Your View: TA changes.

[Song Druid 1486]

You're already limited to 5 magics, no one is going around with '100s'.

It was an example of course.

The system is only "flawed" when attempting to force it into some existing guidelines outside of what already exists.  We do not want the magic spread out far and wide because it is strong in the wrong hands.   It is a closed Order and it has a strong culture established in Lore.  It isn't changing.

I'm going to use you as an example for druids because I think it's perfect. You have every magic that druids can learn as to teach, this is just the example of why it has to be regulated and open up for more teachers to do so, train their students to be better and be able to teach others faster. Just what I am talking about. 

 

Edit: Why can't people devote more time to one or two areas instead of the full package.

It IS regulated.  By us.  And we have done a good job of it.  

[Birdwhisperer 1174]

The average player doesn't care or see magic because it's either being done in some remote jerk circle of gms and the other staff  (*cough Paladins and necromancers cough*) I mean it's literally an army of heerozeros who will do anything for magic power and staff power on a minecraft role play server

As a magic RPer, I rarely if ever see magic RP being done outside my own with random folk. Also tbh the more I read this the more I think it over. Not necessarily what it is or will be doing, but rather the idea of it. I will use druids for example (No hate I like you all) they have like 4 different magic subtypes in all of druidism and each leader is skilled in the majority of them if they know all four (Including Shadeshifting) now I think people are missing what they are saying, atleast from what i've read in that you guys are saying that a druid must be able to teach communion plus other magics to be a teacher. Though why is that? Being a teacher doesn't mean you are a strongest at something, it just means OOCly you're able to teach it. So the idea of atleast in groups of having different members only being able to teach certain things in a group I do like. So instead of having like 4 or 5 druids who are able to teach all types of the magic. Instead why not have 7 or 8 druids that specialize in certain forms of druidism? Also, why is communion even a subtype. Imo druidism should just be considered one magic in itself (Minus shapeshifting) but being like bnk wants Arcanism to be where you can specialize in the different forms of them. As for other groups of magic users just do similar things. Though this is just an opinion I wanted to express don't hate!

I think you have a misconception on how druidism works. We don't choose 5 people to teach everything, individuals simply learn what they are interested in and some will go on to become teachers in it. Many druids only learn/teach one subtype of healing, but all of them HAVE to be able to teach Communion. The reason Communion is considered a subtype is because we had to force druidism to fit the MAT rules. Normally Communion and Control would be separate subtypes, but for the purposes of the application they're lumped into one (Druidism) so druids aren't screwed over even more. Your suggestion isn't a bad one, however it would require rewriting druidism or the magic rules to fit each other (AGAIN).

 

[Song Druid 1486]

 

 

Here is how druid magic works:

To learn the magic, you need to be attuned to the Aspects. This attunement is represented by the Communion subtype. Your Communion is your attunement, you cannot be any better with any druid subtype than your Communion, because you can't have any abilities in excess of the strength of your connection to the Aspects. Communion provides some super basic abilities that form the foundation of the rest of druid magic. Control offers the bread and butter bulk of what druid magic does. You want to grow a tree? This is where that ability comes from. Blight healing and Nature's healing are more specialized, building off the basics learned in learning Control.

This is a very tightly integrated magic with dependencies. In this way, it is unlike other magics, it also means the magic is moreso hurt by rules like this. When a magic is a tightly integrated as this, being unable to teach foundational parts so you can teach the more specialized forms really, really hurts.

So..basically why not have it so that you have communion then you choose a sub type to focus on? If you want to heal then you heal. If you want to blight heal you blight heal. If you wanna be a feral druid with beast dps then you go shapeshifting. I really do not see why you are so fuzzy about it. What Arik or whatever is saying is just plain **** that druids don't want to make more teachers. Then honestly if you put yourself in this spot, deal with it. Simple as that. No point babysitting.

This is f(_)cking rich.  The only reason it's anywhere near as bad as it is now is because of the stupid MAT in the first place.  Any guide used to be able to teach the magic because they are the teachers.  Now they have to have a TA accepted.  Along with other useless trivialities that the MAT has implemented to make things that more convoluted for the Druids to pass on their knowledge to the next generation.  The fact of the matter here is we don't have to explain ourselves or how we regulate to you or anyone else because we have done a good job of it so far and the only ones who haven't are the rest of the server and the MAT (who change things EVERY FEW MONTHS because they don't know what works).

