What would you do?

[Navigator 4260]

HI!

Lately, it seems to have turned into a trend within LotC to 'doomer' or generally be negative about the server's current status, the status of staff, lore, roleplay, etc etc. And before the finger is pointed in some 'Hah, navigator is just trying to doomer himself', no! Despite holding my own views in regards to the server's general state and the state of the different staff teams, lore, rules, etc, I instead want to propose the opposite; instead of complaining about the problem, what would you do?

 

I've come to the conclusion that just sitting here and shittalking our current staff team, or any prior to them, is way too easy. It's way too easy to shit on someone like Llir for the decisions and actions taken as Maheral of Haelun'or and the whole debacle regarding that, while - as mentioned by Narthok and several others - every single other NL has done, will do or thinks of doing the same. So, this thread exists purely for players to rantpost about what they believe would "fix LotC", with a very heavy emphasis on quote-on-quote, because I don't think LotC even needs fixing aside from very specific things - such as people's inability from moving on from things.

 

I've gone out of my way to collect the topics I see talked about the most, and I'd plead you that, if you do decide to leave something in this post, then, either try to stick to these topics, and be respectful to them and others, or, if you'd like to propose another topic, please let me know and I'll add it to the list so others can opinionate on them as well. Furthermore, I'm going to put this nice and big before the topics so that I don't get fingers pointed at me;

 

I don't want Forum rep for this, I want to gauge feedback.

 

With that explicitly said, here are the topics I garnered that are worth discussing;

• Metaplay; its definition, how it is handled, 'good' vs 'bad' metaplay, how it diferentiates to metagaming, etc.
• Realm mechanics; how much does it influence rp despite being an OOC mechanic, reformulation of the realm rules, etc.
• Free build; should it return? is it good? is it bad? why?
• 'State' of the staff team; do they have too much power? do they have too little power? are they biased, or unbiased? is there too little or too much oversight?
• Discord; is it worse than TS/Skype back in the day? is the centralization of nation discords bad for rp? are discord 'hubs' announcing events technically metaplay?
• The ST; is lore too boring? is ST to be blamed for it? is stuff too overtuned/too weak? should ST be allowed in leadership positions, or be made an exception alongside mods/admins?
• Wars; why did wars pause to 'fix rules' and rules are still a mess? should wars be completely reformulated?
• Hate speech & analogies on the server; should we accept obvious connotations/analogies to be made? (ex.; n*zi analogies)

 

Those are the topics I had in mind. Feel free to drop as many posts as you want, as many words, be free. As little or as much. And, again, I'm going to put this nice and big as well because I think it is imperative to reinforce this.

 

Be respectful, irregardless of disagreements or differences of opinion.

 

Thank you, and have a nice Wednesday and rest of the week!

[spaazmatism 1023]

free build.. 

[Benleft 2581]

I'd make Wowj the communications team admin 

[Samson Option 9652]

 

Don't let your gooner doomer thoughts win!

[Jihnyny 5233]

-metaplay still exists despite the rule, though the heavy bans did a good job with putting the fear into people. wish it worked towards erpers icba to think of a fix on metaplay

-do not bring back free-build. anyone who thinks freebuild is good is dillusional.

 

-also OOC realm mechanics hold a HUGE influence on rp. ACTIVITY! ACTIVITY! ACTIVITY! WE MUST UPHOLD ACTIVITY FOR TILES!!! I MUST DO THIS DECISION WITH THIS NATION SO WE CAN PROVIDE ACTIVITY FOR EACHOTHER!! I MUST WAR X NATION SO MY FLEEPERS WAKE UP AND CARRY ACTIVITY FOR ME!!

-staff will always be biased, its literally player run and voted in by players. I just wish more staff with the power over the community (admin, manager etc) were more active in the actual community. There are times when someone who is not known or placed in the LotC community as a whole becomes staff and its a mix of incredibly biased and unbiased. I'd personally make staff more punishable. There are still staff on the team and staff that were on the team that continiously got away with a slap on the wrist - if any at all

Staff are not trustworthy aswell. its difficult to report things unless you KNOW the actual moderator and you KNOW they will handle the situation properly with a care and without bias. - i still cannot forget the time a moderator banned like 3 people permanently for no reason and got away with it until he got finally thrown off the team 

-discord is ******* awesome. people who doomer about discord ive noticed do shit for their nation. discord is great for events.

