sapphic_spidy 155 Share Posted March 2 (edited) On 2/29/2024 at 4:56 PM, satinkira said: It’s basically an informal rule, where the only holdout is homophobia for some reason – we don’t permit real-world racism, but we permit homophobia. This is such a good point that I hadn't even considered. I completely agree with banning homophobia rp. There's nothing i can say that hasn't been said already, and I know that anything I say will just get me mocked in the Minitz discord again! But the point is that... that's true. Yes fantasy racism exists IRP but it's not the same as actual real life racism. Beyond that I just think that there's a reason people don't like hearing the same harmful narratives they hear in their daily lives from their families and government nearly word for word in Silly Block Game. The point of it being uncreative is so true too! And I know that a lot of the homophobia rpers are the same ones who aren't fond of magical or alchemical roleplay, so the points about realism won't matter much to them, but it rings true as well. I have a lot of thoughts on this but it's late and I doubt people will read this far down anyways. Thank you for saying this. As a lesbian, I really do not want to hear the same homophobic sentiments I heard from my entire extended family on an almost daily basis in LOTC. It [edit: homophobia rp] doesn't add anything and will only have negatives. It will only upset players. It will not make for good RP. Edited March 2 by sapphic_spidy corrected word 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solour 366 Share Posted March 2 IM FROM BUENOS AIRES AND I SAY KEEP HOMOPHOBIA 21 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seuss 491 Share Posted March 2 It's not homophobia since I'm not scared of them. t(-u-t) 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam33497 2793 Share Posted March 2 @wowjthought you might need some help with this one 2 hours ago, Crevel said: I think it is interesting that we would not need to have these discussions if players did not feel the need to use Minecraft as an outlet to pursue romance and sexual-themed roleplay. Nobody is forcing people to play womanisers. Nobody is forcing people to play adulterers. Nobody is forcing people to play gay characters where the inherent implication is the focus on romance and/or sex as an identity as opposed to the biological reproductive function that heterosexuals must exist for to justify babies being born. Ideally, romance and sexual roleplay-themed roleplay should not be something that is pursued, but something largely implied. Regardless, these people are making the conscious OOC choice to put these characters into a roleplay setting. Then some of them have the gall to complain OOC, oftentimes because these sorts of characters are self-inserts to some degree, that the roleplay setting does not suit the character they want to play. My Brother in Christ, you are making the choice to play this character in this setting. If you do not like the roleplay environment, try to change it through roleplay or play a different character. I am not going to go to Haelunor with a character that is antithetical to their values as a nation and then complain when they decide to kill me for gravely insulting them and their culture. To address some recent comments made in this thread: 1. Whether something is inherently bad is subjective, both OOCly and RPly. The thoughts of someone being gruesomely crucified for instance is something that is perceived as something barbaric in modern standards due to it being a torturous punishment. However, in roleplay it is a lesser used but still relatively accepted form of execution. The same can be said for lynching, being burnt alive, and other similar methods. It is upsetting to hear of someone being burnt to death in real life, but there is a disconnect in perception of death between real life and a fictional medium like LOTC. While that obviously pertains to death, the same can be said for general discrimination. Calling someone a "midget" in real life is heavily frowned upon due to our modern standards, however it is a common slur to use against halflings and dwarves. It can be an upsetting word when used for genuine discrimination, but when used in a fictional context, the intent is not the same and is used for narrative value. Homosexual relationships are not inherently good on LOTC. Elves are intended to be largely infertile which is in part alleviated by their longer lifespans, however there is still no guarantee in roleplay that an elf may be lucky enough to have a child when they want or need one. To remedy this, homosexuality is frowned upon or even discriminated against by some because they are individually contributing to the dooming their race and family by not reproducing from a roleplay perspective. Similarly, known promiscuity in the hopes to conceive would in roleplay likely be frowned upon as well by other races as well due to it being a foreign concept and against their own beliefs. For humans, their shorter lifespans may also encourage some individuals to believe that it is their prerogative to discourage homosexuality to ensure that their noble ambitions may be met by having children for political purposes for instance. The point being is that there are roleplay justifications unique to the fictional medium that cannot be found in real life modern circumstances that affect mindsets on how someone should act towards a certain behaviour or concept. Themes that may be upsetting for some in real life does not mean that it should be banned and otherwise removed in a fictional setting so that it cannot be explored. If we banned every book that had content some people found upsetting, we would be banning literary classics like Harry Potter with the varied allegations of racism and satanic themes, or Lord of the Rings for its orcs supposedly being designed in a racist manner, despite both being widely acclaimed. If you do not like the content, do not engage with it. 2. It is not homophobic. Homophobia is a purposeful or implicit dislike towards homosexual people. A marriage between a man and a woman in Canonism is based on the model of the first coupling (who birthed the Four Sons: Horen, Urguan, Malin, Krug) as well as Horen and Julia. Any sexual