[✗] The Degradation of Aurum

[Leric 1097]

I do like this idea, seeing as it would make holy orders far more useful against combating spooks and people would have to call us in more often. However, the rest of the playerbase will not like this at all, seeing as it'd be impossible for them to defeat say a wraith if someone with holy powers wasn't around. Instead of aurum one shotting wraiths on successful hit with how it is right now, it should be tuned so that they're more resistant and can take more of a beating from that type of weaponry.

[Anderssn 1115]

+1 If you make an enchant that replaces it.

Edited October 21, 2015 by Anderssn

[monkeypoacher 6994]

 

[WuHanXianShi14 0]

If that's the case, then instead of making gold useless on wraiths, simply make it less effective on them than it currently is. A good scale to go by would be that gold weapons are as effective on dark beings as steel is on humans (i.e Witcher logic).

That way, to mortals with gold weapons, fighting a wraith is the equivalent of fighting a very powerful mage, as opposed to fighting something that literally cannot be killed.

Expecting to be more powerful than that is a little unsportsmanlike IMO. Every other school of magic allows you to become immensely powerful, but still killable by conventional means, or if ganged up on with superior numbers. Wraiths should be no different.

Recall though Leo. There can only be four wraiths at any given time. No more. You aren't fighting a mage, you're fighting something that has transcended mortality. The effectiveness of gold is neat, but I like the opportunity to reach out to your fellow mages, the clerics and paladins and make them actually relevant again. Those are magic types which at the moment are losing traction due to lack of threats. Giving them something they can hard-counter and have to be sought out for generates roleplay. You can still get a weapon that can be used to bastry a wraith you just have to seek a fi, cleric or paladin magic user out. I like that, it makes special weapons special again.

Speaking as someone who's been in many wraith fights, having to seek out a cleric/paladin/fi-mage is vastly more annoying than it is RP generating. From the fact that the chances of a cleric being online at the time and place a wraith is around doing his wraithey stuff is simply very slim, to the fact that "we need to get someone else to come do this thing for us!" is simply not engaging or interesting RP.

On paper, this would give holy orders more RP, but in reality it'd just be a lot of "PM to see if any clerics are online, theres a wraith in town. No? ****."

Those holy orders have their advantage. they're far more effective against dark beings than non-holy people are. But that doesnt mean us average-joes should have absolutely no chance in the event we lack a cleric/paladin.

There can only be four wraiths at any given time. No more. You aren't fighting a mage, you're fighting something that has transcended mortality.

I'm sorry, but if the tradeoff of Wraiths being invicible to non-holy folks is their rarity...that just isnt represented in RP. Wraith attacks are a dime-a-dozen. There've been two in the last two days in Laurelin. The "we're rare, so we're much more powerful" argument doesn't hold up if your attacks are as frequent -and by extension mundane- as other groups.

Additionally, Itharels, Keepers and Ascended have also transcended mortality and are very rare, and they can all be killed via conventional stabby stabby.

 

[GodEmperorFlam 3447]

What are people talking about when it comes to overpowered beings? Lich? Bash its skull with the pommel of your blade or use the blunt side of the blade. A wraith? Get a bunch of people and crossbow it/utilize other things, those things are meant to be hard. Ghouls? Decapitation. Necromancer/shade/any other mortal spook you literally just stab and it's dead. If someone plays off getting stabbed or crossbow bolted in the face, they're powergaming.

 

However, my issue arises with ghosts. Back in Athera, there was a group of ghosts played by Akiriza and cman and a few others, who would heavily powergame their ghost abilities. My fear is if this lore is passed, normal folks won't have a way to properly combat them, seeing as how most holy orders are spread thin. And most people don't understand ghost lore, or most lore in general, which is why it's hard to tell when someone is powergaming (hence why some people just PvP mages and whatnot).

 

Could it be perhaps modified to simply be weakened instead of defunct, as you put it? So it would only work on lower tier spooks, such as ghosts and maybe ghouls?

 

All in all, I give it a +1 as ghosts aren't remarkably prevalent in Vailor, so I don't think it'll be a massive issue.

[ThumperJack 923]

 

Additionally, Itharels, Keepers and Ascended have also transcended mortality and are very rare, and they can all be killed via conventional stabby stabby.

 

Yes, your average iron sword or axe would do the job just fine, but won't insta-kill the Itharels and Ascended. Necrolytes practically have no defense against golden weaponry, and coming to cause some fun terror rp is just plain killed because everyone in town has a gold sword.

 

And, even Holy Magic is like one-shotting them. Which I believe Lorien made a great and interesting topic about there being a balance between Light and Dark, different topic tho.

 

[WuHanXianShi14 0]

A wraith? Get a bunch of people and crossbow it/utilize other things, those things are meant to be hard.

Hard but not impossible. What Swgr proposes makes them impossible for non-holy or fi magic users to kill, and that's just not good. See above for reasons why.

[excited 10836]

This idea has my support. 

[drfate786 1639]

I would also like to point out that necros and spooks in general are part of their own "MVP group" and are never willing to teach necromancy or any dark art to those they mistrust in OOC. For this reason they shouldn't even be allowed to teach necromancy any more and it should just die out like blood magic did.

I have a mistrust for those in charge of teaching the dark arts on our server as I fear they are preventing the wide spread of such magic. 

 

[GDPR 014 25]

Honestly, just make gold do the same damage as an iron sword does to a normal person. Though this is if we're talking about wraiths and ghosts. Ghouls can be gucked by a normal sword, so gold isn't really needed. But that's just my two cents.

