[✗] Druidic Artifacts: Weather Stones

[garentoft 8353]

I like this lore. It's good.

[TeaLulu 1783]

There's about 15 reasons I could give for why I dislike this idea and cannot possibly support it. I'm going to try and focus on just a few of those to avoid spending too much of my time on this.

 

It has been known that in the past druidic magic encompassed weather control, be it naturally from their magic and was reserved to those who were skilled in the art, and were able to call forth large storms, which grew in size and strength when in a large group. Five months ago Ouity attempted to resubmit lore to return it into the server, and was denied for a multitude of reasons. I personally feel that re-adding the lore, but in a different way, would add an interesting flair and would be quite good. Now, allow me to respond to the points that helfiazz made in his end point.

 

Alright, they would "add an interesting flair", but that's not the question all lore submitters should ask themselves. Everyone who writes/submits lore should ask "What Roleplay would this lore add to the server? How would it be interesting or new, or not available elsewhere? In addition, keeping them in "stone" form rather than as a teachable magic, allows the "powerful" Druids to further consolidate their magic to only include those whom they like and to disclude anyone who is not part of their group. Because it's not teachable, and is confined to the stones, it means it can't possibly slip from the grasp of those who control it so long as they leave it in a hidden locked chest 100% of the time, or only use it for "Events", attempting to use the "Event" excuse to prevent any theft or attack (FYI if this ever did happen, I would make sure the ED responsible was removed. Don't do it.)

 

- Precedents don't count, especially if there's not been any lore for it. Controlling weather has never been in any druid guide.

 

Where precedents don’t count, I can certainly agree and understand that there’s been no actual lore behind it, however there has been role-play that involved it meaning that there is a way to place it as it happening due to magical artifacts, instead of the druid’s themselves.

 

There may have been role-play with it (Which we have not yet seen an unbiased thirdparty attest to ever happening), but that doesn't mean it was ever canon or accepted to the server. Do you know how much BS edgy random-magic RP happened in Aegis/Asulon that wasn't canon or lore-approved, was OP, and made no sense? If we accepted every single thing as lore just on the basis of "it's been role-played before", the server would be full of a lot of unrealistic, lore/canon-breaking nonsense that was made just to power others up. So claiming that it should be accepted on the basis of "Role-play happened with it before" is totally invalid and in a way even weakens your argument for acceptance, because there is no way the Lore Department is going to risk setting that precedent.

 

- It's not established that druids communion extends beyond animal and plant control/change. The only spell that doesn't influence a living being directly is blight healing, and even that could be seen as plant healing in some way. The argument that weather is part of nature is pure nonsense; soil and rivers are part of nature and are necessary to life, but it would be ridiculous for Druids to control those.

 

I am unable to disagree once more, there is no actual establishment that says that the druids themselves are able to have a ‘spell’ that influences anything outside of what you explain. That is where this artifact comes into play, a conversion of sorts as I said before and that has a unique feel in my opinion.

 

Keep this point well in mind, there is no establish evidence that druid communion extends beyond what it already does, which is already extremely varied. Druidic power is one of only 2 magics that allows the users to directly change the world we're in in great ways; The other being shamanism. Druids can heal extensive areas of blight, and grow new forests, and groves, and blah blah etc. But the difference between how druids and shamans interact with and change the environment is important and touched on later in this response: Druids interact with nature and control/change it. Shamans utilize spirits to interact with "The world at large", not solely nature, and in fact a Shaman could not do the things a druid does; Talk to animals, grow a giant grove, cleanse a land of taint (i don't believe), etc.

 

In addition, allowing this to pass through would set a "precedent" of sorts of Druids being able to/having artifacts that can interact/change things that their powers cannot. If the Druids have an artifact that can control the weather, why can't they have one that controls the soil and rivers?? Escalation could happen and it should be avoided altogether: Magics should have to stick to their general theme/basis of their lore, and no one should get super-special artifacts that go beyond that gifted to them by their Dieties or whatever.

