What To Do About Villain Applications? Community Poll

[mmat 7460]

They are retarded though.

[shiftnative 3103]

Back in the day, if someone wanted to kill my character or my people for loot or just because - we roleplayed it as their character wanted to kill for loot or just because.

 

As-long as you're clever with how you punish these kinds villains and/or talk to them about providing mutual roleplay (in a polite way.) then I think we'll be fine. (as-well as put a "things to remember" at spawn.)

No one should have to visit the forum to play the game, aside from their white-list application.

 

[Aislin 4354]

I'm sorry Ski, but simply saying that weakening the VA has made villainous RP better does not make it so simply because someone says it is.  I've seen first hand from monitoring the villain community how it has deterred from what it should be.  Every point I just made I stand completely fully behind.  The only other thing I can add is that most of you fail to realise how much you can do without a VA.  Go ahead and hunt down that person whom slaughtered your family member, because your examples of things you need VA's for, are things you don't need them for.  Remember, if we're to make a change to the server for the better, we are going to need all the help we can receive from you.  Don't just sit here and say.  "Sorry, this is bad."  Show us it is bad, bring it to our attention with screenshots if need be, because currently I see retracting anything from the villain application to be harmful to the server.  Some of you may want to go back and read my post, rather than assume its some hellspawn comment about taking away your freedom and skip over it.

 

How am I meant to get screenshots of the VA system restricting roleplay and deterring new players?

 

I could go to the revoke section of the VA forum, show you all the revokes from when the VA system was super complicated and needlessly bloated, then contrast that to the few revokes we have now? Maybe that would prove to you that we can be trusted with leftclicking each other and rightclicking chests ?

[Ventusyr 233]

Well, for one, if MA's are not necessary, than VA's are most certainly not necessary. VA's should have been cut long before MA's.

Truthfully, VA's are a form of power-gaming. You are not able to advance your character without OOC approval. I think that role-playing in itself is to make an interesting conflict for two parties, so it should be a requirement to understand this in the initial application.

The initial application needs to be the basis for introduction and smooth transition into Lord of the Craft. It should be a pre-requisite to get along with other people to play on a multiplayer server.

I agree with this. I agree so much.

EDIT:

I think you should stop being so condescending to new players. They are not all mindless retards who wouldn't know a rule if it hit them in the face and just want to steal everything and ruin it for people. Give new players a bit of support and credit

Heh. Hehehe. Have you ever taken the time to read rough player applications? Have you read ban reports for new players? They aren't mindless retards, but a good portion of them don't read the rules or the lore and giving them the power to inflict whatever they want on other players WILL lead to a ban report on said new player, leading to them leaving the server. They need some time to build relations with people and learning to roleplay before they can be trusted with the responsibility of killing/robbing/mugging a player.

Unfortunately, though, as someone who was about to engage in what COULD HAVE been some decent roleplay had the "victim" (he was a criminal being arrested) accuse my friends of disobeying VA rules, leading to an OOC ban report, I really find VAs to be a hindrance to roleplay. Besides, considering we've abolished magical magic, we should just get rid of VAs too.

[paulie 181]

 

I don't understand this sudden hate towards applications for extra rights.

If someone is willing enough to go an extra mile just to gain useful rights, let them, because if you remove all these apps people will be excusable for a lot more.

[Trips 344]

I'm not sure if you realize the amount of edgy removal of the VA:s would create?

 

Well, let me give you a scenario here, on what would and will happen if VA:s are removed, instead we should add MA:s back in my opinion, so people don't get butthurt over the "fairness" and all that ****.

This is how it will go down probably after two weeks:

 

 

It is year 1450, 2013 in the sky-gods' eyes, the year when sky-gods assembled in their holy chambers and decided to gift all

beings on Anthos completely free will, and unlock their ability of controlling their moral. The morality of the human race, the elves, the uruk, the halflings and dwarves were locked by the sky-gods before, unlockable with an odd ritual - confirmed by deities, but now, the sky gods want to test Anthos by bringing the true apocalypse upon it; The Edgy-Eruption, otherwise known as Edgeruption. And as the sky-gods decided the change, they also simultaneously threw off several deities off their thrones; the one's who had the job of confirming if people can handle their unrestricted lifestyles.