-lore isnt boring, ST are doing an awesome job. @Petsch2k, @capn_avery more people should follow in their footsteps and do random events IMO. I actually think the problem of ST is focusing too much on eventlines thta have a meaning on lore instead of individual shit that makes characters based and heroic. Filter the trve heroes of mankind with the shitty 'templars' that do nothing.

-YES. WARS ARE SO STUPID, AS EVERYONE SAID IN LLIRS POST - FIX THE ******* TILE SYSTEM RAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH it is horrid shite that literally ENFORCES metaplay and puts a necessity on discord and metaplay. 'We're fixing it next map dw' >regions with one ******* tile type ??

-yes, respectfully navi, who tf cares if someone has a political belief that is against someone elses. as long as they dont actually HARASS someone it doesnt matter. i also hate the label 'hate-speech' its so retarded. half of this server would be gone if they were banned for their political or religious opinion 

i go back to reading stupid polish 
 

[Wonderland_Boy 1082]

Please don't let them bring back free build...

[Gaja 1311]

make a separate forum and autofill anyone who has mentioned atlas, axios, anthos, and any other boomer maps more than twice in a month into it so i dont have to read oldhead takes

[___ 361]

I want to see public logs for bans implemented that show the username of the banned player, provide a descriptive reason as to why they were banned instead of just a category, and back up the claim with solid evidence. I feel as though this would allow us to hold the moderation team accountable for some of their actions. Being able to appeal to a higher power in the case of an unfair ban would also be nice.

 

The only argument that I’ve seen against public ban logs is that people might be harassed for submitting evidence, but if the staff team takes this more seriously and prevents people from doing so, it should stop being an issue fairly quickly. Beyond this, even with that potential issue in mind, it would dispel slanderous rumors going around that could do irreparable damage to a player’s reputation and have them excluded from most communities on the server. It would also prevent moderation from giving out vague bans that are difficult to understand and don’t have much evidence attached to them.

 

I personally believe that the pros greatly outweigh the cons and don’t understand why something so simple hasn’t been implemented. It’s difficult for anyone to trust the staff team when there’s so little staff transparency.

[MCVDK 2830]

Rather than offer offhand comments or empty critiques, I want to respect the thought you’ve put into this discussion and contribute some of my own. While I don’t have detailed thoughts on every point raised, there are several key areas where I feel I can meaningfully engage.

 

i. Metaplay

I want to reiterate what I expressed in response to Toffee’s post on metaplay:

 

“Why have clear guidelines not been released? Is it to maintain flexibility? To allow case-by-case discretion? If so, why does that approach apply here, when standard rule enforcement already incorporates discretion? Why is metaplay an exception? Or is it simply more convenient to keep these rules vague, allowing for a level of subjectivity that makes enforcement difficult to challenge? Whatever the reason, the result is the same: players feel left in the dark about where the lines are drawn.”

 

While we have recently been given some insights, particularly through SquakHawk’s Metaplay: A Retrospective, and the rules have since been updated to reflect this, I still believe the administration should develop these ideas further. Following Toffee’s example, they should clearly and accessibly outline the principles guiding metaplay enforcement.

 

Without clear and transparent guidelines, players are left to navigate ambiguous boundaries on their own. Even the most well-intentioned administrators can unintentionally apply rules unevenly in such an environment. This leads to punishments that feel arbitrary or inconsistent. Over time, this erodes player trust, fosters perceptions of favoritism, and discourages players from fully engaging in the world out of fear they might cross invisible lines. Clear rules do not just prevent bad behavior; they also encourage good behavior by giving players the confidence to act creatively within a well-defined framework.

