[✗] [MAGIC LORE] CANON ADHERENCE

[Seuss 1056]

-1 Xarkly never replied to DMs

[Wizry 1219]

hey man

"Per the strain of the Sun in maintaining the veil, and the lack of consciousness amidst the Seven Skies, it is nigh impossible for a mortal to draw upon its power in the form of magic. In the off-chance such were to occur, any boon received would never impart influence with the affinity of an Aengudaemon, though the blessings accrued may yet still affect the material. At best, the Skies would be capable of imparting these blessings under the most fantastic and strenuous of circumstances, and on very rare occasions."

 

I'm not trying to be a ****, or counter-intuitive, but your powersource doesn't make sense with the paragraph above. If you could explain why you think this works, feel free.

Also blend in some actual... downsides.

 

Malchediael, your soul is sacrificed to meld into him [pretty sure?].

Xan, you were to fight in an eternal war.

Azdromoth, you're doomed to be a scalie for eternity.

Aspects, you hear the song - you are growing more into the dangers of what happens being connected to the Song.

Without those, your soul is doomed to go to Ebritaes or the Seven Skies. Both will exhaust your soul in a sacrifice.

 

These connections have consequences. And reading these, there's no sense of consequence given to being connected to this magic. It's sorta a thing - a sacrifice for power.
 

In recommendation... Prevent them from going to the seven skies, or be completely exhausted to the point their shard is consumed by the veil. It's a consequence of connection.

 

 

Edited December 1, 2024 by Wizry

[Xarkly 17299]

11 minutes ago, Wizry said:

hey man

"Per the strain of the Sun in maintaining the veil, and the lack of consciousness amidst the Seven Skies, it is nigh impossible for a mortal to draw upon its power in the form of magic. In the off-chance such were to occur, any boon received would never impart influence with the affinity of an Aengudaemon, though the blessings accrued may yet still affect the material. At best, the Skies would be capable of imparting these blessings under the most fantastic and strenuous of circumstances, and on very rare occasions."

 

I'm not trying to be a ****, or counter-intuitive, but your powersource doesn't make sense with the paragraph above. If you could explain why you think this works, feel free.

 

This is a concern I initially shared, but after talking to ST admin he confirmed this isn't the case.

[Wizry 1219]

1 minute ago, Xarkly said:

This is a concern I initially shared, but after talking to ST admin he confirmed this isn't the case.

Oh cool! Thanks!

[Xarkly 17299]

38 minutes ago, Wizry said:

Also blend in some actual... downsides.

 

Malchediael, your soul is sacrificed to meld into him [pretty sure?].

Xan, you were to fight in an eternal war.

Azdromoth, you're doomed to be a scalie for eternity.

Aspects, you hear the song - you are growing more into the dangers of what happens being connected to the Song.

Without those, your soul is doomed to go to Ebritaes or the Seven Skies. Both will exhaust your soul in a sacrifice.

 

These connections have consequences. And reading these, there's no sense of consequence given to being connected to this magic. It's sorta a thing - a sacrifice for power.
 

In recommendation... Prevent them from going to the seven skies, or be completely exhausted to the point their shard is consumed by the veil. It's a consequence of connection.

 

Going back to this, I'm not really sure it's substantiated to say there's no downsides, or that there must be a connection downside. 

 

In terms of narrative, the entire magic is based on the premise of the original promise that Humans would ascend to the Seven Skies, so it doesn't make sense to depart into afterlife/soul-based downsides. Suggesting a requirement for a connection consequence here feels fairly arbitrary simply because other magics have it (when it makes sense for them). 

 

Character development and narrative weight comes from the individual character and their story, and mandating a connection consequence feels very out of place in that regard. 

 

Mechanically, there are plenty - i.e., Despair, Sacred Aurum, etc. 

