Roleplay Style and Dialogue

[indiana105 5126]

8 hours ago, _AzureLexi said:

Ik this is a PCSwift post but I still feel obligatory to add my thoughts

The "marvel-ification" IMO seems pretty much a consequence of the over-saturation of conflict on the server. As annoying as it is when people's first response to "There's a demon" is "Ooh time to kill :D", there really is no natural response when there's something violent every other day. My own character was originally intended to be fairly sensitive, but simply existing in the setting has caused her to begin regarding death and violence very nonchalantly. People making quips and joking in the face of violence, is just another extension of this "over-saturation" of violence.

the natural response of a medieval-ish human to seeing a “demon” should be to throw rocks at it until it stops moving or run away 

 

but what I usually see is just:

 

 “they’re so misunderstood… actually, hmph… they’re kinda like us. just more twisted and f*cked up…” 

 

why? idk. pls everyone just go back to larping game of thrones this dnd slop is too much 

[Cheese 8881]

 

9 hours ago, PCSwift said:

I have seen a massive increase in modern-age dialogue from people on this server. I don't mean people talking in casual prose, or even just using contractions. I mean people using modern terms like 'girlfriend' or 'ex' which stick out like a sore thumb. Small, innane things that might not really get a second glance. When people 'fire' an arrow instead of loosing it. These are just examples of things I see regarding modern language and the like, obviously you can use these terms in roleplay as they can make sense in the world, but I just see it and immediately lose immersion. "Yeah that guy's just a dude behind a screen" type shit.

 

Bro it's minecraft roleplay no one is here for the historical accuracy or Shakespearean levels of writing

[PrimnyaQuorum 3999]

26 minutes ago, indiana105 said:

the natural response of a medieval-ish human to seeing a “demon” should be to throw rocks at it until it stops moving or run away 

 

but what I usually see is just:

 

 “they’re so misunderstood… actually, hmph… they’re kinda like us. just more twisted and f*cked up…” 

 

why? idk. pls everyone just go back to larping game of thrones this dnd slop is too much 

demon player here

 

i enjoy when people do both - its usually a free soul either way.

 

In seriousness, people's response to demons/darkspawn should be developed throughout RP, not a discord server checklist of approved actions/reactions. If your character is raised in a culture of shoot first, ask later - yea, rock throwing and running away is fine, though I have my own concerns about children making a valiant last stand against anything they see with fully coherent, articulate sentences (seriously, its a epidemic of child soldiers around humanity)

 

Equally, if your Character is raised in a culture of asking questions and attempting some form of resolution - perhaps the first few times you encounter a demon, you'll just fall for its ability to not be forced to act as a mindless CRP goon and learn to react differently later (I know, Character Development, what a horror to RP). Either way, their should be no OOC "this is the right way to act", imo. Exceptions obviously exist for mandatory quipping and other such modern-day tomfooleries, but I think some things are just a product of LoTC being LoTC. 

 

Everyone's expected to rally to everything - why are you upset when a problem starts, everyone responds? YOU (Not specifically you, Indi, Plural You) helped create the culture where inaction is considered a most heinous offense OOCly and ICly - live with it, or start IRPly shifting the culture to mind your own business. Complaining about it on the forums is silly - RP the way you want people to RP and if people like it, they'll follow suit. I can probably guess quipping RP came from people of importance/cliques doing it, and it trickled down.

 

I'll happily CRP people where there is a dialogue mixed into the actual fighting emotes between two characters, or total silence, or some weird Owyn guy chanting litanies or power-ups before he does things - its engaging, its funny, and typically it has no effect. When people go out of their way to marvel quip ("Wow, he sure burnt well") it does dilute the vibe but it doesn't happen as often unless the community around that player is equally unserious/very OOC. 

