Magic Cleanup: Your Thoughts On Subtypes

[ski_king3 0]

Hail friends of Malinor! Today, the LM Team and MAT are working together to ask you about magic. To be fully transparent, we're considering amending or removing different subtypes that are either extraneous or problematic.

 

Remove our magic?! No!!!

Hey there kiddos, don't get your panties in a twist just yet. We want to hear your thoughts, which is why we made this handy dandy thread. If you believe a subtype is problematic from your experience, tell us why. Likewise, if you suspect a subtype to be on the chopping block and think it shouldn't be, give us your reasoning.

 

Our goal here isn't to take things away, it's to make things easier so the magic system is optimal for the server. If people find problems you disagree with, feel free to debate them, but don't take it personally if someone wants to see changes to a magic you use. Our goal is to find solutions and make any changes as smooth as possible, so being cooperative is better than being hostile here, even with critics of your favorite magic. Freaking out isn't going to get you anywhere, especially when there's no guarantee your magic is getting affected.

 

With that, I look forward to hearing your posts. Keep it civil, the staff are watching ;)

[1 1393]

Blood magic needs some major amendments with how it is. It is currently only used by 3 people as far as I am aware, all of higher staff positions. This should not be considered a magic if it is being limited like that.

[hex37 737]

What subtypes are you considering removing?  -Everyone, Probably,

 

 

[Will (TauFirewarrior) 2466]

 

Blood magic needs some major amendments with how it is. It is currently only used by 3 people as far as I am aware, all of higher staff positions. This should not be considered a magic if it is being limited like that.

 

Myself and Moot got taught the Magic before we were on any Staff positions. Its not widely taught because no one wants it turned into what Necromancy and Shade became which was so widely used and became bad.

[Cyndikate 2303]

I think the entire magic system needs to be overhauled and made easier to use because there's no written guidelines on what one can and cannot do which cause terrible attitudes from all sides regarding how one uses magic correctly.

 

Plus, I'd like to see something set up so you don't have to be a part of some special clique or to suck up to X person to get magic. If you're not in a group, your character can't progress. 

[Shadeleaf 1021]

Ive been throwing this around in my head for quite some time: Evocation.

But first a cake metaphor. Cheesecake is a very simple cake, creme-cheese, eggs, sugar, etc. Though it takes time to learn how to make the base by heart, after everything is said and done you can start to experiment. With the same base, you can add cherry, lime, chocolate, hell even coconut if you're feeling weird. Often times it'll turn out the same way, and if it doesn't, only minor adjustments to baking time and proportions are ended.

 

Evocation is cheesecake.

 

This clicked somewhere between year 1 and 1.5 of studying Fire Evocation on Arzota. The connection to the void for an evocationist is a simple one if the mage in question has already mastered an element (here we have the base). Lets take fire for an example in our case, each aspect of the flame is a different ingredient the mage must learn to play with, heat, light, smoke and so on. In studying to master an element an evocationist also learns a great deal of spacial awareness (finesse in making a cake), which can be used to summon their chosen element anywhere from the palm of their hand, to a solid 15-30 ft away if they're experienced.

At such a point, the mage has already mastered the coercion of the void, generating elements and forcing them into reality, and for most this is fine. Yet now lets think if a mage were to wish to spread out in sub-types. Say a fire evocation had began doing experiments with flame's effect on air currents and wished to replicate such things, The mage would but need to learn the nuances of the element, or even a simple effect of evocation they already know how to bring into the world (heat and smoke for example).

With logic in hand, this would ensure the mage needs but study for at most a few years (IG)  before becoming proficient in what could be another subset of an element... By this point you see where this is going, with a basic understanding of the mechanics of evocation, a master mage wouldn't be limited to one element and have to undergo the same process entirely over again for the study of another subtype, thus I propose this:

Instead of having players allow their characters learn at the paces of:

• Fire Evocation (6months)
• Water Evocation (6months)
• Air Evocation (6months)

Turn the process instead to something akin to:

• Fire Evocation(12months) 
• Water Evocation (3months)
• Air Evocation(3months)
• (ETC with decreasing power exponential to type learned)

This would make the learning process and time for the initial evocation much more involved and rp intensive, where each following period of study would add that element to a mage's repitoir at a proficent level. Of course magic rules would still apply, the more elements a mage dabbles in, the more they'll be burdened in terms of power, but that's enough of my rant.

Tl;dr: Increase learning time for first evocation magic, greatly reduce time for each following evocation, evocation is cheesecake.

[hex37 737]

On a more serious note, as the writer of Arcane Puppetry, I'd love to have a chance to Amend this lore so it makes more sense. It got accepted which is nice, but there are some holes in it that need serious clarifying and expanding on. Since I last checked, the LMs have been only accepting strictly humanoid puppets, though the lore was created to be much more diverse, encompassing many different kinds of puppet bodies. Furthermore, I've never had a chance to define the exact process for connecting /to/ a puppet, or the studying required to learn the magic in the first place. It would be much healthier for the lore if I had a chance to expand on these things.

[Ford 1996]

I think the entire magic system needs to be overhauled and made easier to use because there's no written guidelines on what one can and cannot do which cause terrible attitudes from all sides regarding how one uses magic correctly.

 

Plus, I'd like to see something set up so you don't have to be a part of some special clique or to suck up to X person to get magic. If you're not in a group, your character can't progress. 

 

Honestly, then just make friends and be active and get in a group. It's not that hard.

[Joe_Blackman 253]

Myself and Moot got taught the Magic before we were on any Staff positions. Its not widely taught because no one wants it turned into what Necromancy and Shade became which was so widely used and became bad.

**** your pseudo-everything magic

[Lynx 158]

I'd consider blood magic fairly shite as well, to be honest. Haven't seen that old tome since early Athera! 

That's because learning from tomes more often then not leads to bad magic roleplayers. Without guidance and someone telling you yes and no to what you can and can't do leads to heavy power-gaming and confusion more often then not. As well, blood magic has been one of the best magics I've seen used, though if you were not around for the two or three events they did in the last map you wouldn't be expected to know. The magic itself is meant to be rare and used for events more often then not, leading to interesting and unique  encounters better then the run of the mill "Nya! I'm evil and spooky and I'm going to kill you".

[1 1393]

Myself and Moot got taught the Magic before we were on any Staff positions. Its not widely taught because no one wants it turned into what Necromancy and Shade became which was so widely used and became bad.

Well that is easily what it comes off of. And I also would say that it is strange that only there is one ACCEPTED player for it ;D

[Will (TauFirewarrior) 2466]

 

Well that is easily what it comes off of. And I also would say that it is strange that only there is one ACCEPTED player for it ;D

 

I'm accepted for it, but that list is rarely updated it seems. 

[Dohvi 622]

Can you tell us some specific subtypes you're looking at, to focus the discussion a bit more?

[Gone 869]

It's not the magics that are problematic, it's some players. Which is why we have blacklists and applications in the first place. If someone is causing issues with a magic, talk to them. 

 

Altering magic slightly to clarify things in lore is always nice. I'd even be fine with making certain magics take longer to learn or be more difficult to master.

 

But don't cut any. That's just a big middle finger to the characters and players who've worked for years on it. Plus there'd not be any ic reason for why these people suddenly lost their abilities. 

 

Would rather not have another bardmancy incident. 

[1 1393]

I'm accepted for it, but that list is rarely updated it seems. 

Also a specific thread for that. From all of my experiences it is often updated, but I guess they forgot in your case.