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4 minutes ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

Uhhh... 2 minas per vote?

I feel like that won't buoy prices at all and several key resources will drop below .1 minas in price. Please raise those numbers a bit, or let us set shops to buy/sell with hundredths of a mina instead of just tenths and whole integers.

 

According to Llir you can go down to .01

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i cant imagine the power that @Nummy has now that she can bankroll a nations survival off of art contests 
1ed86d06ca1a289198db38b9ef0ed715.jpg 
comin out cap in hand asking for 10 mina

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Eh. 
 

This seems to me like it just further alienates new players and smaller groups, strong-arming them to join nations or face an uphill battle far too steep to climb. I understand the desire to want to reduce random charters and lairs that could be under nations, but I don’t think the blind “stick it to charters” attitude need apply to Mina and basic economic functions. 
 

Even if we assume that people will be able to make decent Mina with a little work, the arbitrary cap just winds up blindly benefitting nations and people with alts and VIP persona slots. Nobody will put 501 Mina in their bank when they could just send anything over 500 alt personas across multiple accounts.
 

To be a bit dramatic, it seems like putting a bandaid on a stab wound because you don’t have the tools on hand to stitch it up properly. Instead of fine tuning nodex, vortex progression, and other key features (you know, the stuff that the economy will hopefully be largely made up of), it’s just slapping arbitrary numbers on different values to force market standards to your own personal standard. 
 

 

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7 minutes ago, Sykogenic said:

Eh. 
 

This seems to me like it just further alienates new players and smaller groups, strong-arming them to join nations or face an uphill battle far too steep to climb. I understand the desire to want to reduce random charters and lairs that could be under nations, but I don’t think the blind “stick it to charters” attitude need apply to Mina and basic economic functions. 
 

Even if we assume that people will be able to make decent Mina with a little work, the arbitrary cap just winds up blindly benefitting nations and people with alts and VIP persona slots. Nobody will put 501 Mina in their bank when they could just send anything over 500 alt personas across multiple accounts.
 

To be a bit dramatic, it seems like putting a bandaid on a stab wound because you don’t have the tools on hand to stitch it up properly. Instead of fine tuning nodex, vortex progression, and other key features (you know, the stuff that the economy will hopefully be largely made up of), it’s just slapping arbitrary numbers on different values to force market standards to your own personal standard. 
 

 

This, absolutely this.

 

It feels like the Economy Team made a system designed to favor large nations over small communities with real economics as an afterthought. This won't create an economy, it'll create a hierarchy.

 

Vortex crafting itself is mostly fine. It's the stupid economic decisions of this Economy Team I'm most worried about. It seems my worries came true.

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the amount you get is much to small for a nation to properly maintain anything, say your nation has fifty ACTIVE weekly players, thats a big ******* ask in the first place, then you need to get them to vote and pay taxes, the nation either has the option to tax a smaller amount and not make nearly enough to cover plot costs and the like, or tax citizens out the ass leaving actual trade and commerce screwed or making them barter, which doesnt pay the bills, not only that but you are now forcing groups that hadnt placed value in gathering alot of mina like high elves, halflings etc to try to actively maintain and gather mina now, this is a real bad take 

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1 hour ago, DahStalker said:

What does this mean for skinners? Let’s say I sell a skin for 600 mina. And I do two of those sold skins in a day and get 1200. I’m going to get a fee for putting in days of work and gaining a large sum of mina for it. This is going to make your skinners wanting to convert to USD and irl money payments.

 

in fairness if you make 1200 mina that week, you're losing 3% of that so like 36 mina. 

 

I don't know what a "nation owner bank" is but I assume you'll be able to store money with them to avoid the fee so it's really just another world team "let's **** with new charters" thing. Distasteful, but not really gamebreaking.

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I have to agree with Hurfer, it's to be rough for some nations that have focused on primarily rp to keep their nations alive. Will now have to force some kind of taxation/colllection on their citizens to survive.  While I'm sure they're be some players that willing give to support their nations, it could get expensive if you have multiple personas and different cities that need money for upkeep. I don't like such a small mina limit to player banks, at least let people store up to 5000 mina before we have to pay upkeep fees. Finally I'm curious how the scarcity of mina will affect basic trade rps like taverns. Finally I'd like a full guide on how the other professions work and play out in the long run, so I can better chose one to suit my rp needs.

