[✗] Darkstalkers Amendment[Nerf Strength]

[lemonke 6014]

Reasoning:

 

Darkstalkers are fundamentally one of the tankiest dark CAs around. They are even tankier than a pale knight and faster if cards are played right. They have gotten several tools to one-tap people and generally be quite strong, to the point that it is abused over and over to make a Darkstalker feel like an immortal. But what's worse, people purposely make ORC darkstalkers for no roleplay reason but to have an immortal undead with Orc strength who is on a horse and armed with several weapons like big shields, and the like. Furthermore, if they are a paramount, they get a lesser version of magic that helps them up. Therefore, their having peak orc strength is not needed, as it will also make their one-tap strength more powerful and is not done in any fruitful way. There is no narrative purpose since the only aim for these darkstalkers is min-maxing. Pale Knights fulfill more of the orc-strength kind of vibe, not Darkstalkers. They should remain KNIGHTS, not big tanky brutes.

 

CHANGES HAVE BEEN MADE IN BOLD!

 

 

Before:

 

 

Physical Description

Bearing a deathly visage, all darkstalkers are clearly identifiable as undead whether they are mummified corpses or fleshless skeletons. The stench of rot and decay may often linger about their cadaver, enticing some to fill their empty cavities with bundles of sage and incense to little avail. Few can recognize what once was, as who may stare into the empty sockets of a skull and find familiarity.

 

Darkstalkers harbor limitless endurance, never to tire or falter, meaning they can spar for days if not weeks until their bodies succumb to the destruction of battle. Their height and stature are the same as they were in life, viable to change under the keen eye of a necromancer who wishes to fleshsmith the guard to their liking. Their strength is comparable to the peak of their living race, bearing an unnatural aptitude for combat and knightly prowess. The resolute nature of the darkstalker is largely due to the excess lifeforce present, strengthening the body far past an average corpse. The durability and resilience of their body is likewise increased, making slashing and piercing weapons rather benign against the undead, save for crucial ligaments. One well placed hit from a greatsword may sever or crush a limb, offering a more precise attack to their frames. Their bones may be cut, maimed, or broken, with blunt force trauma often bringing about the most damage to their structures. This entices the undead to equip armor, adding some resilience to their otherwise brittle disposition. When unburdened by excess weight, darkstalkers are spry and quick, easily capable of outrunning encumbered mortals and even some elves. Capable of bearing plate armor and not much more, darkstalkers do not tire- yet they are burdened by armor all the same at the cost of skill and rotational movement. 

 

Undead constructs such as these have no ability to sleep, breathe, burn, etc. With no blood they cannot be poisoned or used as a source of genus, and feel no pain- or anything physical for that matter. Only sunlight and holy magic may bring about pain to these otherwise unfeeling foes, with sunlight offering a burning sensation to uncovered undead. This burning sensation turns from benign to the feeling of outright immolation over a few minutes, forcing most to don cloaks or skulk within shadows. Mundane fire acts akin to sunlit fire when near an uncovered darkstalker. First it will simply bring the sensation of a tingling pain, growing over the course of ten narrative minutes to the sensation of complete immolation. This can come from any light source as small as a torch, all the way up to a burning pyre. It should be noted that destroying the body will not kill the darkstalker, as their skull will continue to live on. Only by smashing or obliterating the skull will a darkstalker finally succumb to death- no matter how temporary it is. It requires the full destruction of the darkstalker skull to riddance the soul of the abyssal knight. This means three direct shots from a crossbow, or hits with a sword, would likely obliterate the skull. Rather, two hits from a warhammer would likely crush the skull, with blunt weapons offering a more resolute hit to the cranium. Should the skull be forcefully rendered from the body, it will simply fall inert and crumble until the skull is set back into place.

 

Darkstalkers due to their strength and vacuumous ashen soul are unable to learn magic in its fullest, save for specific knowledge-based feats. They are permitted to learn alchemy, further alchemy (animii crafting, anthroparion crafting, etc.), arcane displacement, and sorvian crafting.

 

 

• Darkstalkers are visibly undead when unveiled, with sunken and tepid flesh hanging from their structures. 

  • Only with the flesh facade spell is this correctable.

