Hmph

[Lym 849]

This has gotten to a point where misinformation seems to have spread way too much and having a discussion on this topic seems beyond pointless to me at least.

 

Aiim's ban appeal was properly addressed. This entire issues regarding cyberbullying and what not has been addressed, too. Even the Skype rule set has been addressed and is being reworked as we speak by the GM team. Another informational news post regarding this problem will most-likely be available within the next 24 hours.

[Quavinir_Twiceborn 1050]

This has gotten to a point where misinformation seems to have spread way too much and having a discussion on this topic seems beyond pointless to me at least.

 

Aiim's ban appeal was properly addressed. This entire issues regarding cyberbullying and what not has been addressed, too. Even the Skype rule set has been addressed and is being reworked as we speak by the GM team. Another informational news post regarding this problem will most-likely be available within the next 24 hours.

 

And Lym saves the day yet again.

[Lago 2572]

So let me get this straight, an adult is allowed to cyber with a minor over Skype, but if a player calls a perms banned player a gender bender they get a 4 month ban? Logic.

Is this "Lord of the Craft" or "Lord of the Double-Standard"? Because I feel like it is unreasonable that Vardak was banned at the time AiiM made comments to him, does this mean that if I see Pugsy on another server or Divinus that if I insult them I am subject to a 4 month ban?

This is a good point. A very good point.

In my view, the way the server's disciplinary system operates is to try to do what is right rather than what is fair. Whether or not that's the correct way to do things is up for debate. Thing is, one is subjective and the other objective, and consequently while the disciplinary system continues to operate as it does (I won't go as far as to say making it up as you go along but that's the gist of it) disputes are wholly inevitable. However, I am of one mind with the staff on one thing: trollstorms do not aid anything, and I hope our community will rise above them.

EDIT: That, and it isn't even consistent. Anyone remember JuicyRhino? He wasn't unbanned due to precedent. Now precedent doesn't hold any weight. While I respect the attempts to do what is seen as morally correct, its very understandable that the community becomes divided by the subjectivity inherent in the current way of handling bans.

[Austin 697]

I just feel they are setting an example to everyone by banning AiiM which isn't fair and greatly effects multiple groups roleplay, but I mean, did AiiM even get a verbal warning over his trollery or anything? Or just flat out banned for name calling?, please remember the context this was in:

- AiiM was under the impression that TheForeverRuler (Vardak) was a female IRL.

- After several weeks of RPing with TheForeverRuler AiiM discovered he was a male after being told TheForeverRuler was female. Wouldn't you be a little angry also? You know someone who you developed a friendship with to discover that this person was lieing to you the entire time?

 

 

I mean this ban seems just plain stupid and a poor descision by the administrative team, however of course the admins know best right? So they get to vote. Y'know the admins that barely ever interact with the community due to them "Doing work behind the scenes." These votes should consist of EVERYONE on the GM/ADMIN team not just the admins. It is incredibly stupid for the admins to make decisions on this **** if they don't even know it. When was the last time you spoke to an admin about anything? Mine was back when Mogroka was still admin. So what? 6 months ago?

[Finnadian 25]

I just thought this would be good to emphasis anti-bullying

[monkeypoacher 8055]

aaaauuungh.

All I can say, is,

I feel you. I feel you all.

 

I pretty much up and quit after an OOC dispute, because I don't deal with harassment or "cyber bullying" (That term was conjured up by teachers and moms and alarmist media stations so I hate it).

I've dealt with a lot of stupid disputes before I joined LoTC, and I don't want to see this happening here. Thanks for filtering it and not just saying, "It's the internet, deal with it."

[ChonGojDragonski 317]