 

I appreciate the concept and ideology behind the current approach. I believe this is broadly how metagaming should be handled by default. Still, I have always found the formal introduction of “metaplay” as a separate category somewhat puzzling, though that may simply be a matter of personal perspective.

 

ii. Freebuild and Realms

I am not a supporter of freebuild, especially not when applied to the entire world map. Contrary to much of the sentiment I have seen, I actually appreciate the realm system that has been put in place. I value the checks and balances it introduces to the world’s structure.

 

I believe it should be more challenging to establish a fully recognized nation than it was on this map. At the same time, it should be more accessible to form smaller entities, such as lairs or settlements. Most importantly, progression should be based on tangible, in-game accomplishments rather than symbolic measures like forum signatures.

 

Beyond game mechanics, the realm system helps shape the social and cultural fabric of the world. It fosters cohesive and meaningful communities that develop shared histories, symbols, and identities. Without such structures, the map risks becoming fragmented and transient, filled with disconnected pockets of builds and players. The balance of power would likely tilt further toward the largest and most established groups, leaving little space for emerging players or smaller factions to thrive.

 

It is also worth noting that the map’s overall build quality has significantly improved without freebuild. There is a sense of permanence and intentionality in what players create, knowing their work is part of a larger, structured world, rather than the temporary project of a new player scattering houses without cohesion.

 

iii. Discord

This may sound pessimistic, but I believe it is realistic: Discord is here to stay. The social mechanics we now associate with Discord have always existed, even if they took different forms in the past. Realistically, there is little that can be done to fundamentally change this dynamic.

 

Tentoa outlined this point well in his post, and while I do not have much to add, I want to highlight one particularly insightful passage:

 

“Onto the complaint that everything is arranged through Discord and you no longer have to find people, you can still play a character fine without use of Discord. In Aegis, you just /t’d the person you were looking for, a bird arrives, and they would IM you IC within moments anyway. Everyone had group chats in Skype for organizing RP. And, by the way, alarm bells were not a thing, so you could just say ‘I’m being attacked’ in your Skype group, and your friends would all log on. Moderation would not do anything because we had no standards for fair play. Most things you did were never discussed IC and were done with flimsy reasoning, not for the pursuit of a narrative but the pursuit of personal goals. Only, you did not have to care about other people’s fun at all. Anyone telling you otherwise is blinded by nostalgia for the innocence of their youth.”

 

While it is tempting to long for a time before Discord, the reality is that players have always used the tools available to coordinate and communicate. Rather than lamenting Discord’s influence, perhaps the more productive discussion is about how we can use it constructively. The focus should be on ensuring that Discord enhances, rather than undermines, the integrity and quality of in-game roleplay.

 

iv. Story Team (ST)

It is important to push back against the tendency to blame the ST for a lack of roleplay. It is not the ST’s responsibility to create roleplay or lore for the players. Lore is the players’ responsibility, and so is roleplay.

 

Players should take the initiative to generate roleplay themselves, rather than sitting idle or wandering aimlessly. If you see someone running around, call out to them, engage them, and create moments together. The ST’s role is not to serve as the primary storytellers or entertainers of the server. Rather, they act as custodians of the world’s lore, ensuring consistency and balance within the larger framework.

 

The most vibrant and compelling roleplay emerges when players craft their own stories and weave their narratives into the world’s evolving fabric. Expecting the ST to carry the burden of RP creation misunderstands the collaborative, player-driven essence that lies at the heart of meaningful roleplay. The ST’s responsibility is to maintain the world’s structure and continuity, not to manufacture plots or events on demand.

