Your View: Protagonist Proposition

[Cyndikate 2303]

I'm neutral on this stance. But maybe you can explain how the ascended were failures for players who didn't play in Aegis.

Perhaps we can use that as a learning experience for that future server protagonist.

[MrJoshy 130]

The idea is "okay," in my opinon. There is a lot of different angles that this topic can be seen at, and a protagonist is seen for one story, possibly a series. First, you need to have a set story line taking span over a time, instead of just "going as stuff goes," per say. In my time on the server, and talking with mass amounts of people, it seems that the staff doesn't have a particular story line for one thing to go. If you want a decent protagonist to be driven by the players, you first need an antagonist, a climax, and characters to lead said story. 

You can go all you want at the topic, but there is three things that are needed in any story: Protagonist, Antagonist, and third (most important), a Plan. You need to be able to actually direct the roles of things with little hints here and there, whether it be from the staff or from some random stranger over the internet. 

What I would do in your position is have player driven antagonist, and protagonist, but make it so that there are little hints here and there; driving the players to the overall goal. A plan. You don't have to be entirely involved, but you have to be involved to an extent. Each player is an individual, but the mind is coded in such a way that the most subtle of movements can go noticed; and attract attention.

What you need is a plan of sorts, but not one driven entirely by you. You need a plan that is driven by cooperation between the players and staff alike, and in turn going toward the goal that the community has set. Take a look at George Martin with "A Song of Ice and Fire." He wrote the stories, but as an author, he was taking personalities and simply guiding them in a direction with the sublest of hints. That's all. The personalities were not his, but that of characters that were guided in a certain direction by him.

I like the idea; you just need to have that plan that you hint at. I mean, we are roleplaying a story of sorts, after all. 

Privately message me, Alan, if you want to know more of what I mean. You might not take it, but the player driven protagonist is an idea that I am ecstatic about, and would love to help with. Or something.
 

[Blundermore 2741]

I don't think player run protags would need powerful magic.  They outnumber the antags by so much it makes more sense for them to be less powerful.

 

 

 

It would be nice for the antags to have powerful magic to unite the player base.  Something that really is a threat, destroys things, and makes them seem dangerous.  They should be more powerful than a group of average players, I think.  Some people would probably complain but always winning (and it being too easy) don't really encourage people to cooperate and feel fulfilled when they finally win.  Also, if the bad guy does win, it would be kinda cool (and a change of pace from what I've read) for an evil overlord to take over the world and rule with an iron fist.  Maybe flip things on their head.  Human slaves with orc overlords or dark elf overlords or.... who knows, something different.

 

I know, it sounds crazy.  Sorry :)

Galactic Republic becoming the Galactic Empire essentially? Could be fun. Though I have a feeling some of the nations and their leaders/ Higher ups would probably not take kindly to such an event happening due to the fact that such an event would require them to give up power in order for this event to be a reality. 

[ski_king3 0]

Not a bad idea Ski, that's definitely something we can consider as an alternative. 

Thanks Rittsy, I'm glad to hear it!

[501warhead 1796]

I'm neutral on this stance. But maybe you can explain how the ascended were failures for players who didn't play in Aegis.

Perhaps we can use that as a learning experience for that future server protagonist.

 

I shall do my best to explain this situation as it doubtlessly has an impact here.

 

Origianally, the Ascended were created by a group of 3-4ish players that had come on the heels of PotatoOrgy's videos and had met on another server, PotatoOrgy's survival-creative server Mongoose Country. After building a bit of a town they donated at the time for one of the perks of the higher end of donations - the ability to make your own race. Details and semantics later, their original idea was replaced with what was deemed the 'Ascended', a group of magic users who were the counter-opposite of the 'Undead', the 'Big Bad' as it were.

These original 'Ascended' called themselves Sages, and the Ascended lived in a city called Haven. All public details, but getting into the finer points, the Sages and their ascended were reclusive, and hid away in Haven (which for sometime was hidden in the depths of the wilds at like 2000x 2000z) and would make occasional appearances at battles in order to convey the fight of good vs evil.