[Wizry 1219]

6 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

In terms of narrative, the entire magic is based on the premise of the original promise that Humans would ascend to the Seven Skies, so it doesn't make sense to depart into afterlife/soul-based downsides. Suggesting a requirement for a connection consequence here feels fairly arbitrary simply because other magics have it (when it makes sense for them). 

The entire magic is based off a connection with the entity called the Seven Skies which is powering the veil. It's not arbitrary because the premise of the connection is something that powers the shield from the void - the Veil.

 

8 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

Going back to this, I'm not really sure it's substantiated to say there's no downsides, or that there must be a connection downside. 

All magics besides bardmancy, housemagery, and kani have a downside like this. You are connected, in some way, to something that is not just magic that you, yourself, can participate in. It's extremely substantiated when each connection holds downsides accordingly - whereas this is... nothing like Kani, Housemagery, and Bardmancy in substance. It's not magic that comes from the ambient world nor is it magic that 'comes from the self'.

 

It's magic that comes from a connection with the Seven Skies, and should be narratively treated as much.

 

9 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

Character development and narrative weight comes from the individual character and their story, and mandating a connection consequence feels very out of place in that regard. 

 

The story you have presented here is a magic that has no downsides [outside of mechanics] despite the MAs that it is trying to join having those downsides.

 

There is no reason to not use it, provisioning itself - frankly - little character development on the nature of the magic [and if it is indeed worth connecting with the seven skies] or narrative weight about what it means to be connected to a magic altogether.

It's genuinely jarring to read a piece that literally has no downsides to one's soul / afterlife when the MAs around it and the magics it will inevitably be competing with for attention will have those downsides.

[Xarkly 17299]

9 minutes ago, Wizry said:

The entire magic is based off a connection with the entity called the Seven Skies which is powering the veil. It's not arbitrary because the premise of the connection is something that powers the shield from the void - the Veil.

 

 

The reason I'm cautioning against arbitrariness is best summed up like this:

 

What role does this connection consequence play in your character?

 

For some of the magics you've mentioned, specifically deific ones, they obviously play an important role in terms of your character's relationship with your patron, which, in turn, is a cornerstone of that magic's culture and aesthetic.

 

Although technically deific, that logic doesn't really translate into Canon Adherence. There is a profound relationship with the Human afterlife here both in terms of the actual source of the magic, and the wider Human themes of collectivity, legacy, and history. So, looping back to the concern of arbitrariness, for me it arises in that the relationship between this magic and its collective patron is one that goes right to the heart of that magic.

 

Maybe a better way for us to get on the same page is for you to posit what role you think a connection consequence should play in a magic like this. 

 

I also think it's a little over the top to say it's extremely jarring there's no soul consequence here when this magic, one that is integrally involved in both the soul and human afterlife. The same is true for 'no reason not to take it' - in terms of minmaxxing, the magic is quite uncombative and offers very little edge compared to other magics. Secondly, the Envoy mechanic is a fairly reinforced RP & time requirement that prevents anyone from 'just taking it'. 

[JuliusAakerlund 2402]

6 minutes ago, Wizry said:

The entire magic is based off a connection with the entity called the Seven Skies which is powering the veil. It's not arbitrary because the premise of the connection is something that powers the shield from the void - the Veil.

 

All magics besides bardmancy, housemagery, and kani have a downside like this. You are connected, in some way, to something that is not just magic that you, yourself, can participate in. It's extremely substantiated when each connection holds downsides accordingly - whereas this is... nothing like Kani, Housemagery, and Bardmancy in substance. It's not magic that comes from the ambient world nor is it magic that 'comes from the self'.

 

It's magic that comes from a connection with the Seven Skies, and should be narratively treated as much.

 

 

The story you have presented here is a magic that has no downsides [outside of mechanics] despite the MAs that it is trying to join having those downsides.

 

There is no reason to not use it, provisioning itself - frankly - little character development on the nature of the magic [and if it is indeed worth connecting with the seven skies] or narrative weight about what it means to be connected to a magic altogether.