[Navigator 4260]

14 minutes ago, Jihnyny said:

-yes, respectfully navi, who tf cares if someone has a political belief that is against someone elses. as long as they dont actually HARASS someone it doesnt matter. i also hate the label 'hate-speech' its so retarded. half of this server would be gone if they were banned for their political or religious opinion 
 

I proposed that last point mostly because, as a trend, it does seem that the individuals who make those analogies tend to either directly or indirectly harass people for not liking said analogies. I personally don't care much, but I do know there are people who do, specifically the example I gave, because I think there's no real place for that ideology/opinion in a modern world, much less a fantasy one. As a law student its kind of hard to not condone the 'hate-speech label' because it is what allows us, those in the law world, to hold people accountable for things they say that directly harm another's free speech or personal liberties. While I do agree that 'hate-speech' has been used as a blanket term to point at something and say 'i don't like that, it's hate speech', there are very specific things which fall under hate speech that need to be moderated and be completely banned, and fortunately, things such as transphobia, homophobia, racism, etc, all fall under the legal term of 'hate speech', and while there are those who consider them to be opinions, the fact of the matter is that, not only national laws across the globe, but international law and company TOS', generally consider these to be a breach of their guidelines/laws, and as such, they are disconsidered from free speech and are liable to punishment, hence why I proposed the discussion around analogies/obvious characterizations of more extreme things.

[Epicethan4 948]

I still enjoy the server a lot nowadays (sometimes even moreso than before) and I've been on it since 2015. I don't think the server has significantly declined (infact, its improved a lot in areas such as warclaims, build-standards and sometimes even roleplay standards.)

I am pretty optimistic going forward as I think the high-quantity of nations was pulling the server back by decentralising activity, so I'm happy that next map will be a RETURN to what LOTC used to be like in regards to nation amounts.

 

I would say the biggest thing I'm not happy with current LOTC is HONOUR crp default. I don't want to go too far into it as many have already made arguments, but I think effectively forcing defending players to engage in potentially hours long CRP fights (whilst having busy social lives/careers) is actually immoral. Bring back Defender Default.

Another aspect of modern LOTC is that its very much devoid of plugins compared to before.

Edited May 28, 2025 by Epicethan4

[Narthok 10416]

57 minutes ago, Navigator said:

Lately, it seems to have turned into a trend within LotC to 'doomer' or generally be negative about the server's current status, the status of staff, lore, roleplay, etc etc.

I think the server is in a better state than it has been many times before. I think the degree to which ST et al is run by drama and discord politics is lame, but it is what it is and you just kind of deal with it. I think moderation is in a pretty bad spot, they should probably double the number of mods and sack most of the current ones. They won't tho so it is what it is.

 

It is possible to have fun on the server if you make it fun and ignore the bad parts. 

 

Most of the people dooming are banned or had their niche thing rejected or destroyed so they are understandably upset. But just as an objective question the server has definitely been in worse states before.

50 minutes ago, Jihnyny said:

Staff are not trustworthy aswell. its difficult to report things unless you KNOW the actual moderator and you KNOW they will handle the situation properly with a care and without bias. - i still cannot forget the time a moderator banned like 3 people permanently for no reason and got away with it until he got finally thrown off the team 

agree with this I don't trust mods at all, most of them don't even read the rules. You as a player are constantly forced to deal with the rules not as written but as interpreted by the illiterate of the day, potentially coloured by a preceding decision made 2 weeks ago that isn't widely known or  publicized.

51 minutes ago, Jihnyny said:

-discord is ******* awesome. people who doomer about discord ive noticed do shit for their nation. discord is great for events.

yeah the people who complain the most about discord are usually the ones who are perenially telling me about who x is erping with or y met up with z irl and said z was ugly. I literally only use one lotc related disc. Discord is what you make of it. Its necessary for running any kind of sizeable nation tho.

1 hour ago, Navigator said:

Hate speech & analogies on the server; should we accept obvious connotations/analogies to be made? (ex.; n*zi analogies)

People think my religious views are hate speech so I'd rather LOTC not dip its toes in this pool. If people are not being harassed then what they believe is not really anyone's business nor should it be punishable.

45 minutes ago, MythicalAxolotl said:

I want to see public logs for bans implemented that show the username of the banned player, provide a descriptive reason as to why they were banned instead of just a category, and back up the claim with solid evidence. I feel as though this would allow us to hold the moderation team accountable for some of their actions. Being able to appeal to a higher power in the case of an unfair ban would also be nice.