 

I could care less if someones way of speaking is archaic, or modern in character,  so long as its consistent and has a purpose to telling the story of their character and is not a vessel for the player behind that characters OOC intentions - I distinctly recall a particular Petran killing himself after the Veletzian war, only to magically return at the first sign of internal conflict within Petra without any real influence or purpose beyond "Hey I want in this potential WC" - Doesn't matter how modernspeak or Shakespearespeak is used there, its pretty obvious thats just a OOC Vessel for clicks. 

[indiana105 5126]

15 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

demon player here

 

i enjoy when people do both - its usually a free soul either way.

 

In seriousness, people's response to demons/darkspawn should be developed throughout RP, not a discord server checklist of approved actions/reactions. If your character is raised in a culture of shoot first, ask later - yea, rock throwing and running away is fine, though I have my own concerns about children making a valiant last stand against anything they see with fully coherent, articulate sentences (seriously, its a epidemic of child soldiers around humanity)

 

Equally, if your Character is raised in a culture of asking questions and attempting some form of resolution - perhaps the first few times you encounter a demon, you'll just fall for its ability to not be forced to act as a mindless CRP goon and learn to react differently later (I know, Character Development, what a horror to RP). Either way, their should be no OOC "this is the right way to act", imo. Exceptions obviously exist for mandatory quipping …

starting off w “it’s a free soul anyways” is crazy. I don’t care that everyone ganks darkspawn it’s a legitimate reaction. 
 

“Quipping” is not as harmful to the “vibe” as not having any respect for the vibe in the first place is. That’s the problem w MEDIEVAL(inspired) HUMANS (I was specific, I don’t care what sans eye elves do) being so open and welcoming to everyone and everything. If it’s done by “”””leadership”””” it’s ALWAYS because “hey man don’t turn them away! that’s another active player we could bring in!” 
 

it dilutes the established culture of the low-fantasy human nations and turns them into dnd taverns. I don’t care that darkspawn/anime villain characters exist. They can rp however they want. I care that nation leaders r entirely disinterested in cultivating a coherent rp setting and encourage stupid rp from their players (I complain and act on this constantly in big evil haense for all the good it does)

[PrimnyaQuorum 3999]

23 minutes ago, indiana105 said:

starting off w “it’s a free soul anyways” is crazy. I don’t care that everyone ganks darkspawn it’s a legitimate reaction. 
 

“Quipping” is not as harmful to the “vibe” as not having any respect for the vibe in the first place is. That’s the problem w MEDIEVAL(inspired) HUMANS (I was specific, I don’t care what sans eye elves do) being so open and welcoming to everyone and everything. If it’s done by “”””leadership”””” it’s ALWAYS because “hey man don’t turn them away! that’s another active player we could bring in!” 
 

it dilutes the established culture of the low-fantasy human nations and turns them into dnd taverns. 

 

I personally find it difficult to find a difference at face value in the 7 or so human nations, considering they are all
A) Canonist
B) Low-Fantasy (as you put it)

C) Incredibly OOCly driven by a need to conform/fit into the nation/church at all levels, ICly and OOCly. 

 

Yea, I can respect the Haeseni have a vast and varied culture compared to the Hyspians, or Balian, or Ravenmire, or Veletz - because they all do, don't get me wrong - but for a new player, the only difference they really see up front is "Ea'm" instead of "I'm" or the half-usage of languages intermixed into common, or accents. I find it a little funny I see Petra as a exception, mostly because it doesn't force adherence down someones throat right away.

 

Culture is culture as long as people want to engage with it. If its buried beneath 300 forum post overs the last 10 years and exists only there, its history lol. If it's not actually present in day-to-day RP, who's going to care but the 10 or so players per community who actually make a effort to track/document/update these things, and typically end up burnt out or disgruntled against that community. 

 

If there were high-fantasy humans, I think I might have somewhat more sympathy, but at this point you can pick and choose your cookie-cut version of low fantasy humans depending on how much effort you want to spend typing a funny amalgamation of language and accents. I have not been around dwarfs/elfs/orcs enough to gauge such, though I definitely appreciated reading what Sean was doing with the orcs in making the culture less standoff-ish and more approachable. 