 

Thus, apocalypse began, the people of the land who seemed so peaceful before, started stealing anything they could -even dirt. Some people on the other hand, lost their minds completely and became absolutely insane with no apparent reason, while

other people suddenly started enjoying cannibalistic meals. Killings became a lot more common, and magically most people learnt

how to lockpick like professionals; probably because breaking a window is considerably harder (15% harder). Rapture was upon Anthos truly, and no preachers were to warn this. The warning signs of the Edgeruption weren't subtle though, they were quite clear but no one simply recognized them. Little did the people of Anthos know, the sudden holes in the world popping up from the Void were an attempt of warning them. Too bad it was too late, the Edgeruption had already begun, and there was no way of stopping it.. except if someone was able to preach to the people early enough, not to remove the locks of morality in the brains of the people.

 

Unfortunately, too many people seemed to wish to unlock their locked wills, and continued on convincing the higher sky-gods of removing the brain-cell known as the VA by telling the gods that they should put their trust in them.. but they were backstabbers.

The moment the gods agreed to the change, all hell broke loose; magic and villains where absolutely everywhere, and new kept popping up. This made all the cities, including Lenfarthing, seem like warzones. The Edgy-Eruption also resulted in mass escaping

of people. some even decided to commit suicide and thus permanently escape the former circulation of life; it was the biggest mistake by the gods so far. What the gods should have done instead, was to put a lock in the brains of the people for connecting to the void again, making it easier to open, but still making it exclusive for those who can handle the power; just like with the morality before..

 

Everything was fine back in 1448, when edgies were people doing backflips and unnecessary moves, with Eastener-swords and silly hairstyles, but when the edgery spread like plague.. it wasn't jolly anymore.  My only hope is that the sky-gods will roll back time back to the time before the signs of apocalypse were starting, even before the removal of locks in the minds of people for connecting to the void, since that is when things started going downhill. I mean, I know how hard it was to find people who weren't ready for any kind of combat even back then, but now everyone is just killing eachother and stealing whatever they can.

 

- Prophet Lucilfier, Anthos  1st of Sun's edge 1450 EEE (Edgy Eruption-era)

 

[Xerxes_XIII 2 200]

I fear the day that the server no longer has villain apps. For many a noob shall indeed simply walk in to mordor. Or Malinor. And burn it and kill things without proper emoting.

[iris1612 1780]

I think that VAs are useful, constructive ways of stopping huge amounts of chaos. It keeps things balanced, at least a little bit. I have trouble with VAs and writing essays in general, believe me. I've never gotten an accepted VA in one try, but I still think we should keep them. They're good to regulate things, make it less crazy. I know they aren't perfect, and I agree that it does hinder character development, but I still think they should stay.

[Dalek348 1962]

I always see GMs and players alike say that it is the 'LOTC community' not the map which makes a map good. And they are right, they are looking to pursue an Aegis feel to the 4th map, to make the server carefree, fun, enjoyable and cooperative.

 

Villain applications only perpetuate the bad and negative feeling that the LOTC community has right now that the GMs want to eradicate. The 4th map must be a turning point for the server, and the removal of the villain application system is one of the factors that will help the server turn back around on the up. 

 

People shouldn't be able to stop someone by nagging them about '((Do you have a VA for that?)' and people should not be punished because they did not fill in an application form to make an action in a game. Removing villain applications will stop the negative LOTC community from stifling each other's creativity.

[iris1612 1780]

Maybe I'm just very new, but I've been in about 25 or so rp battles, and I have never once been asked for a VA. Besides, that's not really a problem. If you want to do a villainous action and don't want somebody to ask you for your VA, keep a window with your VA in it open. Or bookmark it. That way it's easy. It's not that big of a deal.

[Lathros 377]

Remove those sons of *******.

Amen

 

Edit : If someone really wanted to wreak havoc they would've made a VA by now. When you remove them what's going to happen? Everyone is not simply going to go around killing everyone. We have a thing called jails. And, if we don't use those jails, since we don't have VAs we can kill them :D

[argonian 14254]

VAs make the transition to becoming evil less natural and less gradual. And becoming a villain isn't something that you should plan happens weeks in advance, it should be because of something that happened to your character. A traumatic event or whatever. VAs are great if you happen to be a writer who likes scripting everything that happens to your character, but it's bad for people that aren't so great writers or like going with the flow and letting their characters be changed by what happens to them in normal, unscripted RP.

