Regarding high elves.

[Dyn 149]

Half High-Elves are not the issue being addressed; the issue is people who make characters who's most defining aspect is "Impure High Elf". High Elves having children with other races, or with a culture different than Haelun'or's is meant to be rare.

The issue we have is when players make a new character, and be an impure High Elf who's reasoning is only "He wasn't raised normally.". This should only, in my opinion, be the case if you're playing a character who's parents are actually played IG and fit said criteria, because, based on scaled population estimates, there shouldn't be enough impure High Elves running around to make all these unorthodox characters.

That is what I am trying to say. What if two high elven people (both actual IG) choose to have a kid and raise them in their way. You can't say the new high elf is bad or at wrong for playing the way he/she is then.

[Lynesse {Celia/Jazzy} 398]

That is what I am trying to say. What if two high elven people (both actual IG) choose to have a kid and raise them in their way. You can't say the new high elf is bad or at wrong for playing the way he/she is then.

As stated before, since the very first high elves the parents have brainwashed their children into this way of thinking. Then these children would grow up and have their own kids, teaching them the same things. General high elven propaganda is very evident in our culture. I'm not that worried about half-breeds as I'm worried about general newer players who start up impure high elves to "be unique."

Compared to other societies that have lore like this [Orcs, Kha, Halflings] we seem to have more people who seem to be taking a more unorthodox route.

[Aerinyes 402]

I want to say something here I probably should have when this topic first popped up but haven't gotten around to it.

There is effectively two cultures of High Elves in Lord of the Craft. You have the more fundamentalist one in Haelun'or and the other not so much fundamentalist one in Malinor.

The majority of High Elves do NOT dwell in either of the two nations. And Malinor is NOT a Wood Elven nation but rather a mix of all three subraces of elves.

With that said, a High Elf can correctly be played in either culture.

What is the difference? Its not very much, but it is still very important. In Malinor High Elves are still a bit stuck up and snobbish, but are more accepting of their kin. This started in Aegis and carried over to Asulon. Many High Elves in Haelun'or started off in Malinor (unless they are less then 50ish years old).

This isn't to say that High Elves in Malinor are against the ways of their siblings in Haelun'or. Many respect their wishes. In fact it is considered bad form by those in high positions of Malinor to show any sort of disrespect to the culture of Haelun'or (though sometimes we disagree with them politically, which is another thing entirely).

Those making new High Elves should take care to note which culture their character is going to favor (those under 60 years old will be directly influenced by the culture they grow up in, where as older elves will be able to chose which to live with). If they are going to be open with others and be in non-compliance with Haelun'or traditions, they should not expect good responses in Haelun'or.

[Lynesse {Celia/Jazzy} 398]

Aerinyes, we have little to nothing against the high elves in Malinor.

The only ones that really bug us are the characters that are like "I'm a high elf and I absolutely hate my kin!" because most of those characters are formed on paper, not through roleplay. The amount of these types of characters is surprisingly high.

[Dyn 149]

As stated before, since the very first high elves the parents have brainwashed their children into this way of thinking. Then these children would grow up and have their own kids, teaching them the same things. General high elven propaganda is very evident in our culture. I'm not that worried about half-breeds as I'm worried about general newer players who start up impure high elves to "be unique."

Compared to other societies that have lore like this [Orcs, Kha, Halflings] we seem to have more people who seem to be taking a more unorthodox route.

"That is what I am trying to say. What if two high elven people (both actual IG) choose to have a kid and raise them in their way"

Again, what if the parents WERE NOT from Haelun'or and raised a child their way without ANY of this "brainwashing"?

[Suika 111]

"That is what I am trying to say. What if two high elven people (both actual IG) choose to have a kid and raise them in their way"

Again, what if the parents WERE NOT from Haelun'or and raised a child their way without ANY of this "brainwashing"?

Then we kill them, they are just killed, no more impure. Kidding.

Why would a High elf that hates his kin marry another High elf that hates her kin? The reason for being impure in the first place is that they wanted to mix with the other races.