[Booklight12 481]

 

My friend, not to sound rude but you need to calm down a bit. We can debate this civilly, and in another thread. This is not the bash the druids thread and I think you are taking the mats decision personally, as I doubt they were targeting you or even the druids specifically. Now, the thread is becoming derailed. If we wanna talk about druids let there be a separate topic on it. This is specifically to talk about feedback on the Mats' decision and whether we like it or not. (Not just you but others who are derailing the thread)

[AlmondTree 418]

The average player doesn't care or see magic because it's either being done in some remote jerk circle of gms and the other staff  (*cough Paladins and necromancers cough*) I mean it's literally an army of heerozeros who will do anything for magic power and staff power on a minecraft role play server

As a magic RPer, I rarely if ever see magic RP being done outside my own with random folk. Also tbh the more I read this the more I think it over. Not necessarily what it is or will be doing, but rather the idea of it. I will use druids for example (No hate I like you all) they have like 4 different magic subtypes in all of druidism and each leader is skilled in the majority of them if they know all four (Including Shadeshifting) now I think people are missing what they are saying, atleast from what i've read in that you guys are saying that a druid must be able to teach communion plus other magics to be a teacher. Though why is that? Being a teacher doesn't mean you are a strongest at something, it just means OOCly you're able to teach it. So the idea of atleast in groups of having different members only being able to teach certain things in a group I do like. So instead of having like 4 or 5 druids who are able to teach all types of the magic. Instead why not have 7 or 8 druids that specialize in certain forms of druidism? Also, why is communion even a subtype. Imo druidism should just be considered one magic in itself (Minus shapeshifting) but being like bnk wants Arcanism to be where you can specialize in the different forms of them. As for other groups of magic users just do similar things. Though this is just an opinion I wanted to express don't hate!

I think you have a misconception on how druidism works. We don't choose 5 people to teach everything, individuals simply learn what they are interested in and some will go on to become teachers in it. Many druids only learn/teach one subtype of healing, but all of them HAVE to be able to teach Communion. The reason Communion is considered a subtype is because we had to force druidism to fit the MAT rules. Normally Communion and Control would be separate subtypes, but for the purposes of the application they're lumped into one (Druidism) so druids aren't screwed over even more. Your suggestion isn't a bad one, however it would require rewriting druidism or the magic rules to fit each other (AGAIN).

 

Well then it's also an MAT issue that communion is in-fact a sub type which to me sounds like it should not. Understandable but over all this might have messed things with druids but it's still something that is good for the bigger picture server wise.

 

This is f(_)cking rich.  The only reason it's anywhere near as bad as it is now is because of the stupid MAT in the first place.  Any guide used to be able to teach the magic because they are the teachers.  Now they have to have a TA accepted.  Along with other useless trivialities that the MAT has implemented to make things that more convoluted for the Druids to pass on their knowledge to the next generation.  The fact of the matter here is we don't have to explain ourselves or how we regulate to you or anyone else because we have done a good job of it so far and the only ones who haven't are the rest of the server and the MAT (who change things EVERY FEW MONTHS because they don't know what works).

Take a breather, you are losing a magic or two..not a limb..

All I'm saying is that the way you teach sounds flawed to begin with, I see a lot of teachers available but of course I am not into druidism but it feels like it's not as bad as you claim it to be. Feels to be that this can be done by you guys simply arranging certain teachers to certain areas instead of being universal and being worse than having someone devote more time to one rather than four.

https://gyazo.com/1964ad335cbd1963dbedcf5a35043663
https://gyazo.com/0842399fedc995d8ab9536758f09f019
https://gyazo.com/e2e1a19db4bab4df64f7fa72f0f59837
https://gyazo.com/7977b5d5cfcbafe7f49f85671ee21ad9

[Song Druid 1486]

I'm not even a Healing Teacher, IDK why my name is on that list.  But outside of shapeshifting I am only a teacher of 2 subtypes (thanks for the screenshots).  I'll make sure my name is removed from the Healing list.  Arik is not a powerful healer.

 

But this is (once again) just useless, MMO style crap that has no place on a RP server.    I am just so sick of dealing with this, as are my peers.  I'm sick of dealing with the MAT.  I'm sick of having the Lore Masters combing over Druid Lore trying to verify if it was ever accepted or some bullshit attempt to balance artifacts as if this is some damn MMORPG.  I'm beyond tired of having the exact same discussion with different MAT members ever 6-8 months because the team changes hands so much and the exact same issues come up that I had to go over in the past.  It's disorganized, it's indecisive, and it's ineffective.  

[Mephistophelian 977]

As said before, it will simply make people pick one certain magic. More people will pick said magic because it is popular, and fewer people will pick the more obscure, less popular magics. This, in turn, makes it so there are fewer teachers. Fewer of anything makes it closer to a clique than not. 

Look at blood magic though, recovering pretty good at the moment because..effort.

