[Your View] Recent Defender Default change: Feedback

[ski_king3 0]

1 minute ago, PoliceAli said:

 

defender default does not become meaningless if the raid cap becomes 5. if the raid cap becomes 5 then you will see less and less unkillable gods of war geared with titanium cod pieces and sharpness infinity swords (Obviously an exaggeration, but you get the point about god gear).

 

the higher the raid cap, the easier raids will become essentially, which seems counter-intuitive but makes real sense.

 

 

It really doesn't make any sense.

[monkeypoacher 8055]

I like the change a lot. It makes it a little more difficult for people to call their friends into conflicts without role-playing and force people who don't want to PvP to PvP, but it doesn't make it any more difficult for people looking to PvP to get what they want. I've only seen the "default to PvP" number invoked in ridiculous 7v1 situations where maybe two of the people involved in the aggressive party were roleplaying, and the rest were just sitting around in teamspeak. Taking away groups of people's ability to **** on lone players really doesn't harm anyone in any way.

 

 

[_pr0fit 3084]

9 minutes ago, ski_king3 said:

 

It really doesn't make any sense.

 

yes it does....

currently it costs about 50k mina (Gob guy made a post listing out exactly what gear and their prices that was required) to fully gear a singular raider with god gear, which is necessary for a raid if you are only allowed 4 people.

 

Say that you can raid with 8 people, you no longer need god gear, you would be fine raiding in a mismatch of regular and prot iron, with decent swords, and possibly only a few bows, 4 people with god gear is significantly more difficult to kill than 8 people with regular gear.

 

 

Edit: my bad, it was 50 hours and 15k per person
 

Now imagine being forced to use this every time you raid, or face immediate loss.

 

>One set of Leather ~ About 15 minutes.

>One set of Diamond ~ About 9 hours

>Four protection books ~ About 12 hours.

>Four projectile protection books ~ About 12 hours.
>Four different potions ~ Time unpredictable. (Potions may fail, and supplies are difficult to get.)

>Weapon ~ About 5 minutes. (Could take 5 or more tries to get desired %)

>Bow ~ About 5 minutes. (Could take 5 or more tries to get desired %)

>Sharpness book ~ About 8 hours.

>Power book ~ About 8 hours.

>Arrows ~ About 5 minutes.

>Meatloaf ~ about 10 minutes.

>Total time = About 50 hours 20 minutes

Value about 15k?

 

Now multiply that by 3-4, one for each raider.

[Dragonslayerelf 654]

I personally, which is probably ironic considering I'm an ET, dislike the PvP default max being raised to 10. If you've ever had a 9v1 or 8v2 RP combat session it's HORRIBLE. Oftentimes it ends up with the person simply going dies because they have no way to reasonably respond to all 9 emotes of blades, hammers, and axes flying at you and simply don't know how to handle it so you type in, in hopefully more words, dies. I personally preferred it when you had the limit at 8, or even 6. Nice thing about it is that if you have a few meme raiders/meme defenders you either want to run away from and/or kill swiftly, you can call pvp, but you don't have to call pvp. I remember when 6 was the max and a few orcish raiders who were quality rp'ers came to our gates in Athera, it was a 3v3 or a 3v4, and we still did RP combat because we both were having fun with it. We both enjoyed it, I feel, anyway.

And, at the end of the day, we're both an RP and a PvP server, factually. I know the whole 'Factions PvP server, right?' is commonly known as a meme but it's at least half-way true. So, that's my twenty-five cents (inflation, sorry).

[InfamousGerman 1553]

2 minutes ago, ski_king3 said:

 

The point is that if 8 people defaults to PVP, and 4 people can do lawless raids, you cannot use defender default to select RP without being at a disadvantage. That's why the cap was raised.

 

What? Raiders can only bring 4 people every 2 days minimum, usually it becomes 5 days. Defenders can use any and all skype chats at their disposal to bring in monumental amounts of reinforcements. Reinforcements can join in the defense at any time they want and suffer no punishments. Now you want them to also have the ability to outnumber raiders in a forced rp fight that they'll automatically win with attrition due to it being a 5v4 max.

 

How many damn things are you going to slant in favor of the defenders? At this point you might as well just say you want to remove raids.

[Ambduscias 1028]

whenever i attempt to RP fight 5-7 people coincidentally aligned with the other party show up; i'm not talking about just wood elves/magic groups, literally every community uses DD to stall till their friends can show up and jump in.

 

no "rule against metagaming" is going to change that, hate to be the bearer of bad news.

 

even as someone who likes RP fighting, the system is absolutely awful and only more inundated with literal ****/a very heavy bias towards the attacked than providing even playing grounds.

 

[Thornz 549]

1 minute ago, Ambduscias said:

whenever i attempt to RP fight 5-7 people coincidentally aligned with the other party show up; i'm not talking about just wood elves/magic groups, literally every community uses DD to stall till their friends can show up and jump in.