Also, brainwashing is more powerful than one would think.

[VonAulus 2082]

I no longer play on my high elf but I have insight. I made my character a pure high elf because it was unique at the time. It seems having a pure high elf in still a rare thing because everyone wants to be a unique person and create their own thing. Has anyone ever tried just to fit in? Most people in society just fit in but have unique characteristics. Sure, us high elves are snobby xenophobic racists but it is FUN. Just putting some random characters self esteem down is fun ,why not come try it.

Orcs have this problem. Everyone wants to be a whitewash orc. Why? So they can be different. Well, you are actually not different anymore because everyone is a whitewash orc. There are not enough regular orcs to hunt you down and kill you till you perma kill your character. I know people will rp how they want but most rp'ers on this server do not want to just follow the flow of the river. No one just hops in a canoe and goes along for the ride. Sure my orc was the color of sand, but that gave me a defining characteristic, not go against all lore and previous rp just because I CAN.

I recently made a human character and made him a priest. He has been elevated to Archbishop and I cam quite proud of his achievements. He is not a warrior(What a novel idea) and is not evil(first time for everything). But, he is actually religious so to speak. This is somewhat unique as in everyone is an atheist or think they have rights. Women who rp characters are the worst. I am not going to say no offence because you are really bad. EVERY one of you women is a feminist and think you have rights in a male dominant society of feudalism. Back in those times men could beat you tell you what to do. Now it seems you put modern views into your character that does not exist in this time period we are playing in. All I do IC is tell women to cover up because they are scantily clad. Being a man of stout faith, this is not acceptable behavior for a lady. I get OOC and IC hate because of this. I can deal with IC but if I rp my character CORRECTLY I should not be getting hate. I told a lady to cover up today and another lady rushed to defend her.

Wow, I got sidetracked, but this problem is not just for High Elves, it is for all races as every single person wants the be a unique character. Just to let most of you know, you all look the same to me.

[MrSyth 636]

-snip-

As much as I agree with you, I do have some things to say about this. First of all, women who RP aren't terrible. Not all women are terrible RP'ers. I think you 'll find that most female characters on the server are played by men like you and me. And the female characters themselves aren't always feminine and defending, that's nonsense. Have you ever been to Alras? I've met over 10 female characters that were shy, listened and didn't fight sexism. And believe me, Alras is not that crouded.

On further note, the impure High Elf mass is becoming a serious problem. I believe we have reached a point where we can call impure High Elves a subrace of it's own, apart from the pure High Elves. Just like with the Kharajyr, I believe all High Elven characters should from now on be pure from application on down, unless discussed with an ingame background.

-MrSythaerin~

[Aelu / Rel (Combustionary) 1540]

"That is what I am trying to say. What if two high elven people (both actual IG) choose to have a kid and raise them in their way"

Again, what if the parents WERE NOT from Haelun'or and raised a child their way without ANY of this "brainwashing"?

If the events happened In-Game that caused the child not to be brainwashed; that's not an issue.

The issue is people who make characters "Out of thin air" so to speak, where the parents are your typical "Killed by orcs" parents in applications. The issue is Impures with no IC reason, not impures with a legitimate IC reason.

[Dyn 149]

Then we kill them, they are just killed, no more impure. Kidding.

Why would a High elf that hates his kin marry another High elf that hates her kin? The reason for being impure in the first place is that they wanted to mix with the other races.

Also, brainwashing is more powerful than one would think.

Maybe the thing that the high elf hated about his/her kin was the racism and then chose the other high elf as his/her marriage partner because they share the same views. Same as a high elf (Haelun) would choose their marriage partners under the impression that they are pure and such.

[MrSyth 636]

Maybe the thing that the high elf hated about his/her kin was the racism and then chose the other high elf as his/her marriage partner because they share the same views. Same as a high elf (Haelun) would choose their marriage partners under the impression that they are pure and such.

