Vote On The Way Combat Should Work!

[bickando 3967]

Well, I'd like to have a go at defending RP. Remember that one battle in Aegis? I'm talking to you oldies out there, but I still remember. The battlefield full of RP battles was spectacular and fun, and I can't remember that much raging happening because of it either. What happened happened, and it went pretty smoothly. RP fights can be fun instead of painful for some because, well, we came here to escape the constant killing happening in PVP servers and can rp here without that pain. I really like that part of LotC, and was hoping it wouldn't have to change. People might like to rage about powergaming, but wasn't that what the whitelist application is for? Why do we have to, even though we have the question in the application to prevent people powergaming, do PVP fights automatically? I hope others agree, but there's nothing truly wrong with RP battles. It's just that people don't want to see their characters lose. But won't the same thing happen in PVP, really? People flame about hunger bars not being full and disadvantaged fights because they simply could not afford different things. I feel like we should NOT move from RP, because there is a distinct line here that makes Lord of the Craft what it is, and that is the beautiful roleplay experience you can get here.

[Samson Option 9652]

I've said it clear that my option is an RP-PvP with exceptions to the rule. I will be closing this soon and Danny can decide if re-open or not.

[Solaba 144]

Well, I'd like to have a go at defending RP. Remember that one battle in Aegis? I'm talking to you oldies out there, but I still remember. The battlefield full of RP battles was spectacular and fun, and I can't remember that much raging happening because of it either. What happened happened, and it went pretty smoothly. RP fights can be fun instead of painful for some because, well, we came here to escape the constant killing happening in PVP servers and can rp here without that pain. I really like that part of LotC, and was hoping it wouldn't have to change. People might like to rage about powergaming, but wasn't that what the whitelist application is for? Why do we have to, even though we have the question in the application to prevent people powergaming, do PVP fights automatically? I hope others agree, but there's nothing truly wrong with RP battles. It's just that people don't want to see their characters lose. But won't the same thing happen in PVP, really? People flame about hunger bars not being full and disadvantaged fights because they simply could not afford different things. I feel like we should NOT move from RP, because there is a distinct line here that makes Lord of the Craft what it is, and that is the beautiful roleplay experience you can get here.

That was back before the community became like....well....this.

[Samson Option 9652]

Please only vote, people need to take it upon themselves to work arguments to it's logical conclusions rather than billy-club each other over the internet. Thank You.

 

PS: Remember, it is a privilege to be on this server, thus we have applications to prove the worthiness of the privilege bestowed.

[Song Druid 1486]

Hey.  I like your compromise Biaus.  Not really into debating either or as I don't plan on getting into any fights (I can't afford to kill my character off!) but this seems like a really nice medium.

[Aislin 4354]

RP fights shouldn't be the standard. Sure, we're on an RP server, but the actual combat is not what we're here to RP. It's the "before" and "after" of the combat that's interesting and vital to the server. Not 45 minute powergame-fests. I'll happily have a fun RP fight with a trusted roleplayer/friend, but if I walked into Abresi and tried to start an RP fight, chances are it'd turn into an OOC raging flame war. PvP cuts out the bullshit in combat.

[Samson Option 9652]

I want to really confirm this, but RP-PvP is NOT doing a MineZ approach of 'Render Distance Far, I see a nameplate, walk up and damage him". Rather, it is roleplaying the necessary conversations, the necessary actions to make the other person realise that 'my character is being affected with a violent measure. Once again, the violent measure is not supposed to be the first road taken and through encouragement, PvP won't even become an issue except honestly by militaries or bandits. Exceptions to the rule can easily be forged and Metagaming rules still apply. My system, albeit I didnt intend it to be a '3rd option', is honestly a middle-way Nirvana between those who find respect in realising that they are playing Minecraft.exe and thus mechanics should be used, and those who have the time and 'hopefully' the impartiality to roleplay fight.

[Samson Option 9652]

RP fights shouldn't be the standard. Sure, we're on an RP server, but the actual combat is not what we're here to RP. It's the "before" and "after" of the combat that's interesting and vital to the server. Not 45 minute powergame-fests. I'll happily have a fun RP fight with a trusted roleplayer/friend, but if I walked into Abresi and tried to start an RP fight, chances are it'd turn into an OOC raging flame war. PvP cuts out the bullshit in combat.

