lore submissions. If we have the mentality of "this is how it is, if you don't like it, don't play it," then no lore/magic/feat or CA can progress. Was playing Draugar mandatory? No! It was a choice. Was permanent death by breaking the phylactery a stupid and disgustingly vile rule? Yes. (Of course, darkspawn hunters usually searched the entire map to find where the phylactery were hiding. Did they use Freecam? Maybe. This is actually similar to searching for Corcitura applications on the forum.) And what happened? With the new necromancy, they rewrote it in a better form. They didn't go around telling people "if you don't like it, don't play it." Or Treelords? Treelords were hit by a PK wave because of some loopholes in their old lore. Playing that creature wasn't mandatory, and yes, it was people's own responsibility. But then what happened? People started working on rewriting Treelords. They didn't just settle for saying "if you don't like it, don't play it" because while that was a reasonable answer, it wasn't a sufficient action!  I understand that the corcitura has no pk clause. so While the severity of the consequences might not be the same, I think these are reasonable examples.

Salt tests never went beyond cutting and pressing the palms of those at the door. Is your characters' training for hunting those creatures simply "stacking player-signed salts and cutting and pressing the palms of everyone who comes to the door"? Because that's what's happening. This lore suggestion doesn't make vampires invisible. it only provides a more reasonable level of stealth. Besides Corcitura and Mystic, there are no other creatures or magic you can TEST on anyway. What's the point? And Corcitura itself is a simple feat. "It's a risk you're taking." And this risk will not disappear. it will just be reduced to a more reasonable level. Let's also add that there is no testing method for the immortal moroi, who are Ca vampires.

 

(I'm not saying you're the one doing it. This part was again addressed generally to all vampire/darkspawn hunters) If this lore is accepted, you'll see vampires trying to drink more blood to avoid being caught. This way, instead of just running over people and salt test at the door thing them, your character will actually fight vampires in their "vampire form." It's more sensible for you. Thus, you'll truly be "hunting those creatures in rp. You won't be catching vampires by spamming salt emotes, unless that vampire is thirsty."

(Again, Separately and independently from your answer, this in response to some general comments I've seen: ) I don't understand why people would object to something that requires vampires to "act more like vampires to hide," and instead find the simple test, which proves problematic, more reasonable in role-playing . some people say that Corcitura players might lie about their feeding habits. Yes, they can. There is no higher intelligence or power tracking their feeding "even now". To my knowledge, no admin has ever asked a Corcitura player for screenshots of their last feeding. But consider this dear reader, you're assuming the people you're testing might lie to you. Have you ever asked a Moroi you're fighting for proof that they aren't "withered"? (A moroi who hasn't fed for 3 weeks receives some debuffs.) I don't think so. In this case, wouldn't this be more of an excuse than a genuine fear of being lied to?

 

[Animael 1500]

This is a nice idea. Giving vampires an incentive to feed, and providing a more active way for them to be caught. I don't play a vampire, but +1

[The Vulgate Cycle 577]

4 hours ago, tantuni445 said:

Hello there! thank u so much for ur comment, but I must tell these things. When we see an unfair problem in the mechanics of the lore, we create our own lore submissions. If we have the mentality of "this is how it is, if you don't like it, don't play it," then no lore/magic/feat or CA can progress. Was playing Draugar mandatory? No! It was a choice. Was permanent death by breaking the phylactery a stupid and disgustingly vile rule? Yes. (Of course, darkspawn hunters usually searched the entire map to find where the phylactery were hiding. Did they use Freecam? Maybe. This is actually similar to searching for Corcitura applications on the forum.) And what happened? With the new necromancy, they rewrote it in a better form. They didn't go around telling people "if you don't like it, don't play it." Or Treelords? Treelords were hit by a PK wave because of some loopholes in their old lore. Playing that creature wasn't mandatory, and yes, it was people's own responsibility. But then what happened? People started working on rewriting Treelords. They didn't just settle for saying "if you don't like it, don't play it" because while that was a reasonable answer, it wasn't a sufficient action!  I understand that the corcitura has no pk clause. so While the severity of the consequences might not be the same, I think these are reasonable examples.

Salt tests never went beyond cutting and pressing the palms of those at the door. Is your characters' training for hunting those creatures simply "stacking player-signed salts and cutting and pressing the palms of everyone who comes to the door"? Because that's what's happening. This lore suggestion doesn't make vampires invisible. it only provides a more reasonable level of stealth. Besides Corcitura and Mystic, there are no other creatures or magic you can TEST on anyway. What's the point? And Corcitura itself is a simple feat. "It's a risk you're taking." And this risk will not disappear. it will just be reduced to a more reasonable level. Let's also add that there is no testing method for the immortal moroi, who are Ca vampires.

Okay so, I understand the want to improve the lore, Im not against that if the rules are bad or incoherent. I also never really argued for a take it or leave it approach to the rules regarding Dark CAs or Feats. I even suggested an alternative approach that keeps the spirit of the salt test while also making it a little more difficult to acquire (mostly by just agreeing with someone else's suggestion).

The main point I was trying to make is that in my personal experience, we have never randomly tested anyone except in cases where we had a legitimate reason to suspect they were a vampire, they were caught red handed and we wanted to be thorough, or we got reports of a vampire attack and were at a heightened state of vigilance for a little while before going back to normal. Meaning that people just randomly doing it just to do it are doing so in bad faith and they should be called out more. Should the test be a little more thorough and complicated? Maybe, I dont particularly see why its entirely necessary but if we must change it, then I like the suggestion I gave previously more. Its more intuitive and clear cut.

 

5 hours ago, tantuni445 said:

Besides Corcitura and Mystic, there are no other creatures or magic you can TEST on anyway.

I dont particularly like this tbh, I think ALL dark CAs and feats should have some way of testing for them, even if it is difficult to do so. I think that should be a risk you are meant to make when playing any of these categories precisely because they are set up as antagonists in their own right to the rest of the PCs. 

These things SHOULD come with major risks is my keystone point.
Maybe this is a hot take but darkspawn / creatures should either be a lot more vulnerable to certain things in combat or a lot more easily detectable if a person knows what they are looking for.

 

[Beardicuss 486]

25 minutes ago, The Vulgate Cycle said:

Maybe this is a hot take but darkspawn / creatures should either be a lot more vulnerable to certain things in combat or a lot more easily detectable if a person knows what they are looking for.

See I would agree with this if such methods the second they are put it were not immediately made wide spread knowledge to everyone cause even if it's a secret all it takes is one person to publish books or once one dude figures it out they start training their entire military in it.