Alright, seriously? I've read this entire thread and I find it a load of absolute crap. From what I've read on this thread, it seems someone was banned for being a Troll and "Cyber-bullying" even though, from the logs that have been shown, it looks like nothing of the sort; not to mention this was on Skype...on Skype for fracks sakes. I think that's a load of crap. No one should be banned for being a "troll" unless it directly affects RP for no good reason. If you don't like how people RP, don't RP with them! If someone is spamming you over Skype, well, you see. On my Skype account, there is this little button, I like to call him IGNORE. You can ignore someone's Skype Account very easily...I mean seriously, I have no idea why this is even an issue. Now, if it was on the server or via the forums, that's different, but over a platform that is not even related to LotC?  If I have an OOC dispute with a player on LotC that has nothing to do with this server specifically, why not let me/him handle it? I dislike this constant baby-sitting. Despite what some people believe, most of us are capable of acting with a moducom of self control. If their is a problem, one would think that we could talk it out like normal human beings. If not? Just ignore them. If the problem persists on the forums/server, THAN you can speak to a GM or Admin. I would also like to adress the people who make ban requests on others behalf. Don't do it. Even if you are personally asked by that specific person. If someone is uncomfortable with publically calling out someone who has been an OOC problem to them, consistently harrasing and insulting them, than it isn't much of a problem now is it? And if you report someone for something they said to another person without so much as a word to the people invovled, then that is just pitiful. Let people handle their own problems. Why the hell are you going out of your way to ruin someones ****. Some people are just so freaking sensitive. I don't think people understand the difference between a dispute, and a personal problem that someone might or might not have with you. Some people just need to realise, it's the internet, freaking deal with it. You're not going to agree with everyone, you might even flat out dislike people and/or their actions; but don't let it get in the way of your OOC judgements. Now, as for the event at hand, I think banning this Aiim person or whoever he is was wrong. While I detest trolling and people who can't act serious for more than 10 minutes, based on the evidence that has been shown, it seems that this guy was unwrongfully banned. I'm not saying this from a moral standpoint, I think morality is stupid and any desicions based on it are most often wrong, I'm simply saying this from a logical stand point. This V guy, or whatever the hell his name was, could have ignored, or de-friended, or done whatever to this Aiim kid. The fact is, he didn't. That is his fault, and only his. Not to mention, the evidence that has been shown to us so far has been far from "Cyber-bullying." It hasn't even been insulting. At the most it was light trolling. Hell, if we chose to look at it from a moral standpoint, this guy was insulting a complete jack-ass who tried to get nudes from an underage, probably insecure(I mean what chick would be playing Minecraft if they didn't have some problem right?), young girl. And if I happen to be completely wrong, and this Aiim guy turns out to be a literal jack-ass who's constantly harrased this V guy, (even though if it was on Skype it shouldn't really matter) that wouldn't be on me. It would be on the Admins and GMs for not releasing more information. The community is making a desicion based on what they've seen. You can't blame them for that, or even justify getting mad at the community about banning him, even if he completely deserved it. This is where transparency comes into play. The GMs or Admins shouldn't have to hide anything from the community; and I will admantly hold that desicion.

 

P.S: The chick thing was a joke. I wasn't going to add this but with the likely hood of a female player(feminazi) taking it the wrong way was just to damn high.

 

P.P.S: I was going to have another Post Script, adressing something controversial I said in my tangent, but I forgot what it was. So if you see anything besides the female Minecrafter joke, that's probably it.

[Nefarious Aus Shitpost 891]

I just feel they are setting an example to everyone by banning AiiM which isn't fair and greatly effects multiple groups roleplay, but I mean, did AiiM even get a verbal warning over his trollery or anything? Or just flat out banned for name calling?, please remember the context this was in:

- AiiM was under the impression that TheForeverRuler (Vardak) was a female IRL.

- After several weeks of RPing with TheForeverRuler AiiM discovered he was a male after being told TheForeverRuler was female. Wouldn't you be a little angry also? You know someone who you developed a friendship with to discover that this person was lieing to you the entire time?

 

 

I mean this ban seems just plain stupid and a poor descision by the administrative team, however of course the admins know best right? So they get to vote. Y'know the admins that barely ever interact with the community due to them "Doing work behind the scenes." These votes should consist of EVERYONE on the GM/ADMIN team not just the admins. It is incredibly stupid for the admins to make decisions on this **** if they don't even know it. When was the last time you spoke to an admin about anything? Mine was back when Mogroka was still admin. So what? 6 months ago?

 

Personally I can see where AiiM's anger was stemming from. Genderbending and cybering in my opinion are the two dirtiest things one can do on the internet.

[ChonGojDragonski 317]

Personally I can see where AiiM's anger was stemming from. Genderbending and cybering in my opinion are the two dirtiest things one can do on the internet.

Wait up, just a quick question. Can I get an exact defenition on Genderbending? Does this mean OOC pretending you're a certain Gender opposite of what you really are, or RPing another Gender IC? Because, anyone should be able to RP whatever Gender they want IC. Their is no logical reason why not if that is the case. What, is it wrong that some people want to RP another Gender? Unless their is RP that is sexually explicate(though I really don't know what the fuss about ERP is, some Americans are just such prudes) or completely illogical/stupid/breaking the rules, it should be allowed.

[Danny 2232]

The entire purpose of this thread was to move on from discussion of the ban, and actually go back to doing what we're all here for. Clearly, thar hasn't worked. I'll emphasise again: head off and roleplay. I will, however, reply to the posts that caught my eye whilst reading through.

