Joe_Blackman

In response the people who want a 'morally grey' and sympathetic antagonist, I understand where you're coming from, but that can only get you so far. With Antagonists, we shouldn't be gaining the urge to pat their backs, we should instead be looking to bring them down (or in some cases, side with them). We shouldn't formulate an Antagonist whose only goals and aims are ' ooga booga im evil just because', we should be creating an antagonist whose goals and aims are understandable, hard to criticise, and are overall intriguing. If we're bringing back Iblees, make Iblees more than just a two-dimensional entity hellbent on destruction. Give him some interesting depth that can keep the players engaged rather than threatened/fearful. Giving an antagonist a 'fear factor' will eventually grow stale to the point where this 'fear' will morph into hatred. When something is no longer able to be feared, it either ends up a bother or an eyesore. The Antagonists shouldn't be aiming to be scary or dreadful, they must aim to be engaging, they must be able to open room for character development. Killing and destruction without proper reason is a waste of time and does nothing, especially since people can just come back to life in LoTC. Antagonists should avoid being nothing but an obstacle to players, they should instead function as a stepping stone for the growth of characters and for the enjoyment of players. The staff need to select a potent leader who can comprehend player psychology and be able to appropriately select the players who are fit for the role of 'Antagonist'. During my time as an Undead, some of us didn't receive information about who was going to be Undead. Said Undead, as far as I knew, only carried out generic 'boom-boom' antics and generated a lot of player salt. Like how the others have voted, there was a severe lack of communication and leadership.

I don't think we should have an unforeseen entity messing with the players and the world. If I recall correctly, this has taken place before and as a result (e.g. The Plague we had some few maps ago), we were left with a ton of salt from the players. The Plague hardly contributed to anything and merely functioned as an obstacle to the enjoyment the players wanted to gain. Plagues, natural disasters and the like hold no room for character development themselves, nor will it actually develop our characters in ways which we will desire. I can see some enjoying an antagonist which isn't ran by players, but I also see that a vast majority will end up disliking it over some time. The characters which they have dedicated a lot of time towards are only having their growth and development hindered by some plague which cannot be swayed with intriguing interaction, at best we will only be seeing a few Flavour-Of-The-Month-tier plague doctors who likely won't be as interesting as the other options that are available to function as antagonists. Let's not do this again. I really don't know who else remembers it, but the Plague which was utilised before generated a whole lotta rage. Again, I can see why others will adore plagues and natural disasters. They both serve as reminders of our characters' mortality and our mortality. It also shows how much the universe cares little for our circumstances, therefore this justifies that we must work together in order to combat this blight, this common enemy. Or alternatively, it may open up room for unexpected developments such as those in high power abruptly falling ill from the Plague (and perhaps dying, allowing for others to take advantage of that), or their settlement's fortifications may be affected greatly by natural disasters, allowing for more activities such as raids and ruination. It may actually instil fear within players and keep us constantly alert. However, if this truly is the case, then I believe not many will enjoy it as much as they think they will. We, as players engaging in this means of this fantasy-fulfillment, are selfish. Myself included. We will likely not want our growths put on hold due to some forgettable unfortunate circumstance which is dubbed as an 'Antagonist'. To expand, plagues and natural disasters have no mouth to speak, they don't have bodies which can be simply attacked, they cannot sway us in interesting ways, nor will they be able to sway us interesting ways. They lack emotion. They cannot form pacts, they cannot mentally manipulate, they cannot organise raids, they cannot create further developments among others or themselves. If it does breed further development, it will only worsen to the point where we, like I said similarly, will get salty as ****. Akin to theists who believe that anything unforeseen such as plagues, natural disasters and the like are the work of 'God', we as players will shift blame to the staff and ET if we feel as though we and/or others have been singled out by this unforeseen 'Antagonist'. They are ultimately not interesting, only threatening. The only thing that can be interesting is the mystery behind it, and even then that will die down, as a considerable chunk of people will realise that they may not have the power to defeat the menace that is an earthquake, or a flesh-eating virus without the help of some very experienced alchemist who can only be found in some distant location, whose player might not be on when you want them to. I only write this as a bit of an analysis and a forewarning to those who want things such as the world turning against them. From my experience, I've seen it happen before, it's not fun. I'm also a biased piece of ****, so I'll say go with Iblees and Undead as that's currently tied as of now as I type. However, they weren't so perfect either. They had their major flaws. Certain players kept being obnoxious, especially those associated with the 'Destruction sect'. They were just as bad as what I described in my previous paragraphs, they only existed to actually bring ruination and nothing else but that. There was no development from them, they only brought destruction to what others were working so hard towards. Iblees isn't ****, it's the one who holds the puppet strings attached to him. What we instead should be doing, is at least trying to mimic the endeavours of the 'Corruption sect'. They were fairly weak Undead who lacked the ability to curbstomp as hard as the rest, what they did do, however, was act behind the scenes and try to manipulate unsuspecting individuals. I operated as one of the Undead under the Corruption sect. By being a more verbal Undead who sought to share elaborated perspectives, encourage mild pacifist attitudes, and provide false hopes, I had managed to (somehow) form a pact of neutrality with the Druids and convince others that Iblees was actually a good Spook. In addition, others within the Corruption sect (if I recall correctly) had managed to take over a settlement with their limited abilities in destruction alone, without using boom-boom powers to bring ruination. These developments allowed for minimal player salt. Again, the Undead and Iblees' themselves aren't ****, it's the one who is leading them and playing as them. Next time, staff, try to locate those who are more fit for the job of playing an Antagonist whose reputation has hit the shitter lately.