High Elves (Mali'Aheral, not Haelun) do not hate racism. One cannot hate something that is encrypted into their minds since they were a child. It's just not possible. With that, two of these impure non-brainwashed High Elves meeting eachother would be a very rare event, and should be RP'ed ingame. Not just in some application.

[Mithradites 1168]

Oh goodness! How did I ever miss this thread? Opinion time, from a veteran "lore-correct" high elf!

"Lore correct" high elves are something extremely difficult to play. The combination of arrogance, intelligence, emotionlessness, supremacist views, and a philosophical nature is fairly tough to get down perfectly (unless you are Dio Astore. In that case you are a perfect High Elf who all should model themselves on). There are a few things that people who play renogade high elves need to understand about their subrace's nature.

1. Pure High Elves are not Born by Accident

A pure High Elf takes pride in their racial purity, and can track their anscestors back for dozens of generations. It helps them keep track of their family's various impurities. It is likely that in many "pure" high elven lines there is a wood elf or a dark elf in their family. This is something a mali'aheral would never be proud of, or speak about. Sometimes, they are even removed from the family records in an attempt to keep records blemish-free.

High Elves who breed with non-high elves would not consider the act a "small thing" or "harmless". Such actions are deeply shameful, and would be interpreted as a betrayal of generations of their anscestors.

High Elves who are born as orphans (their family being killed in some way and they were brought up differently)

need to remember high elves are naturally arrogant. This arrogance can carry over into several things, such as their work-ethic, their career choice, and their treatment of others. You won't find a completely "nice" high elf. They can be relatively pleasant to many, but not always.

2. High Elves are Usually Educated by other High Elves

"What? Send my son to your school? The child's existance is a miracle in itself! I'm not having you poison him with your ham-fisted teaching! I shall educate him myself!"

Remember how I said a High Elf's arrogance will carry over to other things? It is very common for high elves to educate their own children. Even in Haelun'or itself! The parents ideas will be passed to their children at very susceptible ages, and ingrained in their minds.

3. High Elves are not Humans

Something people don't seem to get is that an elf has a completely different mindset to that of human. Their thinking, especially for the older elves, is contemplative and detailed, rather than the "rash" thought of humans. Any elf over one hundred years, especially high elves, would see humans as "tiresome" or "childish". Being with humans for too long could seem bothersome for many elves (consider it being like spending months upon months with dozens of ten year olds). The older, mature elves return to be with their kin while a few younger ones run around the mainland sight-seeing, until they too get tired of the other races. I would consider an elf who lives around humans and is over 150 would have some form of elven ADHD.

That said, elves (and ESPECIALLY not high elves) do not take kindly to religions of any kind. Promises of life after death are hollow and purposeless to an elf who has several centuries of life left to live. Any elves who follow a religion would have to be, again, very young so to not get tired of the sentiments of religions.

Ending Words

Got a bit off-topic near the end there, but I think I got the general points down. If anyone has a detailed question thy'd like to ask, shoot one of the older high-elven players (Myself, Aspect, Dio, or Sporadic) a message. We'll be glad to prod you in the right direction. :mrgreen:

[Esterlen 4499]

I find myself attracted to high elven roleplay again, apparently.

What a lot (The majority?) of roleplayers on LotC don't seem to understand is that you should not import your real-life morals of anti-discrimination and equality over to your characters on the server. It's absolutely ridiculous and you just shouldn't do it.

Why? Because it's not appropriate and it's boring. A high elf raised as a high elf does not have a sudden moral epiphany in which he decides he hates the arrogance and discrimination of his own race. I'm seeing a recurring trend of people jumping on the bandwagon of 'IC political-correctness'.

In Oren you will not have rights as a peasant. You're a peasant. Nobody cares if you're killed in the most heinous way possible, you're replaceable, and if you don't like that, then don't roleplay a peasant.

If you want to hate the high elves then here's a suggestion - don't be one. Being special is becoming far too mainstream.

[steelersfan1221 300]

Moved to the Great Library. It shall be sorted into appropriate category shortly.