I just feel they are setting an example to everyone by banning AiiM which isn't fair and greatly effects multiple groups roleplay, but I mean, did AiiM even get a verbal warning over his trollery or anything? Or just flat out banned for name calling?, please remember the context this was in:

- AiiM was under the impression that TheForeverRuler (Vardak) was a female IRL.

- After several weeks of RPing with TheForeverRuler AiiM discovered he was a male after being told TheForeverRuler was female. Wouldn't you be a little angry also? You know someone who you developed a friendship with to discover that this person was lieing to you the entire time?

 

 

I mean this ban seems just plain stupid and a poor descision by the administrative team, however of course the admins know best right? So they get to vote. Y'know the admins that barely ever interact with the community due to them "Doing work behind the scenes." These votes should consist of EVERYONE on the GM/ADMIN team not just the admins. It is incredibly stupid for the admins to make decisions on this **** if they don't even know it. When was the last time you spoke to an admin about anything? Mine was back when Mogroka was still admin. So what? 6 months ago?

I'll say again, look at the appeal - Alan's reply - he wasn't banned solely for the Skype event.

Onto the admin point, I can't help but wonder if that's actually an issue of your own: we don't go out speaking to individual people just out of the blue, no staff member does that. If you come to us, we speak to you. If you're in OOC, we speak to you. If you're in TS with us, we'll speak to you. People speak to the admin team on a daily basis: in-game, on Skype, on TeamSpeak and on the forums. Simply go and have a look if you don't seem to think that as true. Sure, not ever admin is entirely active on the forums specifically, but they still do post.

Indeed, admin activity has increased over the past while - and that's not solely my opinion - it was acknowledged in GM chat earlier. Despite what some people like to think, we aren't 'hiding away' - we're available if you want us at almost any time, but we can't just magically assume that there's an issue and appear unless someone speaks to us about it - same as the GMs.

We reply to threads, we speak to players who come to us on a daily basis. The only votes that really are admin-domain are unbanning and the occasional decision that for some reason was decided to not be GM done. The GM team vote on the vast majority of decisions that we takes, as it's been for a very long time.

Wait up, just a quick question. Can I get an exact defenition on Genderbending? Does this mean OOC pretending you're a certain Gender opposite of what you really are, or RPing another Gender IC? Because, anyone should be able to RP whatever Gender they want IC. Their is no logical reason why not if that is the case. What, is it wrong that some people want to RP another Gender? Unless their is RP that is sexually explicate(though I really don't know what the fuss about ERP is, some Americans are just such prudes) or completely illogical/stupid/breaking the rules, it should be allowed.

The reason we totally outlaw ERP altogether is the legal implications it can bring if there are minors involved. I wouldn't say that we have any actual objection it it - although, I for one wouldn't engage in it - but, that's the simple reason. We don't want it done on our servers, because if it is, and a minor is involved, we are liable for it.

Alright, seriously? I've read this entire thread and I find it a load of absolute crap. From what I've read on this thread, it seems someone was banned for being a Troll and "Cyber-bullying" even though, from the logs that have been shown, it looks like nothing of the sort; not to mention this was on Skype...on Skype for fracks sakes. I think that's a load of crap. No one should be banned for being a "troll" unless it directly affects RP for no good reason. If you don't like how people RP, don't RP with them! If someone is spamming you over Skype, well, you see. On my Skype account, there is this little button, I like to call him IGNORE. You can ignore someone's Skype Account very easily...I mean seriously, I have no idea why this is even an issue. Now, if it was on the server or via the forums, that's different, but over a platform that is not even related to LotC? If I have an OOC dispute with a player on LotC that has nothing to do with this server specifically, why not let me/him handle it? I dislike this constant baby-sitting. Despite what some people believe, most of us are capable of acting with a moducom of self control. If their is a problem, one would think that we could talk it out like normal human beings. If not? Just ignore them. If the problem persists on the forums/server, THAN you can speak to a GM or Admin. I would also like to adress the people who make ban requests on others behalf. Don't do it. Even if you are personally asked by that specific person. If someone is uncomfortable with publically calling out someone who has been an OOC problem to them, consistently harrasing and insulting them, than it isn't much of a problem now is it? And if you report someone for something they said to another person without so much as a word to the people invovled, then that is just pitiful. Let people handle their own problems. Why the hell are you going out of your way to ruin someones ****. Some people are just so freaking sensitive. I don't think people understand the difference between a dispute, and a personal problem that someone might or might not have with you. Some people just need to realise, it's the internet, freaking deal with it. You're not going to agree with everyone, you might even flat out dislike people and/or their actions; but don't let it get in the way of your OOC judgements. Now, as for the event at hand, I think banning this Aiim person or whoever he is was wrong. While I detest trolling and people who can't act serious for more than 10 minutes, based on the evidence that has been shown, it seems that this guy was unwrongfully banned. I'm not saying this from a moral standpoint, I think morality is stupid and any desicions based on it are most often wrong, I'm simply saying this from a logical stand point. This V guy, or whatever the hell his name was, could have ignored, or de-friended, or done whatever to this Aiim kid. The fact is, he didn't. That is his fault, and only his. Not to mention, the evidence that has been shown to us so far has been far from "Cyber-bullying." It hasn't even been insulting. At the most it was light trolling. Hell, if we chose to look at it from a moral standpoint, this guy was insulting a complete jack-ass who tried to get nudes from an underage, probably insecure(I mean what chick would be playing Minecraft if they didn't have some problem right?), young girl. And if I happen to be completely wrong, and this Aiim guy turns out to be a literal jack-ass who's constantly harrased this V guy, (even though if it was on Skype it shouldn't really matter) that wouldn't be on me. It would be on the Admins and GMs for not releasing more information. The community is making a desicion based on what they've seen. You can't blame them for that, or even justify getting mad at the community about banning him, even if he completely deserved it. This is where transparency comes into play. The GMs or Admins shouldn't have to hide anything from the community; and I will admantly hold that desicion.