Many who interacted with the Ascended from an exterior found them to be (in their opinion) haughty, full of themselves, and 'we're better than you'. It tended to rub the wrong way with a lot of players, who felt as if they were being looked down upon by this group.

Aiding in this the Sages drew a lot of their players from their old server, often giving out ascended and coords to players who got their app accepted on the same day. Feeling pushed aside, resentment gradually formed.

 

This was further supported when these 'Sages' (many of whom got GM or Nation Leader perks) ended up performing the first great Exodus, where in an act which they saw was the right course of action, they Deleted (or Regenerated) the land that was Haven in a large W.E selection and left the server immediately after. Furious at this act, the player base reeled, and those Ascended who were not part of this original group were left to pick up the Pieces. This group formed as the Enlightened, and they ended up trying to fight against the stereotype set in play from the original Ascended.

To a degree they had success, but not nearly enough before Aegis ended and the Ascended fell into the history books.

 

Tl;dr - Ascended were viewed as haughty characters who did not want to interact or deal with the common player. Good lore, just general dislike toward the members of it.

 

As a mention, I personally believe if you combined how the Lances player-base style (recruiting from popular places and enlisting wellknown figures) with the Ascended's structure (survival, decent lore, good builds) I believe the result would be a functioning Protag.

[CosmicWhaleShark 2488]

If you're going to make a protagonist, it needs to be collaborative with the antagonists on an OOC level. They're both two sides of the same coin when it comes to server storyline.

 

In the past protagonists have rarely been seen by players due to whatever reason, however despite their apparent power and expertise, they always failed whenever the descendents were in their hour of need. With that said they never showed up for more than half of the battles as well. Whether this was the fall of Al'khazar and so on or any number of fallen settlements in Anthos, protagonists are to be seen as utter failures considering their lack of pro-active actions in the ways of actually defending the descendants for one, and thwarting the antagonists.

 

This is because no matter how hard the players might actually work to thwart the antagonists - they are left hanging in the wind and forced to mass exodus because of the incompetence of your staff endorsed protagonists.

 

Commend the Ascended or the Golden Lances through RP all you want, from the perspective of any fighting player who went through all the raids, all the battles, the whole war - they didn't do ****. We lost both Aegis and Anthos and the Ascended and Golden Lances deserve little to no thanks.

 

So when you want to have the next antagonist attack a settlement, give the protagonist a heads up too. Give them information to enable them to help build a reputation and reinforce through RP that these guys are actually saving graces. Not Deus Ex "hey staff decided to move the next part of the story along" machinas. Their methods and objectives aside, if the antagonist are going to build a presence and threatening reputation through raids and the like - the protagonists should be doing the same through helping the descendants defend from them - not just showing up whenever the next forum-worthy event is occurring.

 

Also, maybe make multiple antagonist arcs. Don't just have every single server story-line involving a mass exodus. Maybe have them win for once, and then the antagonists either make a comeback or a new one surfaces that's beyond the original protagonists' capabilities.

[Priceflash 832]

Why don't you just allow the players to form their own group against an antagonist?

 

It creates more roleplay and shiz.

 

Trying to take things into your own hands won't turn out as good.

 

Also, how about if we fail to beat the antags, there is major consequences.

 

because afaik eventually it's set in stone that we'll beat the antags at somepoint

but wot if we dunt 4 once

[susitsu 871]

It would be nice for the antags to have powerful magic to unite the player base.  Something that really is a threat, destroys things, and makes them seem dangerous.  They should be more powerful than a group of average players, I think.  Some people would probably complain but always winning (and it being too easy) don't really encourage people to cooperate and feel fulfilled when they finally win.  Also, if the bad guy does win, it would be kinda cool (and a change of pace from what I've read) for an evil overlord to take over the world and rule with an iron fist.  Maybe flip things on their head.  Human slaves with orc overlords or dark elf overlords or.... who knows, something different.

 

I know, it sounds crazy.  Sorry :)

The Undead literally did just that a lot of the time. Sure, wars still happened because people wanted to do them, but the moment The Undead were pressing for ground, everyone was holding a peace council and uniting against The Undead.