 

It's not just that every rallies to jump darkspawn, as other people have put it better then I probably could. I don't mind either, as someone who plays a Darkspawn CA, that a entirely village will rally to fight back - it just forces the darkspawn to be more intelligent. Yea it is a free soul when a 7 year old throws a rock and then proceeds to get beat up by a stronger demon - child solider L I guess, but low-fantasy human culture does not extend to anything beyond, typically "You're not like me, bad!" -  which is probably the blandest thing to run across on half the server in all its various ways. It's always just this "We have history!" or "We shouldn't be so trusting!" or "We're different then that guy!" or my favorite "We have a right to hate anyone who isn't us, its just RP!"; Which works great when you're talking about magic and creatures and elves, and less so when its used against different people based on IRL arguments near-verbatim.  

 

All of that to say - a New Player will likely never see what a "culture" is, because they hear about the OOC/see the quipping and marvel-ing/see how if they dont absolutely conform they're unwanted OOCly and ICly over any "culture" a place has, because why would anyone go somewhere to be hated OOCly for what a character does ICly?

 

Tavern RP culture exists because no one wants to go through all that to see the "Real" culture. I think there's a good reason people in Royal Courts tend to be newer and stay, rather then just wandering into the city and being told to get lost right away by someone who has no real intent to RP beyond a few people.

[indiana105 5126]

13 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

snip

 

i think i disagree w/ almost everything you just said. as a new player the only thing attractive to me about lotc was the culture/history. still is, because i find settings where it's "gods fighting and a bunch of epic mages saving the day" unbelievably boring. also numendil and norland both exist and are active, one of which isnt canonist and the other is gondor. 

 

we obviously want different things from rp. i am here to do feudal/medieval roleplay. you are here to do dnd roleplay. my haense character at the time you made yours became a mundane knight, and haus weiss went off to become an elf with cosmic orbs and stacked magic

[lemonke 6014]

19 minutes ago, PrimnyaQuorum said:

 

I personally find it difficult to find a difference at face value in the 7 or so human nations, considering they are all
A) Canonist
B) Low-Fantasy (as you put it)

C) Incredibly OOCly driven by a need to conform/fit into the nation/church at all levels, ICly and OOCly. 

 

Yea, I can respect the Haeseni have a vast and varied culture compared to the Hyspians, or Balian, or Ravenmire, or Veletz - because they all do, don't get me wrong - but for a new player, the only difference they really see up front is "Ea'm" instead of "I'm" or the half-usage of languages intermixed into common, or accents. I find it a little funny I see Petra as a exception, mostly because it doesn't force adherence down someones throat right away.

 

Culture is culture as long as people want to engage with it. If its buried beneath 300 forum post overs the last 10 years and exists only there, its history lol. If it's not actually present in day-to-day RP, who's going to care but the 10 or so players per community who actually make a effort to track/document/update these things, and typically end up burnt out or disgruntled against that community. 

 

If there were high-fantasy humans, I think I might have somewhat more sympathy, but at this point you can pick and choose your cookie-cut version of low fantasy humans depending on how much effort you want to spend typing a funny amalgamation of language and accents. I have not been around dwarfs/elfs/orcs enough to gauge such, though I definitely appreciated reading what Sean was doing with the orcs in making the culture less standoff-ish and more approachable. 

 

It's not just that every rallies to jump darkspawn, as other people have put it better then I probably could. I don't mind either, as someone who plays a Darkspawn CA, that a entirely village will rally to fight back - it just forces the darkspawn to be more intelligent. Yea it is a free soul when a 7 year old throws a rock and then proceeds to get beat up by a stronger demon - child solider L I guess, but low-fantasy human culture does not extend to anything beyond, typically "You're not like me, bad!" -  which is probably the blandest thing to run across on half the server in all its various ways. It's always just this "We have history!" or "We shouldn't be so trusting!" or "We're different then that guy!" or my favorite "We have a right to hate anyone who isn't us, its just RP!"; Which works great when you're talking about magic and creatures and elves, and less so when its used against different people based on IRL arguments near-verbatim.  