Yes, I agree! I applaud them! How is this relevant, though?

[Song Druid 1486]

The average player doesn't care or see magic because it's either being done in some remote jerk circle of gms and the other staff  (*cough Paladins and necromancers cough*) I mean it's literally an army of heerozeros who will do anything for magic power and staff power on a minecraft role play server

As a magic RPer, I rarely if ever see magic RP being done outside my own with random folk. Also tbh the more I read this the more I think it over. Not necessarily what it is or will be doing, but rather the idea of it. I will use druids for example (No hate I like you all) they have like 4 different magic subtypes in all of druidism and each leader is skilled in the majority of them if they know all four (Including Shadeshifting) now I think people are missing what they are saying, atleast from what i've read in that you guys are saying that a druid must be able to teach communion plus other magics to be a teacher. Though why is that? Being a teacher doesn't mean you are a strongest at something, it just means OOCly you're able to teach it. So the idea of atleast in groups of having different members only being able to teach certain things in a group I do like. So instead of having like 4 or 5 druids who are able to teach all types of the magic. Instead why not have 7 or 8 druids that specialize in certain forms of druidism? Also, why is communion even a subtype. Imo druidism should just be considered one magic in itself (Minus shapeshifting) but being like bnk wants Arcanism to be where you can specialize in the different forms of them. As for other groups of magic users just do similar things. Though this is just an opinion I wanted to express don't hate!

I think you have a misconception on how druidism works. We don't choose 5 people to teach everything, individuals simply learn what they are interested in and some will go on to become teachers in it. Many druids only learn/teach one subtype of healing, but all of them HAVE to be able to teach Communion. The reason Communion is considered a subtype is because we had to force druidism to fit the MAT rules. Normally Communion and Control would be separate subtypes, but for the purposes of the application they're lumped into one (Druidism) so druids aren't screwed over even more. Your suggestion isn't a bad one, however it would require rewriting druidism or the magic rules to fit each other (AGAIN).

 

Well then it's also an MAT issue that communion is in-fact a sub type which to me sounds like it should not. Understandable but over all this might have messed things with druids but it's still something that is good for the bigger picture server wise.

 

This is f(_)cking rich.  The only reason it's anywhere near as bad as it is now is because of the stupid MAT in the first place.  Any guide used to be able to teach the magic because they are the teachers.  Now they have to have a TA accepted.  Along with other useless trivialities that the MAT has implemented to make things that more convoluted for the Druids to pass on their knowledge to the next generation.  The fact of the matter here is we don't have to explain ourselves or how we regulate to you or anyone else because we have done a good job of it so far and the only ones who haven't are the rest of the server and the MAT (who change things EVERY FEW MONTHS because they don't know what works).

Take a breather, you are losing a magic or two..not a limb..

I am calm.  Despite the words I use I'm just the kind of guy who never minces words.  But I will repeat once again, the Druids are not acknowledging this rule.  Whatsoever in any shape form or fashion.  The GMs are certainly free to systematically place bans on all attuned Druids if they feel that will solve the issue...

[AlmondTree 418]

The average player doesn't care or see magic because it's either being done in some remote jerk circle of gms and the other staff  (*cough Paladins and necromancers cough*) I mean it's literally an army of heerozeros who will do anything for magic power and staff power on a minecraft role play server

As a magic RPer, I rarely if ever see magic RP being done outside my own with random folk. Also tbh the more I read this the more I think it over. Not necessarily what it is or will be doing, but rather the idea of it. I will use druids for example (No hate I like you all) they have like 4 different magic subtypes in all of druidism and each leader is skilled in the majority of them if they know all four (Including Shadeshifting) now I think people are missing what they are saying, atleast from what i've read in that you guys are saying that a druid must be able to teach communion plus other magics to be a teacher. Though why is that? Being a teacher doesn't mean you are a strongest at something, it just means OOCly you're able to teach it. So the idea of atleast in groups of having different members only being able to teach certain things in a group I do like. So instead of having like 4 or 5 druids who are able to teach all types of the magic. Instead why not have 7 or 8 druids that specialize in certain forms of druidism? Also, why is communion even a subtype. Imo druidism should just be considered one magic in itself (Minus shapeshifting) but being like bnk wants Arcanism to be where you can specialize in the different forms of them. As for other groups of magic users just do similar things. Though this is just an opinion I wanted to express don't hate!