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56 minutes ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

This, absolutely this.

 

It feels like the Economy Team made a system designed to favor large nations over small communities with real economics as an afterthought. This won't create an economy, it'll create a hierarchy.

 

Vortex crafting itself is mostly fine. It's the stupid economic decisions of this Economy Team I'm most worried about. It seems my worries came true.


Put your mina into material wealth and sell it off when needed, Come up with some thing different to bring money into your group, go into debt with the money lenders that are going to pop up (( like my group! )), Find ways around it and think outside the box, Be creative!. If you want real economics a small group with less money, manpower and resources should cost more then a nation with both? so lets not start with that. Its a make believe RP server after all.

This is something being worked on coastally and adjusted was needed, to stop massive hordes of mina sitting around. Though that fee it would be nice if the post state if its a monthly/week/deposit charge or whatnot.

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5 minutes ago, Samsan99 said:


Put your mina into material wealth and sell it off when needed, Come up with some thing different to bring money into your group, go into debt with the money lenders that are going to pop up (( like my group! )), Find ways around it and think outside the box, Be creative!. If you want real economics a small group with less money, manpower and resources should cost more then a nation with both? so lets not start with that. Its a make believe RP server after all.

This is something being worked on coastally and adjusted was needed, to stop massive hordes of mina sitting around. Though that fee it would be nice if the post state if its a monthly/week/deposit charge or whatnot.

Costs more to make a single settlement than to civilize an entire tile and fill it with duchies and stuff? I’m sorry, I don’t see your logic.

 

Relative to the resources of the group, it’s harder for a smaller community to build a settlement than for a bigger group to build said settlement. The settlement doesn’t cost more to make just because the group making it is smaller, though. A tile is a lot larger than a charter, so having a tile cost the same amount just doesn’t make sense unless nations get magical discounts on everything.

 

You’re confusing relative cost to absolute cost. 

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8 minutes ago, NotEvilAtAll said:

Costs more to make a single settlement than to civilize an entire tile and fill it with duchies and stuff? I’m sorry, I don’t see your logic.

 

Relative to the resources of the group, it’s harder for a smaller community to build a settlement than for a bigger group to build said settlement. The settlement doesn’t cost more to make just because the group making it is smaller, though. A tile is a lot larger than a charter, so having a tile cost the same amount just doesn’t make sense unless nations get magical discounts on everything.

 

You’re confusing relative cost to absolute cost. 



Well the cost I'd hope change based of the size of land you are attempting to get and control not a simple flat price for all land, that's kinda silly. Nation or no nation. Still not big enough to class as a nation, then hold it as martial wealth rather then mina.  I assumed you are where refencing real life economics,  Doing the same thing in a large city vs a small one has a massive cost difference, its nearly always more expensive for the smaller cities, just comes from having people to use and more resources being available.  Again this is fantasy, we should maybe use it as a base but mimicking real life down to small details is hardly why we are here. 

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1 minute ago, Samsan99 said:



Well the cost I'd hope change based of the size of land you are attempting to get and control not a simple flat price for all land, that's kinda silly. Nation or no nation. Still not big enough to class as a nation, then hold it as martial wealth rather then mina.  I assumed you are where refencing real life economics,  Doing the same thing in a large city vs a small one has a massive cost difference, its nearly always more expensive for the smaller cities, just comes from having people to use and more resources being available. 

Smaller cities are not more expensive to build than larger cities. There is much more material wealth in the construction of Tokyo than there is in Effington Illinois, for example.

 

Sure larger populations have more resources to work with, but that’s relative cost, not absolute cost. A set minas price on land is an absolute cost, not a relative cost.

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Here my dumbass was thinking economy team might cut some charters slack for a second. Well boys, time to pump up the taxes to make up for our lower population levels so we can get nodes to build our city and grow our own economy without relying on nations! Everyone spoon over your already limited mina!

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