 

no "rule against metagaming" is going to change that, hate to be the bearer of bad news.

 

even as someone who likes RP fighting, the system is absolutely awful and only more inundated with literal ****/a very heavy bias towards the attacked than providing even playing grounds.

 

 

Is there not a rule that's states when Combat has been initiated that nobody can join midfight?

[𝕾𝖙𝖆𝖗𝖌𝖚𝖘𝖍 2451]

3 minutes ago, PoliceAli said:

Say that you can raid with 8 people, you no longer need god gear, you would be fine raiding in a mismatch of regular and prot iron, with decent swords, and possibly only a few bows, 4 people with god gear is significantly more difficult to kill than 8 people with regular gear.

 

I believe this is pretty relevant actually. Raiding with 4 people also puts up the risk of losing the God Tier gear that they raid with, which would be very unlikely because noone would want to put up that risk in the first place. Simply raiding with 4 people in iron or chain isn't an easy task to perform either, while bringing more people basically spreads the God Tier across the quantity of people with a regular set of Iron. 

[Harri 4815]

2 minutes ago, Ambduscias said:

whenever i attempt to RP fight 5-7 people coincidentally aligned with the other party show up; i'm not talking about just wood elves/magic groups, literally every community uses DD to stall till their friends can show up and jump in.

 

no "rule against metagaming" is going to change that, hate to be the bearer of bad news.

 

even as someone who likes RP fighting, the system is absolutely awful and only more inundated with literal ****/a very heavy bias towards the attacked than providing even playing grounds.

 

 

then report that and people will be banned for metagame

[Ambduscias 1028]

3 minutes ago, Harrison said:

then report that and people will be banned for metagame

 

 

see, harry - you RP and PVP too, so we both know that it isn't always so clear cut. SOMETIMES it's actually a genuine coincedence you stumble balls first into a friends RP fight, sometimes you get a message on skype giving you cords and telling you to rally in petrus. the system shouldn't require punishment, it should prevent the need for punishments in the first place.

 

having a method in place to deal with the shitty/malicious is not justification to pop up a BR every time something shady happens. even if they were metagaming, i don't want them banned; that's not healthy for LOTC - i just want them to sod off so i can continue with my RP/PVP. 

 

4 minutes ago, McThornz said:

Is there not a rule that's states when Combat has been initiated that nobody can join midfight?

 

 

and no. there is not.

[Harri 4815]

Just now, Ambduscias said:

 

see, harry - you RP and PVP too, so we both know that it isn't always so clear cut. SOMETIMES it's actually a genuine coincedence you stumble balls first into a friends RP fight, sometimes you get a message on skype giving you cords and telling you to rally in petrus. the system shouldn't require punishment, it should prevent the need for punishments in the first place.

 

having a method in place to deal with the shitty/malicious is not justification to pop up a BR every time something shady happens. even if they were metagaming, i don't want them banned; that's not healthy for LOTC - i just want them to sod off so i can continue with my RP/PVP. 

 

I understand what you mean by saying it's 'unhealthy', but is it really healthy for the server to just leave people who frequently meta-game alone to do just that?

[InfamousGerman 1553]

Just now, Harrison said:

I understand what you mean by saying it's 'unhealthy', but is it really healthy for the server to just leave people who frequently meta-game alone to do just that?

 

how do i prove someone is metagaming if they're not pming ig

[_pr0fit 3084]

2 minutes ago, Ambduscias said:

and no. there is not.

 

Nobody may join mid-combat. Only those involved at the start may fight.

 

Quoted right from the rules, although it is not enforced well

[Harri 4815]

Just now, InfamousGerman said:

how do i prove someone is metagaming if they're not pming ig

 

GM team are taking more of a stance where 'If 10 guys show up on a '''''''patrol'''''''' armoured up and sprint jumping towards a fight, it's meta-gaming' rather than saying we have no evidence.

[Ambduscias 1028]

1 minute ago, Harrison said:

I understand what you mean by saying it's 'unhealthy', but is it really healthy for the server to just leave people who frequently meta-game alone to do just that?

 

 

Kinda cherry picking what I said there. It's not always necessarily metagaming, and the arguments that it was just an accident might be genuine (I'm sure it's happened to you, and it's definitely happened to me) - and on the note of is it healthy for the server? Honestly, I'd say so. If we have systems and methods to deal with metagaming in place, it doesn't really matter if they occasionally bullshit knowing something they shouldn't or showing up to a fight only to be not able to join.

 

 

1 minute ago, PoliceAli said:

 

Nobody may join mid-combat. Only those involved at the start may fight.

 

Quoted right from the rules, although it is not enforced well

 

 

I had a GM genuinely ignore it when I brought it up last time, saying that refers only to PVP.