[Feedback] Policy Contradictions And General Concerns

[Temp 2006]

I've Rp'd with other Tier 5 Firemages that have been around since Aegis and yet, they haven't gone as far as to emote the death of the individual for the victim.

Odd that it was dropped but, carrying on.
 

[Lago 2572]

There's a lot of variables not taken into account there. Correlation does not equal causality.

[Lima 774]

See... my big issue is with the PVP default is that the majority is ignored. Now, people say that it is a extreme for 5 vs 1, and the one says PVP and bolts it against all RP.

But its quite literally true. 

I can actually happily say on multiple occasions it has allowed would be people who /want/ to win in RP, or at least never lose abuse it. Heck, I have seen the more powergamey types abuse the system in more aggravating ways. 

 

I reference my entire RP experience on this server as a guard, since October. I can happily say that I have had 748 throwing knives thrown at me, and encountered more duel katana wielding lesbian dark elves than I care to count. (You might actually think I am being trolly here. No, I have met 3.) 

The capacity to force a PVP default, by running from RP very blatantly, declaring PVP through doing so and escaping the guards after your triple mass murder of children is actually a very common occurrence. People will commit crimes, get shot multiple times or something and run when they realise their character might end up with permanent consequences or their mask removed or some crap. 
The reality is, the use of PVP default acts as a incentive to people that need to win, and backs up the "I win at RP" attitude. 

Additional point, the OOC denial of war claims is pants on head window licker supreme stupid. 

The reality is, that say you have a tyrannical government, how the hell are you actually meant to rebel, when they say. "No, I OOC deny your RP of civil unrest from genocide, or all that casus beli, or all the other stuff. You are ruining my RP by giving my character consequences for his actions."

Another point, of unlimited raids is utterly stupid. This is bound to be abused, and even with RP protection safe zones it will still screw up when one player group says they are raided too much, even though they don't stand as a nation. I mean, if we look at the examples of nations that have been raided roughly 1.5 times per hour in the 12 hour hot spot past 4pm GMT, it nearly broke the nation. Everyone left, no one RPed and the player base deserted.

Warclaims are just a fairer system, with large battles unique to this server and people will join both sides just for the sake of it. They provoke dynamic RP and are incredibly enjoyable. The degrading of the system to no warclaims and PVP raids on every piece land is so stupid. 

 

These are just some holes in the current policy... the majority system and the existence of warclaims was better for everyone. The incentive of raids, the least popular PVP form, will not be. 

[Lyuin 65]

if you do not have the 'time' to make someone's death enjoyable through role-play, you simply should not be killing people

 

This. 

 

By all means folks, I'm happy to have that majority system back or even a simple: 2-4 people in combat = majority (or RP) and 5+ means it's always PVP.

 

Though majority would me the best as it means in situations where there are loads of participants you don't have to suffer emote spam. In smaller fights you can spend the time Rp'ing.

[AlmondTree 418]

 

if you do not have the 'time' to make someone's death enjoyable through role-play, you simply should not be killing people

Of course!

 

But it's not only the aggressors job, he might be the villain ICly but OOC the victim has just as big of a responsibility as the aggressor when doing combat role-play. If the person being attacked happens to be one of the "Anti Combat" people and already decided that hes NOT gonna enjoy this then HE is at fault for only caring for his OWN role-play and it's not going to be fun for the aggressor either. So then where is the fair deal? Is this an entitlement the victim gets? It's a two way communication so stop already putting all the blame on those that do more combat RP than others, not fair.

 

 

This statement goes both ways.

[CosmicWhaleShark 2488]

Whoa, alright, I was not aware this was picking up steam again. - one moment...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PvP default has been the system and undoubtedly will be the system for the far future. My response before was simply acknowledging its very shaky, arguably illegitimate, re-integration. With that said, I'm not sure there's any need to expand on these responses, as that's basically all you two are talking about within these posts.

 

 

 

 

Ttwesten thank you -very much- for actually providing proof along with your response to re-affirm your statements. That's an incredibly constructive response.

 

 

And Without sitting down to view every Ban Report you have to question the legitimacy of the information presented.

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ahcfy_S1dUGSdG8zY3ZiNlVOLWpndHBqdDBvTmpzV3c#gid=31

 

They did, tabs are at the bottom. Three years worth of detail into the reports at hand.

 

 

Also, this does not take into account Mod Reqs as I'd also said.

 

Considering the sheer amount of reports however, I feel his points are still applicable.

 

 

 

Furthermore, I remember you being one of the people reported for heinous PG, resulting in RP default just looking incredibly cringeworthy to people like myself.

 

 

Hmm...

 

 

My response was to the topic... Who even are you?

 

Interesting...

 

 

We're all adult enough to be on the internet and should be able to overlook stupidity.
Most of the server doesn't come onto the forums to read, react or take part in discussion. Know why? They're obviously enjoying themselves and are actually, you know, RPing in game despite the 'rambling and outcries' for change on the forums.