It's genuinely jarring to read a piece that literally has no downsides to one's soul / afterlife when the MAs around it and the magics it will inevitably be competing with for attention will have those downsides.

 

Hello, friendly neighborhood Julius here. I think our Envoy system already creates the dynamic you are looking for in large part as an Adherent that wants to have any significant combat utility will have to doom a soul directly to the state in which they get consumed by the sun. The people who will be envoys are likeliest to be other Adherents, given the nature of the magic. When it comes down to other characters, that is still a rather significant effect and feeds into the purpose of the Seven Skies and its more prominent place in the universe. This is also something more meaningful for RP purposes as the one sacrificing themselves can be your teacher, friend, sister, brother, parent or wtv. While being "forced" (most of the time, people go into the magic wanting to do this) to fight an endless war in the afterlife isn't usually directly impacting the average player's narrative.

 

I personally have no issue having an Adherent be doomed to the same effect. It isn't a big deal to me nor a deal breaker but right now it just doesn't seem to carry some greater purpose really? All souls in the Seven Skies are doomed to be fuel for the fire by default in the very lore you cite. Sure, some can hold onto their personality for a long time, maybe even for as long as humans exist, but it's a relative blip in time for the Gods. Not to mention I imagine the average human soul probably doesn't even fulfill the conditions needed for this.

[MysticalWeasel 911]

Reading through this, it is a lot better from last time. Though I am confused as the implemented lore for how heaven works denies this does it not? And this seems like a more extreme version of Clercism, so what will be the point of being a cleric when something like this can exist. I like things that have tangible entities that can be read upon to understand how it might influence a character. 

For instance anguel of Courage instills courage, but is also flawed in the fact he is literally insane and in a constant state of killing in the other realms. Or Xan, he presented order but to a point it removed freedom trying to become absolute order so in turn remove freewill as freewill brews anarchy. Taharie, wishes to cut all outer worldly influences upon the world and cares not how he accomplishes it obtaining purity by any means necessary. 

Creating a dynamic area that leaves it up to players to interact and understand to use a power is to have a downside some flaw that accompanies it. Templars have TOJ, Nephilim can be corrupted, Naztherak leave a permanent brand and have their soul slowly consumed, Necromancer perma taint their soul, Druids get closer to the song, Frostwitches can never return to normal, Mystics are forced to conjoin with souls fracturing their mind. 

I'd love to see a similar thing for this especially cause it is locked to one race, perhaps as an act of using the power of other souls they burn away fragments of their own over time as a direct result of pulling from the sun. Something like that, and or that during night time their powers are weakened such as how undead are weaker during the daytime. 

[Xarkly 17299]

21 minutes ago, MysticalWeasel said:

Reading through this, it is a lot better from last time. Though I am confused as the implemented lore for how heaven works denies this does it not? And this seems like a more extreme version of Clercism, so what will be the point of being a cleric when something like this can exist. I like things that have tangible entities that can be read upon to understand how it might influence a character. 

 

I mentioned this in my reply to Wizry earlier, but that was my initial interpretation of the new lore too - magic was impossible. But, in the course of talking with the ST admin, that doesn't appear to be the case and the position seems to be that magic is possible, but difficult/rare. In turn, ST also expressed the view this is sort of the norm for any magic and is a sort of boilerplate disclaimer. Admittedly, I'm still a bit confused by the wording approach, but I'll take the ST statement and run with it for now. 

 

This is intended as a type of cleric. It's actually meant to enhance and supplement 'religious' RP by helping promote fantasy cleric characters who aren't just darkspawn hunters or healers, and instead actually places a lot of focus on religious rites (marriage via Betrothal, death via Requiem and Sanctuary, etc.) alongside a lot of flavour aesthetic that draws on the Seven Skies and Human themes of history and legacy.

 

It's not written to be the 'only' cleric magic on the server and can easily coexist with others. 

