A Counter-Proposal To Those Reasonable Oreni, To Create One Empire

[Aesterwald 246]

Issued by the Lord Korrektor Edward II acting as minister plenipotentiary to the Aulic Council and Königreich, confirmed by his benevolent majesty, König Jack Rovin,

With the intended recipient of his imperial majesty, Emperor Tuvya Sigismundovic Carrion, and the Oreni privy council,

In good faith I reply to your letter, focused on the interest of a united and prosperous humanity.

The reason behind the Königreich’s separation from the centralized Oreni state was to escape the corruption and tyranny all too often witnessed at the hands of the ruling monarch and council. To feel comfortable re-entering into a political union with this same state, it is one of our chief concerns that the sovereignty of the Waldenian peoples be preserved.

All too often we see the word “autonomy” bandied about by the imperial crown; without legitimate protections and rights granted to the constituent bodies, the Prince-Electorate states become mindless arms and legs of the imperial crown without true participatory power in the operation of the central state. In this state of being the lack of representation each federated body has, and the minimized representative legitimacy our Königreich would experience when being one of two true nations among many enfranchised heirs to titular irrelevancies, would have the ultimate effect of marginalizing our people and our nation.

While the ultimatum delivered to Aesterwald shares a spirit with our own desired reforms, we cannot fully trust the words of this proposal after seeing the ineffectual nature of elective monarchy in the Imperium Secundus. In this instance, a system of elective monarchy was used as a tool to facilitate the celeritous rise of House Carrion to the imperial throne, then abandoned in all but name to allow for consolidation of absolute power in the imperial crown. This sort of political machination is that which we most dearly fear, for it is our sovereignty and Waldenian brotherhood that shelters us from the ravages of your eastern politics. It is without doubt that we acknowledge certain sacrifices must be made to unify humanity once more, but the extent of these sacrifices must be tempered by reason and remembrance of our histories.

It is for this reason that we have proposed a confederal system of governance, whereby the Waldenian people would be ensured continued and absolute sovereignty of domestic self-governance, free from false promises of limited autonomy. Of course, this system as with all others has its shortcomings. I too long for an unified Godfreyan imperial state as I experienced in my youth, but we must question at what cost to the central principles of Aesterwald this may come.

You have placed us in a most difficult position with your proposal, for it foreshadows a realization of those same fears of marginalization and limited representation, but there is promise. You allude to a true reformation and empowerment of the Imperial Diet and the Prince-Electors. It is by this manner of reformation that we may reach a healthy compromise that unifies a humanity more free from internal strife, and united in imperial fraternity.

In gratitude towards your willingness to enter into peaceful negotiations, I present you with the following counter-terms on behalf of my sovereign and council:

1. The end to Oreni-Waldenian hostilities.

2. The joining of Aesterwald alongside Oren in an elective and constitutional imperial monarchy in which the reigning imperial crown receives its claim both by the grace of god and the consent of the ruled people, and whose capacity for tyranny is limited by the enfranchisement of electors in an empowered legislative body that guarantees each constituent state true representation in the operation of the imperial state.

3. A guarantee of autonomous self-governance of the constituent states free from infringement by the imperial crown, unless in the literal and direct interpretation of the limited powers granted to it in the founding constitution that will be writ to form it.

4. A reformation of the Prince-Elector system so that only monarchs of modern and legitimate nations may hold the ability to participate in this capacity (as determined by the size and productivity of the body which they govern [[read: quantity of claimed and active plots, and legitimate claim to crown]] ), and those heirs to simple titular kingdoms like myself, de Savoie, Chivay, etc. would not hold equal power to ruling monarchs at the head of nations with legitimate and numerous citizens like the König and yourself, unless they can prove their status as modern nations.

5. To compensate for the disenfranchisement of certain lords from the Prince-Electorate body, and to provide other lords and their banner folk that previously had no influence in the operation of the empire, a representative body composed only of those lords with legitimate feudatories with definite and enforced borders ((read: claimed and active plots)) should be created. This would act as an inferior legislative body to the prince-electors in a bicameral congress that moderates and monitors the crown powers, to escape the tyranny of absolute monarchy, to a degree that can be further negotiated and writ into a foundational constitution.