encounter outside of the holy union is seen as sinful due to the sinner being seen as a "creature of worldly indulgence". This mainly covers pre-marital sexual intimacy and adultery due to the taking of concubines that inhibited virtue as with Harren in the Scrolls. However, homosexual sex is also covered in this clause because it is, of course, done outside of the holy union. Homosexual romantic relationships themselves though are not sinful or illegal. Depending on the character and their zeal, they would either ignore it, frown upon it, or shun it due to it being seen as a prelude to sin. Nobody would be killed over it. This topic only really becomes an issue when the misconceptions that people draw of Canonism being a 1:1 replica of Christianity makes them assume constant discrimination against homosexuals is common. It is not. The Canonist Church, within the last couple years, has not cared and/or made any effort to pursue possible or known homosexuals in roleplay in order to get them to repent. You are more likely to find mistreatment from unknowledgeable players in nations trying to do religious roleplay who assume the Church would be antagonistic towards homosexuals. 3. As I said before, the Church itself as an institution does not care about this. Whoever told you this is likely misinformed. The only nation that I know of that has made any actual attempt to outlaw homosexuality was Haense and it was only designed to combat issues of nobles being adulterers without leaving heirs to inherit their estates from my understanding. Again, I'd like to bring up what I mentioned in my opening paragraphs. You have deliberately chosen to make this an overarching theme for your characters. This is not something that you are being forced to do. I believe that I have briefly been in a few VC with you before years ago (mayhaps I am confusing you with someone else), but it seems you have choose to pursue these experiences purely because it is a reflection of how you are in real life. They are self-inserts in this regard, and that is likely why you feel guilty about the hardships placed on your character. These characters deliberately go against the status quo in many cases, and that is something that other characters will justifiably act against in some cases when you are being blatantly different. That is how homogenous societies work. You may find more enjoyability with characters that have varied personalities and traits that fit within the frameworks of what is normally considered acceptable by most roleplay communities instead of repeatedly playing, as you say, characters that have "all been queer in some form or another". You will generally find more enjoyment in characters that aren't self-inserts. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeusVult 564 Share Posted March 2 What homophobic roleplay? I've never in my 6 years on this server have I seen a homophobic encounter. Not in Elf nations, not in Canonist nations, and I've not seen anything in Haelun'or. I've definitely seen my fair share of gay relationships, out in the wild in elvish and canonist nations (balian). Where, they of course, are there and left alone. Anecdotal evidence, sure, but as the premier prejudiced roleplayer on the server I would know if LGBTQ+ people are attacked, because I would be there. Point being that I am racist and homophobic out of character so I would jump at any reason to bring it IC Trolling aside Crevel is a genius I agree with everything he said 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hemomancy 2850 Share Posted March 2 I fr don't know what's happening but I've never personally experienced homophobia rp with my gay characters. Some sexism from the humans sure, but nobody's ever gone off 'cause they see my women with other women irply. (and because it must be said, hnor is not full of nazi's lmao yall reaching) 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MailC3p 1159 Share Posted March 2 Bro I love reading Satinkira's bi-monthly post to get clout and rep farm and then going through the comments and seeing "Yeah, but Haelun'or Nazi's" as if we've done anything in the past few years to provoke such a response. Right now Hnor is literally the most accepting it has ever been and yet a post that has nothing to do with us somehow gets dragged to us, this is why I don't go onto the forums man I just wanna sit around and do my RP, I don't care about all this, just lemme be an isolationist both IRPly and OOCly, k, thanks. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willstertheking2 1101 Share Posted March 2 @Nooblius I think we should rewrite the Brathmordakin to introduce more... dynamic roleplay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
creamynoteblock 2426 Share Posted March 2 let's get to 200 replies team! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asutto 1990 Share Posted March 2 Shoutout to all the forum warriors out there who sacrificed their sanity and sleep schedule to debate about why we should/shouldn't allow fake homophobia while knowing damn well nothing on this thread is gonna change anything 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wowj 2812 Share Posted March 2 3 hours ago, sam33497 said: @wowjthought you might need some help with this one Family guy funny moments also works 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
satinkira 5902 Author Share Posted March 2 26 minutes ago, wowj said: Family guy funny moments also works 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow1770 248 Share Posted March 2 Very good post. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amayonnaise 1535 Share Posted March 2 8 hours ago, Asutto said: Shoutout to all the forum warriors out there who sacrificed their sanity and sleep schedule to debate about why we should/shouldn't allow fake homophobia while knowing damn well nothing on this thread is gonna change anything Every time, I read comments and go "Nah I'm not gonna comment".. But I can't help myself. God please, someone give me an intervention. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rukio 8910 Share Posted March 2 15 hours ago, Crevel said: Excellent crevel take 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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