 

21 minutes ago, MysticalWeasel said:

Templars have TOJ, Nephilim can be corrupted, Naztherak leave a permanent brand and have their soul slowly consumed, Necromancer perma taint their soul, Druids get closer to the song, Frostwitches can never return to normal, Mystics are forced to conjoin with souls fracturing their mind. 

 

If you mean a weakness in the mechanical sense, this magic's use of Despair probably covers this - in contrast with weaknesses like Voidal strength, this is a spiritual weakness that, in its severe stages, makes a character flee combat and are susceptible to intimidation/persuasion. If you mean more like what Wizry was talking about earlier in terms of a more narrative/connection consequence, I think it's important to bear in mind what these are trying to achieve/promote in a character in the context of a map. Going back to the example when I was replying to Wizry, the answer that I'm inclined to here is that these consequences form part of a character's relationship with the magic itself and their patron. Given Adherence is in a unique spot in terms of its patron being an unresponsive collective, I don't think that makes quite as much sense here. At the same time, though, that character/patron relationship isn't waylaid here, and the role of the Seven Skies is pretty present throughout. 

 

[Jihnyny 5233]

[winterblood 11181]

1 hour ago, Jihnyny said:

pov cleric lore posters

[Xarkly 17299]

12 hours ago, Toffee said:

 

 

My only concern is that I think this form of magic should be rare and only practiced by hardcore Canonists, not widespread and casual like housemagery. I'd want to see it only being used by people who know more than the surface level of Canonism, and it should be a rare, miraculous occasion to see it used that people can look on with awe. I think this will come down to the teaching of it by people who are grandfathered in, who I assume will teach the magic strongly interwoven with the religion and history anyway!!

 

 

Thanks Toffee - in terms of rarity, I think the Envoy system (which requires another Human to PK) enforces some of the rarity you're alluding to here. In theory, it would take a lot of time and investment for an Adherent to enlist the help of an Envoy, and obviously since the Envoy has to end up dying, there can be a good bit of significance attached to these events.

 

Based on this, I don't anticipate there'll be a lot of Greater Adherents running around.

[Xarkly 17299]

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

The redline concerning Klones is a bit odd - that implies this isn't a soul bound or knowledge based magic, but something physically practiced - it's the only way it makes sense to say that a Klone become incompatible upon reincarnating, especially given Envoy's are bound, presumably, to the Adherent's Soul. It would make more sense, to me to say that in the 1 OOC Week a Klone takes to adjust to a new body, a Adherent can't access Canon Adherence Magics.

 

 

The idea here is that the magic's entire culture is based on Humanity being promised the Seven Skies, as counterweight to Iblees' curse. As a result, changing your 'fate' and avoiding that promise (by reviving after death), feels wholly inconsistent. Likely we would have included some other revive mechanics here, but most of them are already covered by the fact that they will usually change your soul's afterlife destination, so Klones was a bit of an outlier in that regard.

 

In a nutshell, for a magic that's all about Humanity's promised afterlife, 'denying' that afterlife via Klone revival is fundamentally against that.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

The Voidal Magic is a bit trickly - obvious, large/two handed foci of Sacred Aurum would beyond what they could wield, but there is nothing [that I found so far] that says a mage could not make a small foci of Sacred Aurum and still benefit from being able to cast. More of a technical point as well but I think any Voidal Feat [Including Atronach Forging and Veilwatching] should be incompatible. Down with void feat + other magic minmaxing + 3 of them reasonably may interfere with the Soul or actually do.

 

 

Myself and Julius are discussing clarifying the redline around Voidal compatibility - but yes, you're probably right. The initial redline came from the idea that it could be cooler to have an indirect incompatibility, but the sheer volume of Voidal magics and their individual quirks presents some complexities. This will probably be amended later today.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

While this refers to some penalty to movement, I can't actually find one referred to here at all - is this a error of repasting from a prior WIP or just the movement penalty wasnt added. Further, it's a bit extreme to say being weakened at all prevents wielding of Sacred Aurum - Voidstalker Wither, Mystic Enervation, and probably other magical afflictions would be deadly against a Adherent with no real counter against it. 

