Clerical Wards - Feedback Required

[Farryn 860]

Already I can hear the sounds of screeching and mental dying noises from triggered people at the mere mention of wards.

 

Okay. I have been working on the clerical magic rewrite for some time and this is the one area I have been constantly been scratching my head about. For a while, clerical wards have been popping up around the current map and with them, a tidal wave of complaints and feedback posts flowing through the forums which I have tried to keep up with. However I am now set on handling wards so I have decided to set up this post for feedback on the clerical wards. Although do note that I am typing this from a phone due to no laptop, so there may be spelling errors or a strangd layout. I apologise in advance for such.

 

'But Farryn, why don't you just read one of the previous feedback posts instead of posting another one!' - well I have and frankly, they are a mess. Everything is thrown around and its hard for me to keep track of where everything is and going. Any important key points are lost within the spiral of arguments and posts where people just say 'remove the magic' rather than actually give useful feedback. This is a more offical feedback thread where I can collect any feedback easily and keep tabs on whats being said. Plus this gives me a chance to properly explain the current warding system to people and see their views once they know how the current system operates.

 

That said. I will explain the current warding system now through bullet points from the current lore written by Ventusyr. I will explain some of the points that may confuse people not familiar with clerical magic.

● A Cleric imbunes the land with light, forming a holy ward that acts as a shield against taint, unholy magic, and evil beings, attempting to stop them from crossing over.

● When a dark being attempts to cross over a ward, they will be met with immense pain as thd light of the ward contacts them. This pain is like being bathed within fire.

● Land within a clerically warded area can exhibit certain and strange magical traits: light in the four archetype colours (blue, white, gold, and silver) may flit around the area, nature may grow in an unusual yet fantastical way (e.g: trees growing faster or unusual coloured plants), and a mix of calmness and warmth will emit from such area.

● Wardz have charges that can become exhausted (batteries essentially). If enough dark/unholy energies are put against the ward, the ward can break and be rended useless.

● Wards can have more and more energy added to them with each increasing recharge session; the upper limit to thd amount that can be stored is unclear.

● Different tier clerics can imbune greater amounts of power into a ward. A cleric must choose between size and strength of a ward; the larger the ward, the more power is spread out thus the weaker the ward will be. And vise versa: the smaller the ward, the less power is spread out so the ward will be stronger.

● This is only applicable to one cleric casting a warding spell in one attempt: they can spend multiple sessions imbuning an area with energy and strenghening a ward. How much energy is present is up to the creator of the ward.

● As one would expect, the larger the ward, the more sessions it would have to take to get it on the same strength level as a smaller ward. Furthermore a large ward recently placed up wi be weaker than a large ward that has been recharged up to 4 times (four ooc weeks).

 

Already there are some areas of this system that I am unsure of. Such as no limited power on how much energy a ward can hold, along with no full explaination as to what dark beings and dark magics can be affected by the ward. However, the lore does not stats that a dark being walking through a ward wi be stopped by an invisable barrier, rather that they can go through but they will be met with extreme pain that I doubt anyone can endure with a poker face. Besides we are talking about a ward made of light, clerics cannot make physical objects that are stationary and only stops dark beings. We can make orbs and weapons (for the time being) but they are not stationary. Thats one myth just debunked.

 

Next is the tier system regarding warding, which explains what tier cleric can make a particular sized ward from where they are currently.

● Tier one - A cleric can create a ward that protects the entrances of homes and simple doors. (Wards that can fit into a door frame)

● Tier two - A cleric can create a ward that is large enough to protect a small room.

● Tier three - A cleric can create a ward that protects the area of a campsite (or a small house).

● Tier four - A cleric can create a ward that protects a large house.

● Tier five - A cleric can create a ward that surrounds a settlement consisting of a few houses. By the time they have been learning how to create a ward for a year, a cleric can creare a ward large enougb to protect a small villags.

 

Thats the current system and yes, there are flaws in it. Such as lack of explainations in certain parts, or parts where you have to guess the sizes since they can vary. I already got a few ideas on which flaws to fix, although feedback from non-cleric users is most appricated.

 

'Buttt Farryn. We hate wards, why dont you just remove them entirely so everyone is happy?'