I think you have a misconception on how druidism works. We don't choose 5 people to teach everything, individuals simply learn what they are interested in and some will go on to become teachers in it. Many druids only learn/teach one subtype of healing, but all of them HAVE to be able to teach Communion. The reason Communion is considered a subtype is because we had to force druidism to fit the MAT rules. Normally Communion and Control would be separate subtypes, but for the purposes of the application they're lumped into one (Druidism) so druids aren't screwed over even more. Your suggestion isn't a bad one, however it would require rewriting druidism or the magic rules to fit each other (AGAIN).

 

Well then it's also an MAT issue that communion is in-fact a sub type which to me sounds like it should not. Understandable but over all this might have messed things with druids but it's still something that is good for the bigger picture server wise.

 

I am calm.  Despite the words I use I'm just the kind of guy who never minces words.  But I will repeat once again, the Druids are not acknowledging this rule.  Whatsoever in any shape form or fashion.  The GMs are certainly free to systematically place bans on all attuned Druids if they feel that will solve the issue...

Stop being so rebellious and deal with it like you should. With arguments and suggestions. Not acting like a damn five year old crossing his arms because you didn't get the cookie jar. Druids are in no way above the law.

[Song Druid 1486]

Your can construe it however you want.  And you are free to view me as a rebellious child if you choose.  It doesn't change how we feel every time the MAT rears its ugly head with another set of dumb rules or changes.

[Hydra 515]

;-; calm down guys this is just a game, I have already stated my opinions on this above so no, also magic is not mid-maxing if I wanted to midmax ill buy a 2000$ gaming computer and play a few hours of oc.tc and get good at pvp, mid-maxing is making your character the best possibly and since pvp default was implemented mages lot a majority of their power.

Anyhow I think the mat is trying to solve the magic problem with duck tape and Band-Aids, this is just another Band-Aid on the whole problem itself that no one seems to want to address, the problem of the entire magic system itself is daunting and many lms and mat are biased with their own specific magic that they made or are leading.

 

[Katherine1 362]

How Druidism works ideally:

Dedicants are trained by Druid Guides and become Druids. Becoming a Druid grants Communion. Druids learn magic from said Druid guides (And sometimes Heirophants). If a druid wishes to teach, they can be trained and made a Druid Guide. Archdruids basically oversee this and make sure it all runs smoothly. Heirophants are retired druids that don't do much with the Order anymore.

How Druidism works with the MAT involved:

Dedicants are trained by Druid Guides and become Druids. Becoming a Druid doesn't grant Communion because you need a teacher and MA for that. Druids learn Magic from only some guides (and sometimes Heirophants) because not all guides are able to meet the requirements for a TA. Archdruids still do their Archdruidy thing. Heirophants, being retired, are generally not terribly active, so even though they help cover the TA gap created by MAT rules, they aren't exactly a high teaching load group of teachers.

And with this new rule:

Now the number of teachers for a given subtype is even further reduced, as the available teachers have to limit what they can teach to well below what the MAT says they can know. 

[Gone 869]

This new rules is dumb and no one likes it, not even staff as shown by this thread. Can we remove it already before it starts doing damage and making the cliques stronger? And give a long stare at whoever came up with it in the first place? 

[Eranikus 348]

>MAT places rule to limit how many magics can be learned in an attempt to improve RP

>>Some people have to drop magics they've been rping for years, restricting their rp
>>Some people have to entirely reform their character, restricting their rp
>>Some people who would have normally been able to master the entirety of the magics available to them in the case of deity magics now have to pick and choose what they get good at, restricting their rp

>MAT updates rule on magics to limit also how much they can teach

>>Some people have to willingly forfeit teaching applications, restricting their rp
>>>As a result of this some people now have to find new teachers for their magic, restricting their rp until they find someone new to teach the magic for ooc reasons
>>Some people can't apply for further teaching applications that they would have applied for, restricting their ability to spread that knowledge ic and by connection their rp and the rp of others

>MAT is trying to improve the rp on the server and reduce magic 'cliques'

Then... stop limiting how much you can teach so that the clique can be allowed to expand instead of caving in on itself so you can remove the magic like Contract Magic and Arcane Puppetry were removed, the removal of which has also restricted and damaged existiing rp?

This new rules is dumb and no one likes it, not even staff as shown by this thread. Can we remove it already before it starts doing damage and making the cliques stronger? And give a long stare at whoever came up with it in the first place? 

Also this?

[AlmondTree 418]

This new rules is dumb and no one likes it, not even staff as shown by this thread. Can we remove it already before it starts doing damage and making the cliques stronger? And give a long stare at whoever came up with it in the first place? 

Considering the fact that it is YOU the player that creates these cliques even BEFORE this system was in place you could have simply done something against it before MAT felt the need to step in. Because of player X being sheltered and not spreading their teachings thet put themselves in this situation.