 

 

Good spot - I can't believe I missed this. Added now.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

I can say personally I liked how the last WIP described it - something that couldnt be hidden. It made it unique, and made them more of a always-present magic instead of how most magics tend to be buried under something else if they are not ovetly evil like Necromancy and Mystics [Literal Dead people]

 

This is something we're going to add in with the changes later today.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

I do think Despair should scale with a Adherent's Tier - I.E a T1 can withstand much less then a T5 Adherent. Equally, for the ability to reduce Despair by 5 points I'd go through the effort to list out a few examples. The 25 Despair consequence is a bit extreme - a forced flee would be much more fun that a lore mandated get killed effect

 

 

As is, Despair is probably only a really a factor for higher-tier Adherents casting bigger Portents in close proximity to one another (and this is what Despair is mechanically intended to balance). I get what you mean and I'll discuss the idea with Julius when we sit down to review initial feedback later today - I'm a bit cautious about how we should approach increasing the severity of Despair for lower tiers (I'm assuming this is what you're essentially proposing) for the use of their mostly-aesthetic spells.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

This is probably the most unique and harshest magical progression I've seen. I would consider permitting one to progress to T5 normally, but locking some rites and combative spells, as well as the ability to make a TA, behind the Envoy process. 

 

 

Yes, the harshness is intentional for a few reasons. Mainly, it's an in-built way of enforcing rarity with the magic, significant character attachment/relationships , time investment, and anti-minmaxxing. I'll consider this with Julius, since he has a few proposals for tweaking the Envoy system anyway, but overall I do kind of want it to stay as it is to keep that in-built enforcement. I also think it adds a lot of significance to the magic in terms of your character's development.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

I'll put this here as a general note - for multi-adherent rites, you should specify how many rounds it takes, and then what emotes are required from each adherent. This format looks a bit weird, since it implies this entire process could take 2 rounds if each adherent does their charging and casting emotes together. Furthermore, it would be worth mentioning if Adherent magic works more akin to templar [connection is done each emote] or voidal [connection is 1 emote that persists until they disconnect, and must reconnect to cast further]

 

 

The assumption is that if it takes 3 Adherents 5 emotes, then that means five turns, but I suppose there's no much harm in clarifying as you suggest. Rituals are all non-combative; asides from Condemnation, I don't want to enforce too much mechanical red-tape over something mostly aesthetic.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

I don't see why it has to be rings, so long as the item holds significance to each person and is not combative in nature, like armor or weapons.

 

 

That part of the mechanics is actually meant to read "which need not be rings"; I'm just an idiot and didn't proofread. Thanks & fixed.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

Given the nature of this is to recount memories of someones life, it feels disingenuous to allow the death of the persona to be illustrated - that should adhere to the public knowledge/historical event requirement similar things carry.

 

 

I can agree only in the context if they're death is, for example, unknown to be a murder. Otherwise, though, in terms of paying tribute to a character as Mourning is intended, the omission of their death/how their story ends feels like a huge one.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

A little more care should be taken here, imo - while the confessor shouldnt be able to lie, a Adherent also shouldnt be to able to sift through someones memories to get whatever information they want. To me the entire process is meant to be abstract/overcoming focused, and shouldnt even permit any amount of variation of getting information beyond however the abstract representation of the trauma is presented.

 

 

An Adherent can't get to whatever information they want by virtue of the fact that redlines stipulate the memory must be a traumatic/mentally distressing one. This gives a confessor two tools to deny an Adherent from particular memories - (1) the Portent requires consent from the outset, and (2) the confessor can essentially choose what memories are visited. The Adherent can't leave a given memory to go explore another one, so I feel like this is adequate control for the confessor. 

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

To the redlines, I'd add it just cant just FA/MA/CAs. I'd also specify some examples of what Object and Character purification can and cannot cleanse.