 

The only argument that I’ve seen against public ban logs is that people might be harassed for submitting evidence, but if the staff team takes this more seriously and prevents people from doing so, it should stop being an issue fairly quickly. Beyond this, even with that potential issue in mind, it would dispel slanderous rumors going around that could do irreparable damage to a player’s reputation and have them excluded from most communities on the server. It would also prevent moderation from giving out vague bans that are difficult to understand and don’t have much evidence attached to them.

 

I personally believe that the pros greatly outweigh the cons and don’t understand why something so simple hasn’t been implemented. It’s difficult for anyone to trust the staff team when there’s so little staff transparency.

I agree with this, ban, rule, and punishment transparency would be nice.

I also wish staff would stop using all of the cringe HR language that was really popular with arockstar and just hand out 'we don't want you on the server because we don't like you / you are annoying' bans.

38 minutes ago, Navigator said:

As a law student its kind of hard to not condone the 'hate-speech label' because it is what allows us, those in the law world, to hold people accountable for things they say that directly harm another's free speech or personal liberties.

Important to remember that the Americans are vastly more permissive with their hate speech laws than most countries. You are engaging with an anglophonic, majority American community.

 

If people are making threats or harassing that should obviously be addressed.

[monkeypoacher 8055]

I am a man of compromise: Freebuild along all the main roads and near the spawn/major hubs of the map. Claimable land outside that region. Write a plugin to allow groups to claim plots, based on a required number of players.
 

Instead of activity checks, land claims are "taxed" minecraft items based on a resource they produce and a resource they can craft or trade for. "Taxed" items are actually sold on the auction house, with the claim owner getting the proceeds. This means players have easy access to all resources for whatever the market decides the price is.  Also, I would imagine land claims are smaller than existing tiles. More Stardew Valley than Settlers of Catan. Maybe there's some mechanism for letting claims join an existing "realm," but you also can just enforce your nation's authority through RP.

 

No more pastes. No more limited creative. No more opaque, manual review of activity/inactivity by mods, which frees them up to actually moderate the server. An "economy" that doesn't work by punishing players until they interact with it.

 

As for war/conflicts, keep it simple stupid! Stop changing the rules!

 

Metaplay, which is our word for "using the server's meta-mechanics the way they are intended to be used," goes away when you remove the meta-mechanics.

 

Instant, indefinite ban for alienating players on my server based on their identity. Your free speech rights are less valuable to me than my active users.

 

I have no interesting takes on lore. Players who choose to participate in it seem to be moderating it pretty well. Something to be said for lowering the barrier to entry for new ideas though.

[Narthok 10416]

40 minutes ago, Navigator said:

transphobia, homophobia,

Both of these beliefs, or rather the belief that these two orientations are disordered are mandatory per my extremely old religious community which happens to be the largest in the world. I think you would have a hard time finding someone who can claim that I have ever harassed someone for being homosexual or transexual. 

1 minute ago, monkeypoacher said:

Freebuild along all the main roads and near the spawn/major hubs of the map. Claimable land outside that region. Write a plugin to allow groups to claim plots, based on a required number of players.
 

Instead of activity checks, land claims are "taxed" minecraft items based on a resource they produce and a resource they can craft or trade for. "Taxed" items are then sold on the auction house.

 

No more pastes. No more limited creative. No more opaque, manual review of activity/inactivity by mods, which frees them up to actually moderate the server. An "economy" that doesn't work by punishing players until they interact with it.

 

As for war/conflicts, keep it simple stupid! Stop changing the rules!

 

Metaplay, which is our word for "using the server's meta-mechanics the way they are intended to be used," goes away when you remove the meta-mechanics.

 

Instant, indefinite ban for alienating players on my server based on their identity. Your free speech rights are less valuable to me than my active users.

 

I have no interest in lore. Players who choose to participate in it seem to be moderating it pretty well. Something to be said for lowering the barrier to entry for new ideas though.

I hate activity checks and I hate admin based tile taxes

[MRCHENN 4741]

Nice rep farm