 

All of that to say - a New Player will likely never see what a "culture" is, because they hear about the OOC/see the quipping and marvel-ing/see how if they dont absolutely conform they're unwanted OOCly and ICly over any "culture" a place has, because why would anyone go somewhere to be hated OOCly for what a character does ICly?

 

Tavern RP culture exists because no one wants to go through all that to see the "Real" culture. I think there's a good reason people in Royal Courts tend to be newer and stay, rather then just wandering into the city and being told to get lost right away by someone who has no real intent to RP beyond a few people.

Lotc is the only fantasy rp server where people prefer playing normal christian humans than magic creatures or similar cool shit. Never seen other server with a predominance of that. For some reason, instead of praising magic, it's at times just frowned upon OOC. 

 

People can do whatever they want, of course. But alas, many ppl here will judge your ways on a ooc level because u don't rp like them.

[Werew0lf 24180]

I think it is just a matter of preference and RP audience. 

 

Some people just want to roleplay their medieval human character, and wants to live in a high-fantasy setting with low-fantasy intentions. They aren't avoiding the shit that's happening in the world, because generally, it doesn't concern them -- what could the lowborn farmer do when two Gods are rumbling mountains and shaking the world? The only gripe I have with those sort of roleplayers is when there is no effort to put in a reaction. You don't even need to exuberate some sort of crazy response. Just even taking notice of it and the adverse effects it brings into the roleplay would be good enough. Most of these low-fantasy medieval fuedal roleplayers will still be happy to engage with high-fantasy tropes. Look at Haense; they didn't **** off the Prince of Carrion inferi siege, and I'm certain if a dragon flew overhead to try and burn their capital down, they'd do the correct RP to deal with it. At the same time, Haense is an evil cursed nation of OOC plotters that needs to go down!!!! ( @indiana105) ( @GMRO) ( @ferdaboy ) ( @Halt) < OOC plotters in question metaplaying. 

 

You then swiftly shift over to the high-fantasy elf mage who uses magic to stack and powergame against others. They're more likely to be drawn into magical high-fantasy events and sometimes, even to an OOC level, they shun the low-fantasy roleplayers. They are also more likely to quip, because, well, 'yeah ive seen that before', or, 'heh gods fighting again? well, guess another is gonna die' sort of shit. 

 

When looking between the two, I'd prefer the low-fantasy medieval roleplay. I feel as though if I dropped an event for them, they'd have a more certain reaction. They don't regularly see it, it's not normal for them, so when they come across it, they have a better reaction. On top of this, they aren't seeing crazy stuff happen on the constant. 

 

Regarding RP language, I think quippers are the bane of roleplay. I get the over-saturation of conflict, but I'm certain if Godzilla is trying to stomp on you, you aren't going "heh 🤓 well, guess its time to fight again," in the middle of uncertain death. The marvel quippism is so horrendous. Yeah, I get vibe, I get story -- cool, you've been around for thirty years IRL because you don't want to PK your character so you've seen everything, but just a tad of flavour and the RP isn't spoiled. I haven't actually experienced roleplay as a player character since I joined the ST - at least properly - so I'm only talking as a DM. It's so lame man. It makes running events so annoying because now I have to deal with marvel-quipper-1 who's ruined the vibe. 

 

I also get the PCSwift comment on modern language being dragged into roleplay. I get it completely tbf -- look, if you're with your friends and doing a bit of sly meme RP, fair enough. You're just having a bit of fun. Even in events, when players are in VC together and are having fun, a bit of tomfoolery pops out. Yeah, fair. Nobody is expecting you to type like Shakespeare ( @Valannor < shakespeare rper btw) but I don't want to hear someone scream "skibidi toilet fanum tax rizz" whilst theyre running from a demon. 