yo i helped too

**** my autism im going to make some edits to some replies i made being buzzed

I concur. Personally, I don't know how such a magic would be dispensed among others and allow for extra lore-spells to be made, it really does come off as odd to me (especially since it's a magic granted from Iblees himself. I doubt he'd give his **** out like free candy). I personally believe that the magic should not cease alongside the antagonist, especially if it allows for development of one's character and development of many others' characters, spawning unique character interaction. Like how I had stated to Whymsical, the magic itself isn't the only thing that should be viewed, then exclusively judged. The magic (not the entirety of the lore, mind you) is mostly there to indicate that the presence of Iblees is displaying itself once again. I do appreciate that you have taken a liking to my writing, however. I will go into detail how 'originality' is overrated at this point in time, but that's another subject for another time. Oversimplifying things will of course, make them seem utterly akin to other magics which currently exist. While you are right about the magics of this lore being similar to other magics that currently exist within LoTC, you also happen to be incorrect about 'nothing unique' being present within this magic. If you were to read through the magics spells once again, you will be able to identify that the magics bear different properties from other magic spells that are currently implemented. The healing spell, for example, doesn't entirely heal every ailment inflicted upon a user of the dark arts, it also happens to leave repugnant scars upon their recently recovered wounds. Also, your 'conjuration, but it makes spooks' argument is also asinine since that argument can be applied to Second Generation Necromacy and other magics that exist in LoTC. Again, you are not incorrect about the magic being "'x' but spooky". However, the "spooky" adjective you had mentioned, makes everything different. The stated adjective grants every magic spell different properties, making them distinctive from other magic spells. Your "it's like 'x' but 'adjective'" argument can be applied to manifold magics that currently exist within LoTC anyway. Yes, every magic within this server is not original, however, different spells having different properties can bring forth different reactions from different characters, thus spawning the 'unique' things that you seek. Edit: Additionally, the spells are behind a deity too, while the spells aren't all too unique, there's a purpose behind their existence and because of this, the roleplay it will formulate will be distinctive. A magic doesn't have to be 100% unique to be accepted. Besides, this magic is focused on both Aegis Undead magic, and Athera Undead magic. It's already indicated in the lore that it's not 'unique' anyway. These were 100% ripped from the original Undead lores, they were made weaker and sadly, as a result, somewhat less unique (or 'original', so to say) for the purpose of balance and enjoyability. Does that make sense? I won't lie, I'm a bit tired as I type this, so I want to ensure that I got my point across to you as properly as possible. edit: made edits to certain replies so they make more sense and I look less dumb

fam what do you mean by "every other magic in the server forced together with duct tape, thrown into a blender..." have you seen the vanilla Undead Magic spell list (I guarantee you haven't since it was exclusive to Undead members)? I'm not trying to appear passive-aggressive. But, just consider, for a moment. This form of magic is quite different compared to other magics and their spells, if you were to partially disregard the summoning spells. Each spell sustains different properties from other spells in this server. Also, if the 'spells' alone are allowing you to determine its 'pointlessness', then I suggest you look more into the lore submission once again. There are other things of value aside from the power it holds.

Just to clarify, this magic is based on the first OG Necromancy, I was informed by manifold individuals that I must not name it "First Generation Necromancy" since it will bring about befuddlement. Thus, I decided to refer to it as "Vocomancy" so no one would be confused. However, you aren't wrong, it does share similarities with necromancy. Additionally, this lore submission isn't for characters (who aid iblees) to go "grr arrghh im with Iblees fear me" it's more for the character development and the eccentric RP scenarios it can bring. Don't get me wrong, I can totally see why you wouldn't enjoy it, I'm just giving reason behind this lore and its purpose. Imo, I can see the implementation of this lore adding many things to RP and to one's character development, but those explanations belong in PMs most likely. I'll gladly inform you with my ideas of what could take place within RP, if you like.

thanks fam