P.S: The chick thing was a joke. I wasn't going to add this but with the likely hood of a female player(feminazi) taking it the wrong way was just to damn high.

P.P.S: I was going to have another Post Script, adressing something controversial I said in my tangent, but I forgot what it was. So if you see anything besides the female Minecrafter joke, that's probably it.

That's not the full story: he was banned for other things also. As with other bans, however, we don't publicly post evidence and details for the world to see. If the user requests the server ban, we'll oblige and give it to them, but we aren't going to make an exception and give out one because other people are asking for it.

And like that, it's 2am. Need to be up at 7ish. Night, I'll check back in the morn.

[Demotheus 651]

I read quite a few posts about this Vardak guy doing something ACTUALLY illegal and getting a slap on the wrist.

 

Why has this not been addressed by the staff in this thread? Or did I miss it?

[Draeris 3124]

My deepest respect and compassion to the staff in the spotlight right now.. getting almost a whole server basicly holding a anti campaign against them.

 

Hat off to them, you have my honor.

 

[Raktar 140]

Thanks, Dan-Man

[Imperial Legion Soldier 34]

-snip-

Yeah... not a funny joke about the female crafters, seriously. Anyway, gah....wall of text. For the love of all that is written, please break it up into paragraphs or something so it is easier to read.

 

Personally I can see where AiiM's anger was stemming from. Genderbending and cybering in my opinion are the two dirtiest things one can do on the internet.

 

Though I disagree at least you said it was your opinion... and btw, 4Chan has much worse stuff then either of those. xD

 

Wait up, just a quick question. Can I get an exact defenition on Genderbending? Does this mean OOC pretending you're a certain Gender opposite of what you really are, or RPing another Gender IC? Because, anyone should be able to RP whatever Gender they want IC. Their is no logical reason why not if that is the case. What, is it wrong that some people want to RP another Gender? Unless their is RP that is sexually explicate(though I really don't know what the fuss about ERP is, some Americans are just such prudes) or completely illogical/stupid/breaking the rules, it should be allowed.

Gender bender is an informal term used to refer to a person who actively transgresses, or "bends," expected gender roles. Gender bending is sometimes a form of social activism undertaken in response to assumptions or over-generalisations about genders. Some gender benders identify with the gender assigned them at birth, but challenge the norms of that gender through androgynous behavior and atypical gender roles. Gender benders may self-identify as transgender or genderqueer, feeling that the gender assigned to them at their birth is an inaccurate or incomplete description of themselves; some are transsexual and desire to change their physical sex through hormone therapy or sex reassignment surgery. Gender Bender is also the slang term for connecting either two female connectors or two male connectors by the use of an adapter in the communications field. -Wikipedia

 

I grabbed that from wikipedia, hopefully it is the correct definition so anyone who was wondering can now know. (Since I bet more people then just him and I did not know what it meant.)

 

 

 

Alright, so can everyone relax and take a deep breath? We probably want to avoid this getting too heated and it feels like it's getting closer and closer to arguing your points rather then simply calmly stating what you think and/or feel about this.

[The Templar 195]

I'm sorry, but I keep reading that a Paedophile was allowed back onto the server while a very visible troll was banned for four months. You speak of fighting out against harassment in any medium, but all I see is a biased decision.