[Feedback] Policy Contradictions And General Concerns

[Aislin 4354]

 

hey look it's that thing I've been saying for like a year now!

 

We've both been saying this **** for like a year!!! Why don't they just make us admins QQ

[CosmicWhaleShark 2488]

Do you have anything however, Aislinn, to say in response to the above post. As of right now you have an ET that has finished their main events, basically open to any and all requests, and free game on most magic, lore, and villainy.

 

What, in your opinion, is stopping people from doing anything else besides PvP? What in your opinion would be a proper alternative to the PvP mindset?

 

When raid rules were established, raids steadily began to shrink and shrink until they were a rarity. I am willing to theorize that if you provide PvP zones rather than RP zones, you will see a more creative mindset throughout the rest of the map.

[Lago 2572]

Why is everyone acting as if PvP default is new? We've had it for a very, very long time.

 

 

Additionally with removing majority ruling, you can literally have a single person be the "*******" that makes everyone else PvP.

If someone actually does that, actually insists and forces PvP, then they'd have been a nightmare in an Emote fight. That, and the ones who want to RP fight can PvP him and continue.

 

We are allowing essentially free lore, free magic, free villainy. Role-play at this point is essentially up to the player's discretion, which could be considered fantastic. There is no regulation beyond simple observations of blatant power-gaming. However you can really only 'safely' RP within the designated areas, without worrying about absolute PvP default, according to staff theories.

 

You can RP however you like, but you're only safe in a handful of places. You can choose to be whatever you like, but you cannot truly be wherever you wish.

Everywhere safe, somewhere safe or nowhere safe. What do you want exactly?

You can RP anywhere on the map. If you're out on the roads you might run into bandits, which you RP with.

 

The important thing about the "safe zones" is that they're in practice unraidable.

 

I don't believe we should be nurturing PvP any further than we already have, once again, this is an RP server.

I know. So? It's an RP server, so people roleplay their characters. Players who prefer PvP as the combat mechanic aren't the bunch of roaming raider trolls they're painted to be. "RP fighting" insinuates that any other form of resolving combat isn't, which frankly is is a boatload of crap.

It's Emote Fighting. Your soundbite is "This is an Emote Server."

 

Um, no it isn't.

 

 

We've both been saying this **** for like a year!!! Why don't they just make us admins QQ

Because you're just pointing out the problem. The admins know its there. It's how to fix it which is the question.

You're right in that the way to fix things is to kill raiding. Bandits on the roads, orc attacks with RP behind them, these are great. Going in with your mates on TS to kill some elves, however, is fun for one side and destructive for the other. Physically preventing PvP in settlements prevents this by making them unraidable. If you've got a better way to implement PvP in moderation, I'm sure the admins would love to hear it.

[CosmicWhaleShark 2488]

Why is everyone acting as if PvP default is new? We've had it for a very, very long time.

 

That being said, we at one point did not have it as default, for a handful of reasons. When reverting back to the original PvP default policy, a poll was made. As far as I can determine, the poll's results were tampered with, in favor of PvP. When there was an attempt to legitimize the poll, RP default actually was more popular.

 

 

We may have had PvP default for a while now, Lago. However in the past we've discussed in length about other subjects of questionable implementation, you should know my stance on such matters. Simply making that clear, this thread was not meant to spark yet another PvP/RP debate, precisely.

 

 

If someone actually does that, actually insists and forces PvP, then they'd have been a nightmare in an Emote fight. That, and the ones who want to RP fight can PvP him and continue.

 

In regards to this concept of clean cut PvP with zero complications, allow me to give you a general summary of my experiences with the system. This is only regarding Anthos, as well. There were many more in Aegis.

 

I've been in several situations where we have done something similar to this. If the person I was originally having a combat session survived their PvP fight, we would continue as if nothing interrupted it. This involved returning to death to retrieve items, and roughly a half hour (give or take five minutes) of /looc regarding the lost items and the general result. Those that were not even involved in the initial fight took it upon themselves to join in, further complicating issues. Typically my PvP encounters have been a complete mess. It interrupts flow and build-up, from my experience, and I believe it to be cheap and lazy.

 

In my frustration I even filed a player report, the first one in... Years, for one fight due to seemingly random involvement. It was deemed acceptable that a single emote, not even mentioning my character, was considered acceptable to be involved in the fight itself.

 

In one scenario an Orc had received several emotes from a company of soldiers with crossbows, essentially a zero-survival situation and he emoted using a dead Orc he was dragging as a meat-shield, after the bolts had been fired. Before the soldiers could make responses he requested PvP, and the group obliged him. He took this opportunity to make a full sprint in escape despite the previous emotes.