[GodEmperorFlam 3447]

A wraith? Get a bunch of people and crossbow it/utilize other things, those things are meant to be hard.

Hard but not impossible. What Swgr proposes makes them impossible for non-holy or fi magic users to kill, and that's just not good. See above for reasons why.

Did wraiths become immune to fire?

[GodEmperorFlam 3447]

I would also like to point out that necros and spooks in general are part of their own "MVP group" and are never willing to teach necromancy or any dark art to those they mistrust in OOC. For this reason they shouldn't even be allowed to teach necromancy any more and it should just die out like blood magic did.

I have a mistrust for those in charge of teaching the dark arts on our server as I fear they are preventing the wide spread of such magic. 

 

I would have a mistrust of you if you were allowed to RP any sort of magic past voidal.

 

Whoops, double posting. Couldn't edit this into my above one so if an FM could combine it or something, I'd like to leave my insult here. c:

[WuHanXianShi14 0]

Did wraiths become immune to fire?

I don't know TBH. But if you made gold ineffective on wraiths everyone would just start carrying around lighter fluid or flint&steel and then another lore post would go up explaining why fire doesn't work on wraiths.

[ThumperJack 923]

Honestly, just make gold do the same damage as an iron sword does to a normal person. Though this is if we're talking about wraiths and ghosts. Ghouls can be gucked by a normal sword, so gold isn't really needed. But that's just my two cents.

[Swgrclan 2637]

No thank you. I think dark beings have enough immense power without taking away the only thing normal people have a hope of killing them with.

I highly dissaprove of needing to have a cleric, paladin or ascended around to even have a chance against a wraith/lich/w.e.

Its reasonable to expect these beings to be powerful, yes. But invincible against everyone except a minority of people with a few special magic types? Definitely not.

Making your wraith unkillable in RP without a fi' mage or holy magic user will only prompt you to get PVP defaulted more.

All in all, a strong -1. Sorry.

You must come to understand that these minorities are as prominent as any other communities hosted in the server, and their magic exists for a reason. In this case, it has been displaced by mass-used gold weaponry because no one wishes to put in the effort to gain Clerical/Paladin/Ascended allies. Why such a prospect seems unreasonable is beyond me. Those magic group exist to protect and help people, not idle about uselessly because their vast array of holy powers are put to shame by gold-wielding mobs. I find it rather callous toward the effort of these groups to just ignore them and handle these threats independently. If one isn't prepared to fight a greater enemy (undead), why must they be allowed an easier-accessed solution (gold) instead of working to gain the better alternative (holy people/wardmancers/fi' dudes/what have you)?

Leo that is what it is. You hit a wraith with a good swing with a golden sword and it dissipates. You hit a lich it falls to pieces. You hit a ghoul they get reckly-deckled The wraith cannot get off a spell if it cannot concentrate, so peasant number 1 swinging around a torch and and a golden sword which demolishes them prevents spell casting. It is actually kryptonite at the moment, it is actually challenge-less. My Knight Destroyed Geo's wraith in one good hit because I had an aurum dagger in my boot. One good stab and it had to fly away. 

If that's the case, then instead of making gold useless on wraiths, simply make it less effective on them than it currently is. A good scale to go by would be that gold weapons are as effective on dark beings as steel is on humans (i.e Witcher logic).

That way, to mortals with gold weapons, fighting a wraith is the equivalent of fighting a very powerful mage, as opposed to fighting something that literally cannot be killed.

Expecting to be more powerful than that is a little unsportsmanlike IMO. Every other school of magic allows you to become immensely powerful, but still killable by conventional means, or if ganged up on with superior numbers. Wraiths should be no different.

I see that there's a lot of misunderstandings being tossed about here, so I'll offer this clarification -- your suggestion is already in-place and the way it's scaled is exactly how you describe it. But that's bad, because the things that gold is being used to fight against is supposed to be tough. No one said they were created to be on an equal playing field. An entire  swathe of roleplaying aspects is taken from legitimate characters in order to make them into player-driven antagonists -- that is what they exist for. Not to coexist and tarry about and occasionally fight fleshy people. When I wrote the lore for Wraiths, my intention was to create something people would fear and get their asses kicked by unless they had the proper means to fight back. Granted, I did add gold as a weakness to them back them because I thought it would be rare, but I was very, very wrong. Nonetheless the Wraiths, or any of the undead races in my understanding, were not made to be on an equal playing field, and are currently far below that, objectively. If you need an example, I can't even remember a time when the forces of evil won a battle in a timespan of two years. That stretches back before the Wraiths even existed.

A wraith? Get a bunch of people and crossbow it/utilize other things, those things are meant to be hard.

Hard but not impossible. What Swgr proposes makes them impossible for non-holy or fi magic users to kill, and that's just not good. See above for reasons why.

Employ the powers of Fi' mages, Paladins, Clerics, Ward-makers (I've no idea what they're called) and blessed weapons derived from these same groups and you'll do fine. One can't just cut out a whole swathe of players, and this same swathe's divisions and groups, in favor of an easy solution which nullifies the point of evil-entity and holy characters in the first place. 

If it would help the matter of redundancy in undead attacks and the like, I would be willing to set in place a more organized system that prevented random, sporadic attacks, and more event-oriented, organized ones. The half-assedness of Anthos Malinor antagonism is not something I'm wanting to replicate here.

Edited October 21, 2015 by Swgrclan