Quoted for Truth, the complaints about 'PvP doesn't allow RP to flourish is rather ironic since we want players to be encouraged in using their creativity; less time spent trying to corner with emotes and more time doing various other RPs with the 10 minute - one hour reduction if RP default was still in place. Leave some to the imagination of a man's or woman's mind by the way, most emotes try to be grandiose and over-the-top dictating to players how they must absolutely see what is happening. ;)

[blindmind 350]

I want to really confirm this, but RP-PvP is NOT doing a MineZ approach of 'Render Distance Far, I see a nameplate, walk up and damage him". Rather, it is roleplaying the necessary conversations, the necessary actions to make the other person realise that 'my character is being affected with a violent measure. Once again, the violent measure is not supposed to be the first road taken and through encouragement, PvP won't even become an issue except honestly by militaries or bandits. Exceptions to the rule can easily be forged and Metagaming rules still apply. My system, albeit I didnt intend it to be a '3rd option', is honestly a middle-way Nirvana between those who find respect in realising that they are playing Minecraft.exe and thus mechanics should be used, and those who have the time and 'hopefully' the impartiality to roleplay fight.

This is what Gaius means by substantial RP and necessary actions before PvP ensues. I posted it somewhere before, but just to hammer the point home:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cCV_4pZ9rA

 

You have your villain (the obvious nazi) and your regular joe (the guy protecting his friends in the basement). We all know what is about to happen. It's the promise of the engagement. However, it's the lead up to the event of combat that really builds the tension, which makes the PvP such a climax. Quentin Tarantino knows how to RP right before PvP.

[Elfen_ 232]

I don't really understand how having PvP default would be good for the server. This isn't Aegis guys. And it will never be like Aegis. Ever. And as far as I am concern about all my combat was done by RP.

[Samson Option 9652]

This is what Gaius means by substantial RP and necessary actions before PvP ensues. I posted it somewhere before, but just to hammer the point home:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cCV_4pZ9rA

 

You have your villain (the obvious nazi) and your regular joe (the guy protecting his friends in the basement). We all know what is about to happen. It's the promise of the engagement. However, it's the lead up to the event of combat that really builds the tension, which makes the PvP such a climax. Quentin Tarantino knows how to RP right before PvP.

 

I thought it was using Keyblades :3

[blindmind 350]

I thought it was using Keyblades :3

[firespirit44 1323]

I cba to read through 40+ pages of comments that basically go "This is a RP server" or "Pvp wont hurt you, you can still rp combat!"

I just want to give a small little view on two of my greatest moments of rp combat.

1) Aegis

When Jack was 55 years old, growing as a old ranger, he stumbled upon a undead necromancer, and 2 cultist minion. A brief conversation was held, but my imagination was in overdrive. They were on higher ground, and was really talking to me arrogantly. I knew three against one would mean certain doom, so I played it cautiously. The cultist then lead another cultist away, leaving the armed cultist to fight me.

The cultist was clad in leather and had a diamond sword(a rarity in aegis times)

I had a iron sword, and absolutely no armour.

He asked me for any last words, and I replied "None". We rushed at each other admist the night storm, and fought furiously for only a short span of 1 minute or less. But that was so fulfilling, my adrenaline was pumping for at least 10 minutes.

The point is not the pvp, its the culmination of the rp that was set in pvp. It was so real, my vision was disjointed(mc kiting), my heart rate was increasing. You just dont get the same thrill from rp fights which is more akin to playing chess with questionable people. PVP is set in stone, rp fights always have something here or there.

2) Asulon

My friend was possessed by a enderman(dont ask, it was approved lore), and granting him a bipolar disorder. It seems like he was sporadically turning hostile, and one time while we were walking around the resource town in hanseti, he had one of his 'attacks'

His voice became hoarse and craggy, his eyes turning deep purple, pupils vanishing.

He was insane, he asked me a bunch of random questions that were incredibly difficult. I actually perspired a little, like a test before death. He smiled widely at the last question, and said "You failed."