 

 

[Wizry 1218]

Edited November 4, 2024 by Wizry

[wowj 9747]

45 minutes ago, Werew0lf said:

Yeah, I get vibe, I get story -- cool, you've been around for thirty years IRL because you don't want to PK your character so you've seen everything, but just a tad of flavour and the RP isn't spoiled.

I feel like even for the characters who have been around for 30 irl years and characters who have seen death constantly dont even roleplay being desensitized correctly, they only act like that during combat so they can go **heh, i've seen THIS before.. then the second combat ends or the scary monster runs away the character whose been around for 30 irl years returns back into being a Slice of Life normal person.. PICK ONE!

[Cat Evocation 3728]

Everyone dogging on @PCSwift just cause its swift but he's actually giving a decent take out and posting it despite knowing nothing will change.

 

It is a problem, and I don't think much will ever change unfortunately. @ScreamingDingo made a big post on it and while some of it were takes, I disagreed with a lot of it were genuine issues in regards of quality of roleplay vs "its just a game" mentality and it was unfortunate nothing will ever be done to enforce that "roleplay quality standards" telanir harped on about all those years ago.

 

also I (HATE!!!!) werewolf and even he made some solid points.

[Tav 4336]

tbh just thinking of guard rp annoys tf out of me. they either do too damn much and do main character syndrome roleplay, or do too damn little and don't roleplay at all and just opt to oocly command people to do stuff irply

[kuebiko 684]

3 hours ago, indiana105 said:

the natural response of a medieval-ish human to seeing a “demon” should be to throw rocks at it until it stops moving or run away 

 

but what I usually see is just:

 

 “they’re so misunderstood… actually, hmph… they’re kinda like us. just more twisted and f*cked up…” 

 

why? idk. pls everyone just go back to larping game of thrones this dnd slop is too much 

have you considered playing a vampire. humans hate vampires, you will get your desired 'throw rocks until it dies' roleplay i promise. even though arguably if there was a tragic/sympathetic villain it'd be the vampire given they are just cursed people 

fighting demons is way harder than fighting vampires so it seems people are less inclined to fight the demon.

[Unwillingly 18096]

1 hour ago, kuebiko said:

have you considered playing a vampire. humans hate vampires, you will get your desired 'throw rocks until it dies' roleplay i promise. even though arguably if there was a tragic/sympathetic villain it'd be the vampire given they are just cursed people 

fighting demons is way harder than fighting vampires so it seems people are less inclined to fight the demon.

people pull the "he's just misunderstood don't kill him" bit for corcitura too make no mistake lol

the point with demons isn't that they're a stronger enemy than vampires, it's that people will be reluctant to eliminate darkspawn or threats as long as they contribute to /realms activity. if it's not a desire for activity, it's just the same niche of watered down DND rp where people play nauseatingly liberal characters who sympathize with creatures from Actual Hell (which I acknowledge is a personal preference in how one wants to RP their character but I still think it's worthy of critique)

it's why I liked when cursed children were banished from canonist realms, it was such a fresh of breath air (and makes sense from an RP perspective imo!!!!!!!!!!!)

there's a broader conversation to be had around this though on a better forum post

[sapphic_spidy 1089]

hues?? HUES??? 

 

i like eyebrow movement sometimes for characters where that is their only real way of expression outside of dialogue, or a tell for when dialogue isn't how they feel. specifically furrowing brow when upset about something, or using raising brows to communicate when a character is otherwise staying quiet. just,,, don't overdo it, and it's a genuine body language thing

 

i like maw when its being used in a horror context. when i think of a maw opening i imagine rows of razor sharp teeth. but your normal ordinary mouth isnt a maw... 

Edited November 4, 2024 by sapphic_spidy