 

 

We've added that it can't be used on MArts. I'm unsure if you have any other examples of objects it should be unable to cure.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

Altered Souls typically refer specifically to CAs [Djinn, Azdrazi, Wights, Inferi/Akals, Etc] which seems against the intent here (Bad Things have a Bad Time in the area of effect). It may be better to do Non-Humans, Altered or Tainted Souls, or any MA/FA/CA that is outright incompatible, or some variation of these with Adherence in general for the discomfort part. The Heist rule is Good, but I'd worry about Moderations willingly to work around ST/Lore, and the opposite - far as I know, they'll never cooperate in something like this, so a redline stating a mod mechanic is required to destroy a ST structure may just never happen.

 

 

It's specifically intended to work against all forms of altered souls.

 

One of the big themes of Canon Adherence is purity of soul, and so any blemish on that soul can be seen as an offense against the magic and its energy. I also don't want to draw lines of what is/isn't a "dark creature" purely on the basis of what is technically a Dark Magic, since, obviously, cultural interpretations of what is a darkspawn are a lot more nuanced (Azdrazi being a prime example).

 

As far as Heist destruction, I'm not sure I agree. I've participated & overseen multiple Heists in which ST artefacts have been destroyed. I'm not sure why this wouldn't work.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

When you refer to "Solid Walls", does that include magically conjured [Voidal Ice/Earth, Naztherak Solid Wall, etc etc] walls, or SPECIFICALLY mundane walls? 

 

 

Any kind of barrier can offset the Portent's effects. We can clarify the redline when we're making changes later.

 

12 hours ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

Overall not much I don't really understand when I sit down and read through it. I have my reservations about a human focused magic, given humanity is near-dominated by a singular religion and set of players, but that will always come down to player-interpretation and culture surrounding the magic. Glad to see Adherence is out of the WIP Stage

 

While I wouldn't at all agree that Humanity is controlled by the same set of players, I can understand the perspective. The idea here is to bring more magical flavour to these Human communities and help end the years-old standoff between Humanity and the ST, who have largely followed different lore, tempos, and canons.

 

Thanks a lot for your feedback and engagement not only here, but on the 2 WIP drafts. I know writing comprehensive feedback can be tiring work, but it's genuinely very much appreciated.

[PrimnyaQuorum 4003]

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

The idea here is that the magic's entire culture is based on Humanity being promised the Seven Skies, as counterweight to Iblees' curse. As a result, changing your 'fate' and avoiding that promise (by reviving after death), feels wholly inconsistent. Likely we would have included some other revive mechanics here, but most of them are already covered by the fact that they will usually change your soul's afterlife destination, so Klones was a bit of an outlier in that regard.

 

In a nutshell, for a magic that's all about Humanity's promised afterlife, 'denying' that afterlife via Klone revival is fundamentally against that.

 

In this case, the question becomes how this magic is somehow detecting who is a klone and who is not? Palmreaders sets something of a precedent but I don't think it gives a how which is key here, considering no other magic or lore allows one to determine who is or isnt a Klone beyond tangibly finding their vessel or being told.

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

As is, Despair is probably only a really a factor for higher-tier Adherents casting bigger Portents in close proximity to one another (and this is what Despair is mechanically intended to balance). I get what you mean and I'll discuss the idea with Julius when we sit down to review initial feedback later today - I'm a bit cautious about how we should approach increasing the severity of Despair for lower tiers (I'm assuming this is what you're essentially proposing) for the use of their mostly-aesthetic spells.

It would probably be easier to include OOC limits for non-combative rites [X rite can only be performed So many times in Y period] then have them incur despair - Naz I think gets around this pretty well by having a combative resource [Maleus] and a Ritual one [Rakir], but a OOC cooldown would probably suffice. It does also reward a Adherent for taking the time to get a envoy and dedicate the slots - able to accrue more despair points

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

Yes, the harshness is intentional for a few reasons. Mainly, it's an in-built way of enforcing rarity with the magic, significant character attachment/relationships , time investment, and anti-minmaxxing. I'll consider this with Julius, since he has a few proposals for tweaking the Envoy system anyway, but overall I do kind of want it to stay as it is to keep that in-built enforcement. I also think it adds a lot of significance to the magic in terms of your character's development.