• Darkstalkers are undead with no muscles, meaning they have limitless endurance and may run or stay in combat for longened periods of time.

  • Only the wear and tear of such activities may hinder them.

• With a lack of weight, they are fast and spry. Even with armor they are still quick, yet cumbersome with the constricted movement plate armor gives.

• Darkstalker bones are strengthened by the residual lifeforce they garner from draining, making their structures less brittle and tougher.

• A well placed sword hit may crack some bone, but blunt weaponry will achieve better results.

• Darkstalkers may withstand some hits to their skull, allowing it to chip away. Only when the skull is completely obliterated, or fragmented, will the darkstalker die.

  • This requires three well placed shots from a crossbow or sword to destroy the skull. A warhammer only needs two well placed hits. A warhammer strike against an unarmored darkstalker, when pinned against a solid surface, would only require one hefty strike to obliterate the cranium.

• They are not harmed by poison, fire, drowning, etc. as there are no lungs to drown or blood to clot.

• Only sunlight and holy healing brings pain.

  • Direct sunlight will bring about a burning sensation, feeling as though their entire body is on fire with enough exposure.

  • Holy healing includes paladinism, and any other magic that directly attacks dark beings.

• They need not eat, sleep, and have dulled if not completely benign senses.

• Knights are as strong as their peak, living descendant counterparts and are unable to grow physically stronger.

• Any darkstalker that does not harbor a natural skeleton, or is larger than a descendant requires an Mart; i.e. a swarm of insects, an olog, or a serpentine abomination. This said, Musin, Kha, Hou-Zi and other specifically compatible beast races are permitted, given the soul does not become too degraded in the banks..

• Darkstalkers require a valid CA to play, and must be properly raised by the Sacrament of the Usurer.

• A darkstalker is unable to learn any magic, and any 'magical' feats.

  • Only knowledge based feats such as alchemy, arcane displacement, or sorvian sculpting may be learned. This list is exhaustive, and permits feats which don’t specifically require a pure soul.

 

 

After:

 

 

Physical Description

Bearing a deathly visage, all darkstalkers are clearly identifiable as undead whether they are mummified corpses or fleshless skeletons. The stench of rot and decay may often linger about their cadaver, enticing some to fill their empty cavities with bundles of sage and incense to little avail. Few can recognize what once was, as who may stare into the empty sockets of a skull and find familiarity.

 

Darkstalkers harbor limitless endurance, never to tire or falter, meaning they can spar for days if not weeks until their bodies succumb to the destruction of battle. Their height and stature are the same as they were in life, viable to change under the keen eye of a necromancer who wishes to fleshsmith the guard to their liking. Their strength is comparable to the peak of a human knight, bearing an unnatural aptitude for combat and knightly prowess. The resolute nature of the darkstalker is largely due to the excess lifeforce present, strengthening the body far past an average corpse. The durability and resilience of their body is likewise increased, making slashing and piercing weapons rather benign against the undead, save for crucial ligaments. One well placed hit from a greatsword may sever or crush a limb, offering a more precise attack to their frames. Their bones may be cut, maimed, or broken, with blunt force trauma often bringing about the most damage to their structures. This entices the undead to equip armor, adding some resilience to their otherwise brittle disposition. When unburdened by excess weight, darkstalkers are spry and quick, easily capable of outrunning encumbered mortals and even some elves. Capable of bearing plate armor and not much more, darkstalkers do not tire- yet they are burdened by armor all the same at the cost of skill and rotational movement. 

 

Undead constructs such as these have no ability to sleep, breathe, burn, etc. With no blood they cannot be poisoned or used as a source of genus, and feel no pain- or anything physical for that matter. Only sunlight and holy magic may bring about pain to these otherwise unfeeling foes, with sunlight offering a burning sensation to uncovered undead. This burning sensation turns from benign to the feeling of outright immolation over a few minutes, forcing most to don cloaks or skulk within shadows. Mundane fire acts akin to sunlit fire when near an uncovered darkstalker. First it will simply bring the sensation of a tingling pain, growing over the course of ten narrative minutes to the sensation of complete immolation. This can come from any light source as small as a torch, all the way up to a burning pyre. It should be noted that destroying the body will not kill the darkstalker, as their skull will continue to live on. Only by smashing or obliterating the skull will a darkstalker finally succumb to death- no matter how temporary it is. It requires the full destruction of the darkstalker skull to riddance the soul of the abyssal knight. This means three direct shots from a crossbow, or hits with a sword, would likely obliterate the skull. Rather, two hits from a warhammer would likely crush the skull, with blunt weapons offering a more resolute hit to the cranium. Should the skull be forcefully rendered from the body, it will simply fall inert and crumble until the skull is set back into place.