6. The deimperialization of the present Carrion-ruled state, to be reformed in a manner allowing for a legitimate royal body to rule over it in the same manner as our König rules over us, to create an equal sister state to ours that has the same level of representation in a central government, which would be established as its own imperial body over our nations of Aesterwald and Ruska, in addition to any other Prince-Electorate that has the capacity to prove the legitimacy of its title.

   1. In this new imperial state, your imperial majesty would be permitted to maintain your station, but jointly as Emperor of Oren and King of Ruska, with a distinction between those titles so that there is not an inequity of your local state to ours, and the legitimacy of the imperial crown is preserved free from a monoculture of one dominant kingdom.

7. The contribution of all armed forces of each participant Prince-Electorate to an imperial militia that is responsible for the defense of the empire when in times of war, in the manner of our predecessors in the Imperium Primus.

8. The depoliticization of the centralized imperial privy, so that it does not function as a decision making body in conflict either with the Prince-Electorate legislature, or the inferior Diet legislature composed of the vassal lords, and the resulting repurposement of the privy so that each councilor purely functions as head of his defined task in the stewardship of the empire as was intended, instead of as feuding statesmen. To ensure this, the legislative bodies will be given the power to nominate and appoint the imperial privy councilors, so that the conciliar body does not become a bastion of absolute monarchism.

9. The collaboration of the legislators, men of law, kings, and advisors of our two states in the writing of a single imperial constitution that will be respected and observed in all manners for the continuance of the unified human state, to provide guidance and moderation to all sources of corruption and concentration of ungodly powers.

10. The recognition of the Königreich of Aesterwald as a legitimate kingdom with de jure claim to its land and titles entering into these negotiations.

11. Recognition that violation of the limitations enumerated in the constitution is grounds for secession by constituent states, following proper procedure of notification and giving the imperial state a chance to amend its wrongs.

As with our last proposal, this remains open to negotiation. Bear in mind that both of our nations must make sacrifices, and it may take further negotiation to find this happy medium of agreement. Best wishes to you and yours, and prayers that we may find a middle ground in negotiation that allows us to create a righteous and lasting unified human state.

-A.C. / A.

[Will (TauFirewarrior) 2466]

Edmund speaks up for the Heartlander peoples of humanity

 

"Firstly, you suggest a Highland dominated political system in a population of a nation that is majority Heartlander. Secondly there is no Kingdom of Ruska there is the Kingdom of Renatus a Heartland Kingdom that His Majesty Tobias is King of Renatus and Emperor of Oren, there is no land marked Ruska on the map. I believe there should be more Heartlander say within this 'One Empire'."

[Lago 2572]

Faramith sighs and hold his chin."Term 6 seems really bad."

 

"It reads such at first glance, but what it states is that the Asterwaldians demand the creation of a new title, the King of Ruska, or more accurately, Renatus. This King of Renatus then rules over Renatus, the King of Asterwald rules over Asterwald, and the Emperor of Oren rules over it all. Currently there is no distinction between Emperor of Oren and King of Renatus.

 

Were the Carrions to accept this proposal, Term 6 is actually far more in their interest than in the interest of the Waldenians: should a Waldenian ever assume the title of Emperor without this term they would become the monarch of Renatus also."

 

Firstly, you suggest a Highland dominated political system in a population of a nation that is majority Heartlander.

"I believe it is reasonable to describe the Carrions and the Raevir people as Heartlanders in these times, no?"

[Endovelicus 614]

Kristoff raises a brow. "So the waldonians want to make the empire weaker?...."

[Will (TauFirewarrior) 2466]

"It reads such at first glance, but what it states is that the Asterwaldians demand the creation of a new title, the King of Ruska, or more accurately, Renatus. This King of Renatus then rules over Renatus, the King of Asterwald rules over Asterwald, and the Emperor of Oren rules over it all. Currently there is no distinction between Emperor of Oren and King of Renatus.

 

Were the Carrions to accept this proposal, Term 6 is actually far more in their interest than in the interest of the Waldenians: should a Waldenian ever assume the title of Emperor without this term they would become the monarch of Renatus also."

 

"I believe it is reasonable to describe the Carrions and the Raevir people as Heartlanders in these times, no?"

"Native Renatian and others still maintain the highest population and the Raevir are Highlanders. I respect the Raevir Culture and I respect our Raevir Monarch, however I will not hesitate for a moment to protect the Heartland peoples and customs. The Raevir are not a threat to that but I know nothing on how Waldanians treat the Heartlanders."