 

You seem to be a bit contradictory within the very page of this topic, Templar. Just pointing that out - denial in the face of proof, without proof, is not constructive. It could be considered... Rambling, I believe.

 

 

 

 

I've Rp'd with other Tier 5 Firemages that have been around since Aegis and yet, they haven't gone as far as to emote the death of the individual for the victim.

Odd that it was dropped but, carrying on.

 

A single example based on a single individual's perspective without a single shred of proof. Don't mean to sound harsh but your posts could equate to fluff considering you've provided baseless points and have insulted people within the thread.

 

 

See... my big issue is with the PVP default is that the majority is ignored. Now, people say that it is a extreme for 5 vs 1, and the one says PVP and bolts it against all RP.

 

I just want to be clear that this thread was not meant to undermine the current default setting - I was just responding to Lago's confident response about PvP's renewal and apparent legitimacy. Facts are facts, and clarity should be maintained.

 

 

See... my big issue is with the PVP default is that the majority is ignored. Now, people say that it is a extreme for 5 vs 1, and the one says PVP and bolts it against all RP.

But its quite literally true. 

 

I will agree with this, with that said. In the effort to not contradict myself, I do not want to list baseless examples. Therefore...

 

 

It is worth noting that the situation was resolved in-game, there will be no report arising, however this still serves as an example. The Orc had received a large crate of stone, and then proceeded to flee through MC mechanics after an armed man was blocking his way, and a Druid was above preparing her spell. They ran MCly, auto-armored, and only used a single emote (without any mention of armor). I struck them to attempt to get them to stop, and they resorted to simply killing me because I guess they just thought they were getting PvPed.

 

The point of this, is the Orc had apparently fought off armed guards and an extremely proficient Druid - while carrying a huge crate of stone, in armor, and wielding a sword at the same time. This is PvP mechanics and the reason I agree with Lima.

 

 

I can actually happily say on multiple occasions it has allowed would be people who /want/ to win in RP, or at least never lose abuse it. Heck, I have seen the more powergamey types abuse the system in more aggravating ways. 

 

I reference my entire RP experience on this server as a guard, since October. I can happily say that I have had 748 throwing knives thrown at me, and encountered more duel katana wielding lesbian dark elves than I care to count. (You might actually think I am being trolly here. No, I have met 3.) 

 

Baseless, fluff from my perspective, apologies.

 

 

The capacity to force a PVP default, by running from RP very blatantly, declaring PVP through doing so and escaping the guards after your triple mass murder of children is actually a very common occurrence. People will commit crimes, get shot multiple times or something and run when they realise their character might end up with permanent consequences or their mask removed or some crap. 
The reality is, the use of PVP default acts as a incentive to people that need to win, and backs up the "I win at RP" attitude. 

 

If there are multiple occurrences of this, I would request you provide at least some examples to ensure legitimacy.

 

 

Additional point, the OOC denial of war claims is pants on head window licker supreme stupid. 

 

Not how I would articulate that point, however I do agree.

 

Nation leaders have a responsibility to provide role-play for their players and ensure their nation works within the RP world, they do have responsibility despite it only being an RP position. They do require maturity, it's more productive to simply cooperate and try to ensure a fun experience together with planning. Obviously this is not always the case, unfortunately as well.

 

 

Another point, of unlimited raids is utterly stupid. This is bound to be abused, and even with RP protection safe zones it will still screw up when one player group says they are raided too much, even though they don't stand as a nation. I mean, if we look at the examples of nations that have been raided roughly 1.5 times per hour in the 12 hour hot spot past 4pm GMT, it nearly broke the nation. Everyone left, no one RPed and the player base deserted.

 

It's worth noting, as said in my original post. Raid rules were re-written because of abuse. This statement, while lacking in proof in the actual post of Lima's, is backed up within the thread itself on the very first page.

 

 

These are just some holes in the current policy... the majority system and the existence of warclaims was better for everyone. The incentive of raids, the least popular PVP form, will not be. 

 

Hence why I posted this topic.

 

 

This. 

 

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

Of course!

 

But it's not only the aggressors job, he might be the villain ICly but OOC the victim has just as big of a responsibility as the aggressor when doing combat role-play. If the person being attacked happens to be one of the "Anti Combat" people and already decided that hes NOT gonna enjoy this then HE is at fault for only caring for his OWN role-play and it's not going to be fun for the aggressor either. So then where is the fair deal? Is this an entitlement the victim gets? It's a two way communication so stop already putting all the blame on those that do more combat RP than others, not fair.

 

 

This statement goes both ways.

 

 

A very sound perspective, and one I agree with. That being said, the Villain is the one who instigates conflict - as it has been said previously in other posts, if the person didn't want to RP, just PvP, they would have been a drag anyways. Or something to that effect...

 

Avoid a conflict entirely, and an upset player. It doesn't matter how you kill him, or how you interact with him (or her...) - if they aren't open to your interactions, don't force it upon them, just leave them be and move on to more positive experiences.

[Rhia 936]

Moved to the Great Library. It shall be sorted into appropriate category shortly.