 

I think its good that its a PK system, it just needs more cautious redlines and mechanics to prevent someone from making john bandits son, john bandit 5, getting him envoyed, and then seeing him die tragically and PK in a 1v50 banditry attempt on some monarch just to cheese the system.

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

 

I can agree only in the context if they're death is, for example, unknown to be a murder. Otherwise, though, in terms of paying tribute to a character as Mourning is intended, the omission of their death/how their story ends feels like a huge one.

 

I suppose a more simple way to consider it is if the death was player-caused and is not solved/historical knowledge it wont be revealed, and include giant battles/warclaims/events - it just seems too risky to me to allow people to see the events of their death play out if another player had a hand in it, moreso considering dead CAs cannot even describe the events of their death and detail who else was involved

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

We've added that it can't be used on MArts. I'm unsure if you have any other examples of objects it should be unable to cure.

 

More just specifying it cant heal any MA/FA/CA [Such as Naz/Necromancy/Voidal Connections] - MArts and CArts, imo, should require ST oversight and approval beforehand instead of a flat "cannot do".

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

It's specifically intended to work against all forms of altered souls.

 

One of the big themes of Canon Adherence is purity of soul, and so any blemish on that soul can be seen as an offense against the magic and its energy. I also don't want to draw lines of what is/isn't a "dark creature" purely on the basis of what is technically a Dark Magic, since, obviously, cultural interpretations of what is a darkspawn are a lot more nuanced (Azdrazi being a prime example).

 

As far as Heist destruction, I'm not sure I agree. I've participated & overseen multiple Heists in which ST artefacts have been destroyed. I'm not sure why this wouldn't work.

 

Seems our experience differs - I had to get RO permission to do what in essence could've been a heist because ST refused to work with mods and vice versa [Endless loop of "go get ST approval" to "Go get mod approval" to "Im not doing this, find someone else" And on and on without a actual rule anyone would point at to approve/deny

 

Altered and Tainted souls in general seem to fit the idea you have - Altered Souls are just the most extreme effect a Soul can sustain. A Scion in what you described would feel the same itch as a Azdrazi, given their soul is "blemished" to varying degrees [Lagging behind vs Draconic]. Should cover the bases for not just targeting "Darkspawn"

 

40 minutes ago, Xarkly said:

While I wouldn't at all agree that Humanity is controlled by the same set of players, I can understand the perspective. The idea here is to bring more magical flavour to these Human communities and help end the years-old standoff between Humanity and the ST, who have largely followed different lore, tempos, and canons.

 

Thanks a lot for your feedback and engagement not only here, but on the 2 WIP drafts. I know writing comprehensive feedback can be tiring work, but it's genuinely very much appreciated.

 

I can't really say after everything that it's a unjustified stance to not want to work with humanity - of the two most open eventlines I can recall [The Shuul War and the Desert Stuff of recent] Barely any humans choose to show up, even the hyspians who are in the desert, compared to elfs/dwarves/orcs coming out of the sands for loot and PK clause events.

 

Obviously this magic isn't a reward or "canonist" magic, and i think you've done a excellent job of preserving the availability to insert any magic while being human-focused - but my concern will always be how it can be abused/gatekept unduly by those who are more content to sit in their OOC cliques and cycle power/NL/positions that seems very prevalent across a multitude of nations and MAs/CAs. 

 

I do think, in some way, its very ironic Veilwatchers have a stronger connection to the Skies then most others [besides humans] would have a chance to considering the whole Veil -> Sun/Skies thing

 

Happy to help as always, its always fun to look over neat lore.