[snakeyeeees 15]

I like the idea of not having villain apps as at times I have found with out one I have been limited on things I might of wished to do to some people so I chose to vote to remove VA's, I could now list many reasons why I came to such a conclusion and how I think everything will be fine and it will be eventually worked out but truthfully I think removing it will bring good roleplay & some back I actually think it will cause untold amounts of whinning and bickering but since it is not my job to deal with such matters I chose to go with what I thought would be fun for me personally not that I acutally have been on in sometime so mabey what I feel I would enjoy would fit better but in a sense the people who abuse once the VA's are said removed could they not just be reported?Hm but I will list a few just for fun, for one writing Va's for some took time; yes it does in some forms show certain creditable traits for the say postion but for people who mabey do not have the best wirting skills and by that I do not mean grammer it was often found somewhat harder so this might bring about more entertaining villian roleplay or just a bunch of pvp happy robbers and bandits but time will only tell. I like the idea of being able to do a villain like act without the idea of making a application to do so and possibly if say people abuse or go crazy with it I think such actions could just be reported once again stated but thats just me.

 

lastly I support this also as it makes sense since it's removal was made to make the server more enticing to new player, I do not see why the removal of va's would not do the same sure it would bring more people but would they be good roleplays well thats really for time to tell but I find it funny some were so supportive to remove something they may of not be apart of but it seems the tides have suddenly turned when it effects them?

 

  Aislin If MAs have been deemed illogical and unneeded by the staff, then VAs by default should be granted the same treatment.

 

when I said I support this I ment the quote just to clarify.

 

 

[Priceflash 832]

Let me just say this: For if VA's are removed, and people abuse it in ways they shouldn't, then they shouldn't have been accepted to the server in the first place. Villain roleplay is no harder than any other, and if they cannot do it properly, what makes you think they'll roleplay anything else properly? Considering new rules would obviously come into play if they were removed, people who were horribad at RP'ing them would probably be dealt with accordingly. Also, the fact that the community despises each other, everyone saying that someone will abuse it is sickening. People that already want to be villains probably already ARE villains. Removing them allows further character development, and less scripting to roleplay, which I find stupid, as you're playing the character, not being an omniscient author who forms his story without allowing him to develop himself. Anywho, many other servers have easily accomplished just not even having a villain application or any rules against villainy except maybe fighting at spawn, and honestly, LOTC is one of the few I've seen that have done it. All it seems to have caused is conflict, as well as a lack of trust in the community. LOTC has guarded itself with applications because of distrust with it's community- but why should it? There is applications for a reason, and if they fail to do their job, then the Application Team has failed, perhaps even the application itself. Of course the Application Team does their best, but perhaps it is not enough. When you apply, you apply to roleplay your character, and his/her/it's development may change over time. I believe that the application process shouldn't be extreme, but nor should it be easy.

                        I don't believe the heart of the problem and conflict even lives at the application team- I believe there truly is no conflict. Upon removing villain applications, and hell, even having few restrictions for villainy besides psychopathy, new roleplay would emerge. People could actually develop their characters, not having to deny a villain who is asking for you to help them do something villainous, when your character may have said yes if you actually had a VA accepted. The trust members of the server put in the other members is extraordinarily low. The application should moderate who gets into the server, determining whether they'd be trusted with any of these things. I don't see why the community isn't confident in it's members, considering there IS a whitelist, and it generally prevents people who would abuse things like magic and villainy from getting in. The staff team is responsible for sweeping up those who do pass through the gates that are the whitelist application, and generally few remain. Removing the VA would only be beneficial, and I doubt there would be a huge increase in villainy.

I also think the restrictions on villainy should be relatively few, as other servers thrive in environments without, so why cannot we?

[Primrose 59]

I think you should stop being so condescending to new players. They are not all mindless retards who wouldn't know a rule if it hit them in the face and just want to steal everything and ruin it for people. Give new players a bit of support and credit

 

What Credit should you give to someone that has not proven they can rp properly. My Thought would be for it to be required to link examples of your rp so the reviewing VAT can have a small taste of how you rp. Or at least have a short trial rp time of lock picking a simple chest. It will prove they can do the emotes with some creativity if nothing more than the proper amount of emotes. 

 

From being a lazy person myself I can tell you that If i did not have to write what i had to write, my character that i have been playing for about half a year now, would not be nearly as detailed as she is. I was forced to re-think my whole character and her motives more than once. At the end of the day after playing with the good and the bad players, I have found it comes down to really one thing. Are you creative enough to make enjoyable role play for yourself and other players. If so then most other things will fall into place. This server is about having fun, being creative and taking apart of yourself that you can never see yourself doing or being in the shitty world we all run away from and let it grow and blossom here, and make some friends while doing that. 

 

That's it, that's all this server is about. Now can we stop fighting on forums and get back to the wars we are planning on the server, Please?