 

I would prefer it if people stopped romanticizing PvP as some clean cut system with limited complications, this has not been the case from my personal experiences. Others may have had positive experiences, I don't know. I've personally had typically positive role-play combat experiences where I see others haven't, not everyone is the same.

 

 

Everywhere safe, somewhere safe or nowhere safe. What do you want exactly?

You can RP anywhere on the map. If you're out on the roads you might run into bandits, which you RP with.

 

A more role-play friendly environment for everyone involved, simply put. If people intend to be a bandit, I would prefer they actually put time and thought into their conduct, and make a terrible experience for the character a positive experience for the player. Journeying on a road only to get clicked to death, can be frustrating for anyone, older player or newer.

 

 

The important thing about the "safe zones" is that they're in practice unraidable.

 

Awesome, in my original post I elaborated on why this was a misguided concept. RP nature reserves.

 

 

I know. So? It's an RP server, so people roleplay their characters.

 

In a previous reform to raid rules that myself and others addressed, there were multiple instances where people simply could not role-play as the usually did because of the excess of raids not just per day, but sometimes so dramatically inflated that it was raids per hour.

 

With an absence of 'quick combat' however, other role-play surfaced, eventually.

 

Players who prefer PvP as the combat mechanic aren't the bunch of roaming raider trolls they're painted to me.

 

Your experiences differ drastically from mine, and that's fine. I am also, naturally, basing my opinions on personal experiences.

 

 

"RP fighting" insinuates that any other form of resolving combat isn't, which frankly is is a boatload of crap.

It's Emote Fighting. Your soundbite is "This is an Emote Server."

 

I'm not just endorsing RP fighting, I'm endorsing role-play in general, really. Nor did I ever say that anything else was illegitimate, I just do not feel it is best-suited for LotC.

 

Your argument against "emote fighting" would be similar also to saying that people aren't role-playing, they're emote talking. It's semantics by that point.

 

 

Um, no it isn't.

 

Considering the tool was made specifically for LotC, the 'emote' tool, it sort of is actually.

 

 

Because you're just pointing out the problem. The admins know its there. It's how to fix it which is the question.

You're right in that the way to fix things is to kill raiding. Bandits on the roads, orc attacks with RP behind them, these are great. Going in with your mates on TS to kill some elves, however, is fun for one side and destructive for the other. Physically preventing PvP in settlements prevents this by making them unraidable. If you've got a better way to implement PvP in moderation, I'm sure the admins would love to hear it.

 

I won't be addressing this as it seemed to be reserved for Aislin.

[Old-Rattlesnake 1534]

That being said, we at one point did not have it as default, for a handful of reasons. When reverting back to the original PvP default policy, a poll was made. As far as I can determine, the poll's results were tampered with, in favor of PvP. When there was an attempt to legitimize the poll, RP default actually was more popular.

 

 

FINALLY SOMEONE ELSE POINTS THIS OUT.

[spqrSancus 175]

I don't want RP default. I'd have rather had a majority system as had (apparently) been happening whilst I was gone. It's fairer for everyone, and no one can say that there was one ******* who wanted PVP or one guy who wanted an hour long RP fight and everyone else wanted it over with quick and relatively cleanly. In an undevelopped society, a dictatorship should be used, as it gives a certain undisputable goal. LoTC is not a new or undevelopped society. Let there be democracy/

[Temp 2006]

The default doesn't matter, at all.

RP Default results in considerably more BRs and Mod Reqs over kids powergaming, meta gaming and avoiding RP while PvP default results in people just sitting on the forums, bitching.

What doesn't change? The fact that numbers should always win. I'd much rather deal with 10 seconds of, 'CLICKCLICKCLICK' than a 3 emote long description of a guy summoning a supernova from nothing in the blink of an eye and it's aftermath.

Keep the default set to PvP and instead of attempting to force RP default, give people good reason to RP combat. And FFS, stop running in MC the moment a group of armored men walk through an area, then coming on the forums and whining about PvP default. Players like this are most likely going to be chased down and killed for suspicious activity.
(Not saying any names and it's a general statement.)

In summary: PvP Default should stay as it causes the least drama and friction between players.

--------

In terms of this malicious intent crap, bans are easy.

Someone pugsies again, just ban them.
Someone trolls, just ignore it.
Someone opens a thread with intent to bash a singular group and rally support, while it's just as malicious as Pugsying, it should be ignored.

Why these responses?
This is just a, Minecraft Fantasy Roleplay Server.
We're all adult enough to be on the internet and should be able to overlook stupidity.
Most of the server doesn't come onto the forums to read, react or take part in discussion. Know why? They're obviously enjoying themselves and are actually, you know, RPing in game despite the 'rambling and outcries' for change on the forums.