Originally that was my main idea - remove clerical wards as a whole. However, looking over the cleric lore and hearing from some people, I decided not to. My main point being is that with the cleric lore being readjusted and the clerics being more focused on limiting impurity and stopping it, than heavily relying on fight-kill-repeat, wards are a valuable concept that fits with this focus as they do protect towns and people from dark beings who may attack. Furthermore, warding helps give clerics some power that keep them relatively equal with dark beings and dark mages in a scale of power, although the current system for warding is heavily overpowered. I do not want to remove an aspect that makes the clerics more vulnerabld and useless, I do not want the clerics to just be healers and to have a few more roles that ties with their IC mission - keeping purity by stopping wounds and tainted beings. So instead I am going to rework the wards to make them balanced on both sides and are more easier to understand.

 

I already have a list planned out for this:

● Rework clerical wards and make an offical guide on how the wards work for all users. This guids will include explaintion of IC and OOC mechanics and what warding is.

●  Work on IC and OOC mechanics that satsify both holy users, dark users, and normal users.

● Rework the tier system and define what tier dark mages can and cannot destroy  a particular ward.(E.G: A tier one Necromancer can destroy a tier one/newly created ward but not a tier 5/5 week old ward.)

● Find a way to prevent wards appearing in every single city and settlement, as well preventing a ward being swiftly remade after being destroyed.

 

Thats me done rambling and now heres where you all come in. I need feedback in these areas and there is no limit in how much you can give. Just no posts telling me to downright remove the wards, since removing something can sometimes do mors bad than good for a group of people. This is what I need to know:

● What type of roleplay does wards create and stop? (I have heard people say wards stop RP so I want to know what type of RP wards create and stop).

● Positive feedback of current system - Does it provide a clear understanding of how wards work? What do you like about wards?

● Negative feedback of current system - What are the flaws you see with this system? Does it appear one sided, etc?

● Any recommendations on how wards should be/operate -Do not say remove. I refuse to acknowledge such as feedback.

● Additional notes.- just for anything else you want to add about this situation.

 

I will very much appricate the feedback given, even though I cant give much back aside from trying to fix this ongoing issue and provide better roleplay for both holy and dark users aliks. So thank you for giving me feedback, and heres to hoping I get a new laptop charger soon!

 

Have a great day!

[wytch 870]

I've always liked wards, people seem to have issues of when they've been recharged though, like figuring out if they've been recharged yet. Though that's just what I've noticed, is the triggered darkies trying to convince people their wards haven't been recharged.

 

So possibly find a way to fix that? Have expiration dates on signs or whatever?

[OzYmandi 647]

As a Graven, I absolutely despise wards.

But they are necessary!

I'm a 'righteous' graven as K0llu likes to call me, since my task is to slay criminals and evil-doers, so I reckon they are necessary.

 

Still, they burn.

 

Make them only painful, and not BURNING PAINFUL and I'll like them!

[Archbishop 1784]

I mean the wood elves having like 3 seperate wards is way too much.

[ToodIes 1575]

4 minutes ago, A Moongazer said:

I mean the wood elves having like 3 seperate wards is way too much.

That's actually the Suticans right now-- the wood elves don't have any.

 

Anyway, yeah. Cleric wards don't really do much towards creating RP; in my experience, dark creatures are more likely to just go around it or avoid it entirely due to a cleric doing some emotes at the ground. It's also difficult to tell how powerful they are, how long they'll last, and how they can be broken-- a rewrite would be great for that.

[Charles_Grimlie 1072]

I say there just needs to be an enforced cap on how many wards can be made, specifically each ward trained Cleric can only make and maintain one ward at a time rather than the current fiasco of wards everywhere.

 

Also, if the system were to be changed I'd say that any evil crossing the barrier should be branded (perhaps the mark could be covered) or illuminated by the ward rather than causing them discomfort.

- To expand on branding I believe the mark should be a glowing inscription, perhaps the higher level the ward the more potent the brand (via size & gross incandescence) while the Spook is within the area.

 

I also wish to note that certain Xan Paladins have been destroying wards, some how, and with no official lore on the matter they've been illegally destroying them, for reasons unknown ICly. 

[Wendigo 786]

My only complaint is how large they can get IE covering an entire small  town seems like a bit too much, and not having expiration dates on the sign. Yeah it's nice knowing when it was charged but a majority of people(including myself) have no idea how long they last.

[WuHanXianShi14 0]

45 minutes ago, A Moongazer said:

I mean the wood elves having like 3 seperate wards is way too much.

We have one ward and it isnt even charged.

 

We charged it when the spooks were literally a daily nuisance that we had to deal with once every 24 hours because we didn't like having to do the same conflict over and over every day.

 

But now the spooks don't come so much (which if that is a conscious effort its actually genuinely appreciated no snarkiness here) and we can RP with them individually at managable frequencies we dont bother charging the ward.