[Lago 2572]

"The proposed joint Imperial state in the model of the Imperium Secundus with elements of the Imperium Primus is arranged thus:"

 

"Therefore the Waldenians hold no dominion over the Renatan populace."

[Googlesearch 141]

Maer Sonn Ander of Petrus raises a hand "Wait for the Emperor's decision, There is no use getting words up about it now"

[bungo 3965]

Yuriy frowns at the letter as he makes out the words.

 

"All this will do is make Carrion vote Carrion and Rovin vote Rovin and then we will never vote for Emperor!  We cannot have just two Festinian Electors.  I say we have many Electors, not based on Kingdoms but on Duchies as is now.  Current Empire was formed to allow the rest of the Nobility to have a place, to transform the lands of the Empire to autocratic Kingdom now would not end well...  Tyranny is niet word of Empire today, for Festinian traditions run rampant and these terms would make newfound Kingdom of Renatus bastion of tyranny with zip Festinian Democracia!  Think of Fyodor the Flaccid, what would he say when all form of Festinian Democracy falls?

[Kickstarted and Running 965]

Yuriy frowns at the letter as he makes out the words.

"All this will do is make Carrion vote Carrion and Rovin vote Rovin and then we will never vote for Emperor! We cannot have just two Festinian Electors. I say we have many Electors, not based on Kingdoms but on Duchies as is now. Current Empire was formed to allow the rest of the Nobility to have a place, to transform the lands of the Empire to autocratic Kingdom now would not end well... Tyranny is niet word of Empire today, for Festinian traditions run rampant and these terms would make newfound Kingdom of Renatus bastion of tyranny with zip Festinian Democracia! Think of Fyodor the Flaccid, what would he say when all form of Festinian Democracy falls?

Konrad would agree, as the proposal states if certain heirs to titular nations can prove to be able to support a proper Kingdom they can vote, but that seems impossible as Chivay is but one man now and de Savoie does not have the land to form a kingdom. Dukes and those of a higher status should have a vote, not just kings.

[Eddywilson2 2117]

Tarcell frowns having suggested and made this idea to the King of Aesterwald but a few days ago.

[Aetosion 2062]

"Native Renatian and others still maintain the highest population and the Raevir are Highlanders. I respect the Raevir Culture and I respect our Raevir Monarch, however I will not hesitate for a moment to protect the Heartland peoples and customs. The Raevir are not a threat to that but I know nothing on how Waldanians treat the Heartlanders."

((To prefix this, Lago is correct in saying that the Aesterwaldian government would have no control over the Renatian/Ruskan government. However, if this sort of cultural encroachment worries you, take heed of the fact that my character (drafter of this document, and leading councilor in the Aulic Council on this matter) is among the most Renatian in custom, religion, manner, and raising as they come. I still think this whole Heartlander/Highlander distinction is silly though, and doesn't accurately describe subraces or cultural affiliations within actual RP.))

 

Tarcell frowns having suggested and made this idea to the King of Aesterwald but a few days ago.

((I had no prior knowledge of this while writing the document, but luckily your suggestion was implemented nonetheless.)) 

 

((As for duchies having votes, I think that's a fine idea provided that duchies are given base requirements tied to the number of plots that compose it. Perhaps 2 or 3 depending on the plot size. Note that, in this instance, following demonstration of aptitude for kingship, they would be elevated to Prince-Electorate status, as alluded to in the document. This gives lords more social mobility and ability to influence the empire than the present system. Perhaps it was unclear, but the purpose of that clause was to prohibit old houses that can claim crowns (like my own, Chivay, or de Savoie), but cannot demonstrate that they represent a large body of citizens, from voting on the new emperor. This is, after all, an initial proposal. A good deal of refinement will be needed.))

 

((In re requirement 6, it doesn't increase Carrion power as Lago suggest, nor does it decrease Carrion power. It just draws a legal distinction between the local and imperial states. Legal distinctions and clear definitions are a theme which will become important if a constitution of some sort is implemented.))

 

((Festina was a terribly thought out and implemented system, and does not accurately reflect what we are doing here except that it also contained an intent of the people having representatives. Fear not, I never liked Festina, nor do I intend on seeing its spirit revived.))

[Birdwhisperer 1174]

Moved to the Great Library. It shall be sorted into appropriate category shortly.