[spqrSancus 175]

 

The default doesn't matter, at all.

RP Default results in considerably more BRs and Mod Reqs over kids powergaming, meta gaming and avoiding RP while PvP default results in people just sitting on the forums, bitching.

What doesn't change? The fact that numbers should always win. I'd much rather deal with 10 seconds of, 'CLICKCLICKCLICK' than a 3 emote long description of a guy summoning a supernova from nothing in the blink of an eye and it's aftermath.

Keep the default set to PvP and instead of attempting to force RP default, give people good reason to RP combat. And FFS, stop running in MC the moment a group of armored men walk through an area, then coming on the forums and whining about PvP default. Players like this are most likely going to be chased down and killed for suspicious activity.

(Not saying any names and it's a general statement.)

In summary: PvP Default should stay as it causes the least drama and friction between players.

--------

In terms of this malicious intent crap, bans are easy.

Someone pugsies again, just ban them.

Someone trolls, just ignore it.

Someone opens a thread with intent to bash a singular group and rally support, while it's just as malicious as Pugsying, it should be ignored.

Why these responses?

This is just a, Minecraft Fantasy Roleplay Server.

We're all adult enough to be on the internet and should be able to overlook stupidity.

Most of the server doesn't come onto the forums to read, react or take part in discussion. Know why? They're obviously enjoying themselves and are actually, you know, RPing in game despite the 'rambling and outcries' for change on the forums.

 

 

I hope you're not saying that I want RP default. I don't. I just don't want PvP default either.

[Temp 2006]

I hope you're not saying that I want RP default. I don't. I just don't want PvP default either.

My response was to the topic... Who even are you?

[spqrSancus 175]

My response was to the topic... Who even are you?

 

*shrugs* It sounded a bit as though it was directed at me. My bad. As for who I am, you wouldn't know: When you were around when I was still playing, I wasn't well known. And when you've gotten more active again recently, I've been very, very inactive, and have faded out of most people's minds.

[Lago 2572]

Merits of various combat forms aside, anything that can be defaulted to has to be able to force a resolution.

[E__V__O 2000]

Well since someone mentioned ban reports of RP and PvP default, I guess I could leave this topic here... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://www.lordofthecraft.net/topic/106350-statisticspublic-ban-reports-over-the-last-year/?hl=reports

 

You can clearly see that PvP has had the most reports filed, RP has not, reply back to Temp's claim.

-

Won't make any further comment.

[Temp 2006]

Well since someone mentioned ban reports of RP and PvP default, I guess I could leave this topic here... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://www.lordofthecraft.net/topic/106350-statisticspublic-ban-reports-over-the-last-year/?hl=reports

 

You can clearly see that PvP has had the most reports filed, RP has not, reply back to Temp's claim.

-

Won't make any further comment.

And Without sitting down to view every Ban Report you have to question the legitimacy of the information presented.

Also, this does not take into account Mod Reqs as I'd also said.

 

Furthermore, I remember you being one of the people reported for heinous PG, resulting in RP default just looking incredibly cringeworthy to people like myself.

[Fredfort (jens6851) 283]

 

And Without sitting down to view every Ban Report you have to question the legitimacy of the information presented.

Also, this does not take into account Mod Reqs as I'd also said.

 

Furthermore, I remember you being one of the people reported for heinous PG, resulting in RP default just looking incredibly cringeworthy to people like myself.

 

 

I'm not even active on Lotc right now. But just because someone reports a person for PG it doesn't mean they're right. Ttwest is  rp wise one of, if not THE strongest fire evocanist on the server, but is not as known as other wizards and magic users. Hence why some may have reported him.

 

BUT. I just randomly saw this message and felt like posting, because why not. So don't take my comment for much. :P

[E__V__O 2000]

 

And Without sitting down to view every Ban Report you have to question the legitimacy of the information presented.

Also, this does not take into account Mod Reqs as I'd also said.

 

They were statistics to give a reply back to your post, they were gathered if you clicked the link by a techie who spent time gathering the information which I presented. I just felt like it was needed to help your post before.

 

 

 

Furthermore, I remember you being one of the people reported for heinous PG, resulting in RP default just looking incredibly cringeworthy to people like myself.

 

I recommend you leave personal RP out of this topic, it isn't supposed to be aimed at anyone, though to the comment of being P-G'my, it was a miss-understanding that the ones involved could not understand the way I wrote the emotes as with miss-understanding of the MAT at the current time- both fixed later and the file dropped. Though again please leave personal RP matters from this post to single out a certain player. It is a constructive post and that should be filed for feedback, which we are all currently doing.

Thank you.

~ttwesten