 

Darkstalkers due to their strength and vacuumous ashen soul are unable to learn magic in its fullest, save for specific knowledge-based feats. They are permitted to learn alchemy, further alchemy (animii crafting, anthroparion crafting, etc.), arcane displacement, and sorvian crafting.

 

 

 

• Darkstalkers are visibly undead when unveiled, with sunken and tepid flesh hanging from their structures. 

  • Only with the flesh facade spell is this correctable.

• Darkstalkers are undead with no muscles, meaning they have limitless endurance and may run or stay in combat for longened periods of time.

  • Only the wear and tear of such activities may hinder them.

• With a lack of weight, they are fast and spry. Even with armor they are still quick, yet cumbersome with the constricted movement plate armor gives.

• Darkstalker bones are strengthened by the residual lifeforce they garner from draining, making their structures less brittle and tougher.

• A well placed sword hit may crack some bone, but blunt weaponry will achieve better results.

• Darkstalkers may withstand some hits to their skull, allowing it to chip away. Only when the skull is completely obliterated, or fragmented, will the darkstalker die.

  • This requires three well placed shots from a crossbow or sword to destroy the skull. A warhammer only needs two well placed hits. A warhammer strike against an unarmored darkstalker, when pinned against a solid surface, would only require one hefty strike to obliterate the cranium.

• They are not harmed by poison, fire, drowning, etc. as there are no lungs to drown or blood to clot.

• Only sunlight and holy healing brings pain.

  • Direct sunlight will bring about a burning sensation, feeling as though their entire body is on fire with enough exposure.

  • Holy healing includes paladinism, and any other magic that directly attacks dark beings.

• They need not eat, sleep, and have dulled if not completely benign senses.

• Darkstalkers are as strong as a peak human knight, and are unable to grow physically stronger.

• Any darkstalker that does not harbor a natural skeleton, or is larger than a descendant requires an Mart; i.e. a swarm of insects, an olog, or a serpentine abomination. This said, Musin, Kha, Hou-Zi and other specifically compatible beast races are permitted, given the soul does not become too degraded in the banks..

• Darkstalkers require a valid CA to play, and must be properly raised by the Sacrament of the Usurer.

• A darkstalker is unable to learn any magic, and any 'magical' feats.

  • Only knowledge based feats such as alchemy, arcane displacement, or sorvian sculpting may be learned. This list is exhaustive, and permits feats which don’t specifically require a pure soul.

 

 

 

 

 

[HugoAntero 1962]

#justice4gillriik

[Navigator 4260]

yeah ngl, kinda silly that the skeleton in armor is tankier than the BIG ASS STONE KNIGHT

i'm not necro and idc but still +1

[TofuGomi 362]

not a necro but frequently get attacked by them. necro battles can be super fun, but it's frustrating when someone comes in, one shots you, then makes you /d20. 

 

definitely a +1, will help with people's enjoyment of the server as well as make more sense lore wise and balance wise. 

[usercultist 148]

u want to nerf the goatway so -1

[lemonke 6014]

1 minute ago, usercultist said:

u want to nerf the goatway so -1

THE GONEWAY

[LichinCrocs 257]

im going to say this darkstalkers arent even that hard to deal with just use an warhammer and not an sword -1

Edited June 21, 2025 by LichinCrocs

[lemonke 6014]

1 minute ago, LichinCrocs said:

im going to say this darkstalkers arent even that hard to deal with just use an warhammer and not an sword

yeah, it's difficult when they are on a horse armed with a big shield, armor, and anything rest. It would be less problematic if they weren't on a horse. Look, they are tankier than the Ca that's supposed to be tanky(paleknights) and unlike them, darkstakers can use horses, have normal block movement, and have other buffs in-between.