 

Of course, now Sutica seems to be warded up the ass because right now it seems to be the city that the spooks seem to be troubling the most, I dont actually RP there but I'm told its nearly daily (I could be wrong).

 

If a group forces people to have to deal with them to the point of redundancy and chore then people are more likely to throw up blanket solutions to keep you out entirely as opposed to dealing with you individually.

 

...funny how that works

[Runabarn 1028]

I'd much rather see wards removed entirely and replaced with something else. As it stands, wards are unclear at best and they add nothing of value to roleplay. Quite the opposite they prevent roleplay and there's no denying that fact. As much as certain region owners love to have their safezones protected by OOC barriers and fervently defend them, it's still detrimental to roleplay.

 

 

You yourself said that these wards are the one big problem you're facing. That's because they are a flawed concept. You're much better off getting rid of them and finding something else to fill the gap. Or rework them entirely. Here are a few suggestions.

 

-Make wards not ridiculously massive in size and allow dark beings to cross them unharmed, but it dispels any disguises they may be using and makes them glow in a distinctive manner. That way spooks can choose to go into a protected area, at the cost of having their true nature revealed and face possible retaliation.

 

 

-Instead of warding off entire cities and preventing roleplay, see about giving guards imbued weaponry or anything to help them defend against dark beings. This is already something you can do, I don't know why it's not being done.

 

-Actually fight the spooks yourselves? It's like your one purpose.

[Jistuma 1996]

1 hour ago, Farryn said:

 

● Tier five - A cleric can create a ward that surrounds a settlement consisting of a few houses. By the time they have been learning how to create a ward for a year, a cleric can creare a ward large enougb to protect a small villags.

 

This is way too excessive, normal wards (which only stop one type of spell) can not go over a house big, why would cleric wards (which stop all dark spells and stop passage to dark beings) be a lot more powerful when it does so much more?

 

Also I think cleric wards should do what wards do, stop magic. If a dark being is using dark magic to disguise themselves, the disguise would disapear. If they were attacking someone with magic, the magic wouldn't work, etc. No dark creature should be stopped by the wards. Though another sugestion is also alike other wards, which ward can only do one thing, so a cleric ward would be able to stop 1 type of dark creature.

 

I feel that current cleric wards don't create rp, they stop rp. You can say they stop unwanted bad rp, but they still stop rp by making an area OOC'ly denied for a few characters.

 

Examples of wards I would think would fit with clerics:
- At a gate, a ward to stop disguises.

- Over tainted land, so that it doesn't spreed while it's cleaned up.

- In places like jail cells, so that a necromancer can't suck lifeforce from a guard.

[Lhindir_ 3691]

Remove.

[Treshure 5817]

>be spook 

>place yourself in imminent danger in front of a publicized gatehouse

>manage, somehow, to disable ward 

>cleric owner of the ward screeches in shout Emote that the ward breaks 

>army marches to apprehend you

>after you're gone, they make a new ward

 

Has to be something better than this stupid **** 

[ski_king3 0]

The main issue of these wards is that they function as a way to, if implemented correctly, keep out a category of players without any RP on their end. However, there are situations where I think it makes sense to have them. If they are going to persist (which I think they shouldn't), you should:

a) Make it so they must be recharged very frequently. If they have to be recharged once a day, leaders of settlements will only put in the effort to ensure it happens when they're having frequent issues with dark forces (as Leo expressed).

b) Make it so it isn't some burning pain, or let it vary based on the type of dark mage. Implement it in a way so if a dark mage was trying, only those who properly understood what the wards did would understand that a dark mage had just walked through.

c) Perhaps make it so over time, excessive use of the wards makes places harder to ward, to discourage 24/7 usage of them for months on end.

[Boomzerang 515]

1 hour ago, Farryn said:

Any important key points are lost within the spiral of arguments and posts where people just say 'remove the magic' rather than actually give useful feedback.

 

20 minutes ago, Lhindir_ said:

Remove.

 

6 minutes ago, Treshure said:

>be spook 

>place yourself in imminent danger in front of a publicized gatehouse

>manage, somehow, to disable ward 

>cleric owner of the ward screeches in shout Emote that the ward breaks 

>army marches to apprehend you

>after you're gone, they make a new ward

 

Has to be something better than this stupid **** 

???

[Bvie 1754]

Sutica has two wards at two of the three entrances. If you're a spook and want to get in, you can and we oocly let it be this way. 

 

Sutica also has wards throughout the city because students are actually training and practicing their skill.

 

Students practicing what their taught and not just knowing it perfectly over time? Crazy, I know.