Armour as deep as midnight encased the body, and a sword rose from the ground, cascaded in spikes (he just mcly equiped it). He drew it from the ground, and stated he would free me from ignorance.

He had full diamond, I only had a diamond sword and iron.

We agreed oocly to kill off our characters if we lost the pvp battle. Then battle commence.

Admist the falling snow and the sounds of our boots crunching the layers of ice and rock, it was a beautiful moment. I was so relieved when I saw his mass of items, sprawled in the shape of his body on the ground.

I just want to say, pvp gave me some of the most amazing rp on this server. So please dont think pvp as shallow.

[Silevon 497]

I suggest a re-poll without Gaius's option. Just to keep it fair, as it is clear he most likely wont win.

 

His suggestion was never meant to be added, but I believe they are simply counting his votes as PvP default votes.

 

I cba to read through 40+ pages of comments that basically go "This is a RP server" or "Pvp wont hurt you, you can still rp combat!"

I just want to give a small little view on two of my greatest moments of rp combat.

1) Aegis

When Jack was 55 years old, growing as a old ranger, he stumbled upon a undead necromancer, and 2 cultist minion. A brief conversation was held, but my imagination was in overdrive. They were on higher ground, and was really talking to me arrogantly. I knew three against one would mean certain doom, so I played it cautiously. The cultist then lead another cultist away, leaving the armed cultist to fight me.

The cultist was clad in leather and had a diamond sword(a rarity in aegis times)

I had a iron sword, and absolutely no armour.

He asked me for any last words, and I replied "None". We rushed at each other admist the night storm, and fought furiously for only a short span of 1 minute or less. But that was so fulfilling, my adrenaline was pumping for at least 10 minutes.

The point is not the pvp, its the culmination of the rp that was set in pvp. It was so real, my vision was disjointed(mc kiting), my heart rate was increasing. You just dont get the same thrill from rp fights which is more akin to playing chess with questionable people. PVP is set in stone, rp fights always have something here or there.

2) Asulon

My friend was possessed by a enderman(dont ask, it was approved lore), and granting him a bipolar disorder. It seems like he was sporadically turning hostile, and one time while we were walking around the resource town in hanseti, he had one of his 'attacks'

His voice became hoarse and craggy, his eyes turning deep purple, pupils vanishing.

He was insane, he asked me a bunch of random questions that were incredibly difficult. I actually perspired a little, like a test before death. He smiled widely at the last question, and said "You failed."

Armour as deep as midnight encased the body, and a sword rose from the ground, cascaded in spikes (he just mcly equiped it). He drew it from the ground, and stated he would free me from ignorance.

He had full diamond, I only had a diamond sword and iron.

We agreed oocly to kill off our characters if we lost the pvp battle. Then battle commence.

Admist the falling snow and the sounds of our boots crunching the layers of ice and rock, it was a beautiful moment. I was so relieved when I saw his mass of items, sprawled in the shape of his body on the ground.

I just want to say, pvp gave me some of the most amazing rp on this server. So please dont think pvp as shallow.

 

Absolutely amazing post. Could not +1 more.

[Lego XBOX 915]

You complain about role-play fighting creating so much drama during fights... Who complains about that... PvPers.

But yet, when PvP becoming default comes up, 45 pages of drama appear within 24 hours. Is that not a bit contradictory?

Imagine the drama which will come from making PvP default. Half the server will still be unhappy and it will still cause this much drama.

Furthermore, the sentence "Deal with it in RP" will no longer be valid, for RP will become essentially PvP in conflict situations. I much prefer a long intense and brain using fight to a click fest which takes less than a minute which will end with that one who is better at PvP.

The plugin seems great and all, but that is useful for wars. Small scale combat should be kept to RP as it is at a smaller scale and each strike counts for something.

Looking at it scientifically:
- Macroscopic Level :: Battles in large groups. Victory is based on the opposing side being destroyed or routed. It is each death which counts towards the victory.
- Microscopic Level :: Fights between a low amount of players (5 max). Victory is based on the opposing entities taking fatal blows. It is each strike which counts towards the victory.

If we were to place PvP into the microscopic level, we may as well change war-claim battles into an automatic resolution like in Civilisation or Europa Universalis.