[LichinCrocs 257]

well yeah darkstalkers need 4 necros to make and its an end game undead ca

ill jusy say most undead either jump solo ppl or get pvp defaulted by 15 ppl , theres no need to amend this, its fine as it is, the lore needs an rewrite and  not Amendments that make the magic more of an shitfest of which is already is

[lemonke 6014]

6 minutes ago, LichinCrocs said:

well yeah darkstalkers need 4 necros to make and its an end game undead ca

U don't need orc-strength for an end game Ca. They are still powerful.

 

Make darkstalkers that make sense, not ORC darkstalkers for the sake of having orc-strength.

[Jaslaw 602]

I play an ''orc'' darkstalker so I kind of get the point. Orcish strengh is stupid, as in general- To make a race which is stricte a combat advantage against others is on part with simply being unfair and draws in the wrong kind of people, but I truely do not see why a END GAME CREATURE should be unable of wielding the same strengh as a FREE TO PLAY descendant race.

Personally I hate the idea of ''orcish strengh'' as a whole and never really used it to call some bulshiet with it, but the CA really isn't that strong when you get into it. Like, two hits to a limb disabling it fully ((Which your average templar Josh from Alba will take on the chin due to armor anyways)) And you being killed by two hits to the head at that is just kind of the most you get. 

The ''magic'' is really only flavorful from my experience, as Paramount abysal flames is litterally ''ball of bonk that does no damage to armored targets :D'' and ''yo your sword is a bit more heavy now!'' That doesn't actually let you do more damage then a earth rune weapon would. The Khor blades effects also being out-of-combat only

So I would say to nerf THE ORCS that are cousing this issue rather then making it so a CA can't use the race

 

[lemonke 6014]

10 minutes ago, Jaslaw said:

I play an ''orc'' darkstalker so I kind of get the point. Orcish strengh is stupid, as in general- To make a race which is stricte a combat advantage against others is on part with simply being unfair and draws in the wrong kind of people, but I truely do not see why a END GAME CREATURE should be unable of wielding the same strengh as a FREE TO PLAY descendant race.

Personally I hate the idea of ''orcish strengh'' as a whole and never really used it to call some bulshiet with it, but the CA really isn't that strong when you get into it. Like, two hits to a limb disabling it fully ((Which your average templar Josh from Alba will take on the chin due to armor anyways)) And you being killed by two hits to the head at that is just kind of the most you get. 

The ''magic'' is really only flavorful from my experience, as Paramount abysal flames is litterally ''ball of bonk that does no damage to armored targets :D'' and ''yo your sword is a bit more heavy now!'' That doesn't actually let you do more damage then a earth rune weapon would. The Khor blades effects also being out-of-combat only

So I would say to nerf THE ORCS that are cousing this issue rather then making it so a CA can't use the race

 

 

I cannot nerf the Orcs, unfortunately. That's squawk stuff; players cannot do changes on races as far as I'm aware. I had some complaints myself about how orcs are the only race with a real mechanic, but that's not my business. You are still stronger, and I understand John Templar's issues. You'll see I made a few reports on how Templars did some stuff.

 

However, unlike Templars, you have useful tools and can be really overwhelming. They are power gamers because their magic cannot do as much as they may think. You are also better than a pale knight, even without orc strength. You are faster, can use horses, and other weapons. You are useful even in non-combat scenarios, and, in my opinion, them having orc strength at this point is not needed due to the numerous mechanics they have.

[Jaslaw 602]

Just now, lemonke said:

 

I cannot nerf the Orcs, unfortunately. That's squawk stuff; players cannot do changes on races as far as I'm aware. I had some complaints myself about how orcs are the only race with a real mechanic, but that's not my business. You are still stronger, and I understand John Templar's issues. You'll see I made a few reports on how Templars did some stuff.

 

However, unlike Templars, you have useful tools and can be really overwhelming. They are power gamers because their magic cannot do as much as they may think. You are also better than a pale knight, even without orc strength. You are faster, can use horses, and other weapons. You are useful even in non-combat scenarios, and, in my opinion, them having orc strength at this point is not needed.