 

- Your attitude is and has been piss-poor. This does matter.

 

This doesn’t really put part in the now, though I would like to apologise. Not just to you, hellfiazz, but to the entirety of the Lore Department (Team), and I would like to say that I do strive for a better work partnership between the druids, and the staff.

 

- Druidism is already is a very versatile and rich magic. It has a plethora of abilities, and there is no need for more.

 

- Shamanism can already manipulate the weather in this exact manner.

I put these two points together because I have a very similar answer for both, or more so response to both. This is where our opinions differ, I feel that there shouldn’t be a wall that stops the growth of something simply because it is considered rich, or versatile, because all magics are versatile in the right hands, and even all magic seems to step on others toes. For example, shamanism gets its toes stepped on (or it steps on toes, depending on perspective) to druidism and evocation, now I don’t mind this as it adds more and I don’t say this as a negative, simply explaining my thought process, as well as opinions.

And here we are on druids vs shamans. The Lore Department has repeatedly stated that Lore should add something new/unique to the server. Lore has in the past been denied PURELY on the basis that it does not add anything new to the server and/or because there already is a magic/creature/etc that is similar to the lore submitted. This is already part of the Lore Dept's method of deciding if lore is acceptable or not. It's a good base "qualifier" to see if lore really should be added to the server; If there's already lore that does the same thing, or similar, or if it adds nothing new to the server, then its not necessary.

 

This gets back to the point that shaman magic is different from druid magic. It makes logical sense for Shamans to be able to control the weather when they reach a high tier. Shaman act through the spirits and the spirits act through the shamans; There are spirits which are capable of dictating things that are "natural" that druids don't have control over; Earth, water, weather, plague, etc. It makes sense for Shamans to be able to control magic, because that fits in with the "theme" and "Basis" of their powers.

 

For the reasons stated above it does not make sense for Druids to control weather, it is not a good method of controlling weather, and there is already a magic which controls weather (and it makes sense that they do so), so there is no need to add another method of weather control as it would not "Add" anything new to roleplay or the server, aside from a very select few of druids being able to do something that doesn't make sense for the "basis" of their magic.

P.S., Shamans in Aegis could control weather before the druids. Any claim of "Druidic" weather control would be from Respiren abusing his GM powers and shooting lightning/changing the weather in-game, none of which was legitimate RP or approved Lore, which cannot be claimed as "proof" of druids controlling weather in the past.

[Aesopian 1124]

TeaLulu, you do realize druidism is a guild-locked magic, and it's possible to simply 'remove' the magic from a player if they leave the guild? Their power is already consolidated. 

 

Honestly, I do feel druidism could use some trimming up, like removing all aspects of it which are instantaneous (which maybe I will talk about some other time, you know, stuff like removing the ability to summon a tree from the earth to pound someone's ass), but I don't really see the point in 'limiting' any magic, druidism/shamanism/whatever.

 

Magic should be broad. Shamans should be able to speak to wolves if they speak to a spirit of wolves. They should be able to heal blight by speaking to a spirit of reforestation. Druids should be able to manipulate any natural phenomenon. Their capabilities, and the nuance of how they perform their acts, should vary, but I don't see the issue with having the same outcome for both of them.

 

If you impale someone with an ice lance, or zap them with a lightning bolt, you still end up with a corpse, right? 

[James 424]

Under Review

[Jistuma 1995]

This lore has been Denied.

 

Druid magic doesn't affect natural elements, and just life itself. The Druids do not have the power to control winds, conjure rains, or create hurricanes, it is outside what their powers interact with, even with an Artifact. Control of natural elements falls into the realm of shamanism, and is in the control of the spirits, not the Aspects. As such, the artifact would not be part of the druidic powers, and would make no sense as to why druids would be able to use it.

[hellfiazz 878]

This Lore has been denied. Topic moved to Denied Lore forum.