 

The classic Undead is actually what at least 95% of what the old players whom I have talked to want. Crazy destructive powers that forced them to be scared. Even my fearless seeming character got wild eyed at the sound of lightning in Aegis when he knew The Undead weren't going to be kind to him.

 

Now on the note of the actual topic at hand...

Or, make a protagonist but he gets defeated from the Antagonist and leaving the players alone. So they must find a way on defeating them with the tools given from the protagonist.

 

They would act only as a guide for the players and really only, not with any badass super magical powers. Afterall the players are the -real- protagonists.

So much this. Such good plot twist yes.

[Temp 2006]

Nah.

 

Keep the dynamics of not having a pre-set Protag that the entire event revolves around.

Allow players to find the weaknesses of the enemies. Allow players to direct all efforts of counter action and allow players to control the pace in which the antag is defeated.

Besides, people get overly atattched to characters meant to be throw-aways for the sake of entertaining others. There's no need to create more 'special' people of past events. I mean, look at the supposedly corrupt things from the antag. What was meant to just be throw-away continues to linger and it's just baffling.

[Aengoth 2890]

It's not needed. Let the players deal with the antags not have these magical beings chosen through some arbitrary ((In all actuality based on popularity and connections)) system. Nobody takes these protag groups seriously and it seems to be largely unwanted. Time and time again the players have managed to create better antag's (Flays) and protag's (Scions, Nations themselves) then the staff.

Just seems like a breeding ground for elitism.

The less intervention by staff on antagonists through the creation of shallow protagonists the better. This issue was painfully apparent when some staff members would force antag's to lose in the past or force certain settlements to be bulldozed by antag's. Not to mention the constant instability of these groups.

[Aedan The Bard 350]

Let players organize themselves as protagonistic forces.

 

This.

Also, let players make their own antagonists, darn it! You're taking all the fun from villains who have potential!

[Lanader - Richard Tarus 197]

Biggest problem is whenever the Antag wins battles, they are called OP. But whenever the good side wins, the antags either need a buff or are extremely weak. It seems to go this way everytime, especially in the beginning. And having a special protagonist group doesn't help too much, if we look at what happened in Aegis. I mean, more coordination will help, of course, but it just adds more elitism.

 

 

 

Edit:

We need a non-scripted storyline, that can go either way whenever a side wins. Like too many battles have been scripted only if one side wins, and it is not very dynamic. But I also like the idea of having multiple antagonists, (and arcs/storylines) and not just one huge major arc for each world. Perhaps like mini arcs as well, when the main antagonists are busy. But all of that aside, I'd really like to see a protagonist group on the good side for awhile, but then they are all corrupted against the good guys, so they'd really have to unite. It'd be really interesting. Just my perspective.

[Lyuin 65]

First off... Ascended being "successful"? They were perhaps the most elite failure of a protagonist the server has ever seen. 

 

 

 

And let player groups create their own protagonist. You don't need some special snowflake group to save the world. Let people becomes the heroes (or villains) in the greater storyline. A pre-established protagonist group only leads to a more scripted storyline (where the staff can instruct a certain group one way or another). 

 

Best way to look at this: the protagonist is the player.

I agree with this. I don't believe we should tell the server WHO the protagonist is. Let them work it out for themselves. 

[monkeypoacher 8055]

You have the term "protagonist" wrong.

The players are their own protagonists. The best a staff group can be is a deuteragonist. Also, inherently good powers are annoying as it means that character can be as much of an ass as they please and say, "y u attack mi I'm protagonist!!!!!"

[Mankaar 166]

Drop the protagonist idea, It's really not that good. Let players pro-tag it up! I would also recommend dropping the ET done antagonists, Et really has no place taking away role-play from regular players. I would like to actually be able to join 4.0's antag without having to be apart of a click or be an ET member.

 

EDIT: Not saying the ET as a whole were taking away role-play. However the scourge were almost completely comprised of ET members which took away some role-play from regular day to day players that could have been quite interesting and dynamic.