 

Yea fair point as that would be something which a lot of people would fight against and its something for a main race which would be way higher up the ladder then a CA

And I can not argue with darkstalkers still being strong as a race, but the issue begins when we fight orcs and they start crying about ''being stronger'' or the such. It might be my Haenseni PTSD talking after dealing with some very bad faight banditry I have went through ;LAUGHS IN PAIN AT THE MENTION OF ORCISH STRENGH;

Truth be told Eidola just got nerfed into absolute hell and I get why you want the Darkstalkers to somewhat match them in strengh but its sort of a 50/50 area for me, because falling into the mindset of keeping things ''balanced'' and only keeping on nerfing when CA's are meant to be at least somewhat powerful to be able to provide a chalange to players wishing to duel them or numerically supperior groups 

Personally I would be fine and approve of a system which deffines darkstalker strengh based on WHO and HOW MANY people they fight- As lore wise it would make sense, as darkstlakers gain power from their souls draining life force and biger oponents would be able to pasively keep them strenghened or when they fight more people from which their soul may draw energy from

So AKA I would do it that any darkstalker thats at least human-sized will be able to match Orc strengh of an Orcish oponent when fighting them on 1 on 1, or when being outnumbered by something like 2 to 1 ratio ((So 1 darkstalker fighting 2 humans gets orc strengh, 2 darkstalkers fighting 4 humans get orc strengh, but when 2 darkstalkers fight 3 humans only one gets the strengh))

Purely for the balancing reasoning and to keep it more entertaining and as a sort of a chalange to those trying to fight it, but thats the best solution that would compromise the two approached tbh

[NightcastorKitty 2780]

Sounds more like a race issue instead of creature :p

[lemonke 6014]

6 minutes ago, Jaslaw said:

 

Yea fair point as that would be something which a lot of people would fight against and its something for a main race which would be way higher up the ladder then a CA

And I can not argue with darkstalkers still being strong as a race, but the issue begins when we fight orcs and they start crying about ''being stronger'' or the such. It might be my Haenseni PTSD talking after dealing with some very bad faight banditry I have went through ;LAUGHS IN PAIN AT THE MENTION OF ORCISH STRENGH;

Truth be told Eidola just got nerfed into absolute hell and I get why you want the Darkstalkers to somewhat match them in strengh but its sort of a 50/50 area for me, because falling into the mindset of keeping things ''balanced'' and only keeping on nerfing when CA's are meant to be at least somewhat powerful to be able to provide a chalange to players wishing to duel them or numerically supperior groups 

Personally I would be fine and approve of a system which deffines darkstalker strengh based on WHO and HOW MANY people they fight- As lore wise it would make sense, as darkstlakers gain power from their souls draining life force and biger oponents would be able to pasively keep them strenghened or when they fight more people from which their soul may draw energy from

So AKA I would do it that any darkstalker thats at least human-sized will be able to match Orc strengh of an Orcish oponent when fighting them on 1 on 1, or when being outnumbered by something like 2 to 1 ratio ((So 1 darkstalker fighting 2 humans gets orc strengh, 2 darkstalkers fighting 4 humans get orc strengh, but when 2 darkstalkers fight 3 humans only one gets the strengh))

Purely for the balancing reasoning and to keep it more entertaining and as a sort of a chalange to those trying to fight it, but thats the best solution that would compromise the two approached tbh

I think that's a cool idea. Some shit where If they are alone but versus many, they become strongrt. Keep in mind it for any future re-write or if someone asks for your idea. I don't want to do much for necromancy. We'll see what St will say about this thing. If it gets accepted, for sure an ability like that could be added as long as they are BY themselves.

 

Maybe see how this goes first. If the amendment goes through. You can try to write a similar ability to counterbalance it.

 

I wanted to do this amdement for a while, by the way, it's not personal. I just found the energy.

 

What your idea reminds me of btw:

 

 

 

Spoiler

 

Just now, NightcastorKitty said:

Sounds more like a race issue instead of creature :p

 

 

It's why naztherak have 3 subtype  for their demons and each one of them is balanced differently. To avoid this kind of situation, where someone picks orc just for the strength. If necromancy itself had better subtypes, it would certainly be better. So, I won't backstory an orc and make them a evne more powerful darkstalker for the sake to be.